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Old 11-28-2012, 01:33 AM   #1
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Help me understand camber..

newbie, learning here. So if I understand correctly having more camber will help the car steer (or maintain front end traction better)?

I saw the camber plate from Pedders and rather than clog up that thread I figured I'd start this one. Using this camber plate device one could increase (or at least change - if not increase) the setting for track use by turning a few bolts. Then after a track run, adjust it back and be back into DD specs?

Is the amount of camber desired speed based? For example, would you want the same increase for a small parking lot based autocross that you would on a major high speed course?

Camber is what accounts for the wheel looking like it is tilted inwards, correct? So at high speeds (or with sharp turns?) as the suspension moves it will actually help the wheel get more contact area?

Last edited by IPT; 11-28-2012 at 03:09 AM.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:21 AM   #2
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Your last statement about sharp turns is absolutely correct. When the top of the tire tilts in that is considered negative camber. Dialing in extra negative camber helps counteract tire roll while cornering, ensuring that the maximum amount of tread remains in contact with the roads surface. The more aggressive you drive, the more negative camber you can use. There are lots of other factors that contribute to this as well and you could write an entire book on the subject but this is the basic reason for running negative camber.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:32 AM   #3
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Yes, negative camber increases grip through the twists, but will decrease acceleration. For acceleration, you want 0 camber, or slightly positive to account for suspension squat during launch.
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Old 11-28-2012, 10:23 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT View Post
newbie, learning here. So if I understand correctly having more camber will help the car steer (or maintain front end traction better)?
Yes.

Quote:
I saw the camber plate from Pedders and rather than clog up that thread I figured I'd start this one. Using this camber plate device one could increase (or at least change - if not increase) the setting for track use by turning a few bolts. Then after a track run, adjust it back and be back into DD specs?
Been there, done that (albeit with a shim-aligned suspension arrangement). Here's a little of what's involved.

Be aware that toe will also shift slightly as you adjust camber. If the car is "front-steer" (steering rack ahead of the front axle line), at least the toe change will be toward toe-out (which is good for turn-in at autocross but might get a bit twitchy at higher speeds out on a big track). Sometimes, it is possible to set your daily-drive toe a little more "in" on order to keep your competition toe from going too far "out" .or having to tweak toe as well as camber twice per event.

Come up with as dead-nuts repeatable method of setting your positions. Otherwise after a couple of back-and-forth setting swaps you might not know what you do have any more. I'd prefer some sort of "go/no-go" gaga block approach over any method that forces you to read a measuring device. This does assume that you carefully measured both your DD alignment settings and your competition alignment settings while you were coming up with your repeatable method for swapping between them.



Quote:
Is the amount of camber desired speed based? For example, would you want the same increase for a small parking lot based autocross that you would on a major high speed course?

Camber is what accounts for the wheel looking like it is tilted inwards, correct? So at high speeds (or with sharp turns?) as the suspension moves it will actually help the wheel get more contact area?
I'll say that the desired amount of camber at any given lateral g's is slightly dependent on your speed, but probably not in the way you might think. At lower speeds, the turns are by definition tighter, and as you steer the front tires further away from straight ahead, the greater the effect of your caster setting rolling into a small (and favorable) camber change.

Negative camber is used to counteract the combined effects of body roll (which is in the "wrong" direction) and something called "camber gain" (the change in camber that would occur if you moved the chassis/body of the car purely vertically up/down). Camber gain is usually in the "right" direction, but this "good" effect becomes less the more you lower your car with lowering springs.

With most tires, you want to still have just a tiny bit of negative camber on the outside front tire at your maximum cornering g's - NOT zero-point-zero degrees as is commonly assumed. About the camber on the inside front, it'll be a lot wrong, but there isn't anything you can do about that unless all of your turns are in the same direction (a la circle track and oval racing).

It's been mentioned that increasing the amount of negative camber to improve cornering adversely affects front braking. You need to balance these conflicting requirements, and this gets influenced (perhaps simplified) by installing stiffer front springs.


There's this one other thing - the rear wheel camber situation. If you improve the front camber for front tire grip in the corners enough without addressing the rear, you'll end up with a car that'll be tail-happy at the limit. Possibly beyond your ability to "catch". So you'd want to keep this in mind, and know that setting rear camber on this chassis without screwing up the toe is more involved than setting front camber.


Chassis and suspension is a complex topic. Fascinating, but there's a huge amount of it.

My advice - don't be afraid to tinker with it, but don't get carried away with a "some's good, more's better, and too much is just enough" mentality when you do.


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Old 11-28-2012, 10:58 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm Peterson View Post
Chassis and suspension is a complex topic. Fascinating, but there's a huge amount of it.

My advice - don't be afraid to tinker with it, but don't get carried away with a "some's good, more's better, and too much is just enough" mentality when you do.


Norm
Well said, Norm. Always like reading your posts!
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:02 AM   #6
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The amount of front wheel camber that is desirable for driving will depend on how you are driving, the vehicle you re driving, tires you are using and the track you are running and more.

The easy answer for a 5the Gen Camaro is that wants an agressive front end alignment at the track, but a tire friendly alignment to get to and from the track is Pedders new Dual Bearing Camber Plate kit. Lets say we do a street alignment that looks like this.

Front Camber -1.00
Toe 0.00
Caster No Factory Adjustment

Rear Camber -0.50
Rear Toe IN 0.11 Per Wheel
Total Toe IN 0.22

The steering will feel on center and you get decent tire life. When you go to the track you use your Pedders Dual Bearing Camber Plates to add -1.5 degrees of front camber to your 5th Gen for a total of -2.5. You now have an excellant front camber spec for AC or RC use.

What about the Front Toe? The front went Toe OUT about 0.25 degrees. Your turn is is much sharper and you are now running an aggressive track alignment.

At the end of the day, slide the camber plate back to your starting marked point and drive home with a tire friendly street alignment.

Check out the V8 Supercars. They are on slicks and are race cars. Got Camber?



But you get the idea.
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:51 AM   #7
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Those new camber plates are intriguing.

I can see them being entirely compatible with some gage blocks custom-made by the car owner to his individual specs if he's equipped to do that sort of thing at all.


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Old 11-28-2012, 11:54 AM   #8
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Those new camber plates are intriguing.

I can see them being entirely compatible with some gage blocks custom-made by the car owner to his individual specs if he's equipped to do that sort of thing at all.


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Old 11-28-2012, 01:51 PM   #9
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I need a set of these!!!! Next Friday i should be driving again!
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Old 11-28-2012, 02:17 PM   #10
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I need a set of these!!!! Next Friday i should be driving again!
I'll add it to your list.
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Old 11-28-2012, 02:50 PM   #11
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http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=263119

I just posted this in this forum it tells you how all of the suspension works...toe, camber, and caster
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Old 12-14-2012, 12:22 AM   #12
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Pete can you expain to this newbie what I am seeing in that video? To me it just looks like a shaft spinning...I thought I would see the 4 bolts being loosened to allow you to slide the upper arm inwards or outwards affecting the angle of the suspension below (camber?).
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Old 12-14-2012, 05:56 AM   #13
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Look for the shaft to "wobble" slightly as it rotates, which also happens under the combination of steering plus suspension bump/rebound movement. It's a little clearer on the passenger side.


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Old 12-14-2012, 12:06 PM   #14
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Old 12-14-2012, 07:03 PM   #15
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ah, much clearer. That's pretty cool. Any images of how it changes the wheel itself?

Is this something that should be done once a susension is setup already, or would you/should do it all at once when initally upgrading from factory to aftermarket (ie. Pace Car Package)?
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Old 12-14-2012, 08:11 PM   #16
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ah, much clearer. That's pretty cool. Any images of how it changes the wheel itself?

Is this something that should be done once a susension is setup already, or would you/should do it all at once when initally upgrading from factory to aftermarket (ie. Pace Car Package)?
Yep. Last picture in this detailed post. It is a HUGE difference.

You can add the camber plates at anytime. Having said that, it makes perfect sense to add them at the same time as the Pace Car Package.

We started by machining one of our made for Saleen camber plates.



Which became this.



Then this.





Now we are in final production ready form.





Pedders 2010 on Dual Bearing Camber Plates
  • 18mm Thick Plate for STRENGTH
  • Dual Bearing for SMOOTH Operation
  • Indexed for EASY and REPEATABLE Trackside Adjustment
  • Additional -1.9 degrees of camber
  • Hard Mounted to Prevent the Adjustment from Drifting
  • Improves Steering Angle Inclination (SAI)
  • Complete Replacement for the OEM Strut Mount and Bearing
  • Banded Thrust Bearing for Smooth Steering
  • Monoball for Strut Articulation
  • Fits ALL Brands of 5th Gen Coilovers




Installation is Straight Forward

1. Remove the coilovers or OE struts and springs to be replaced with coilovers.

2. Stretch a sting fender to fender the splits the strut tower hole in half and tape securely to the fender. Measure twice so you drill only once.




3. Center the Camber plate with the string splitting the bottom hole and the Center Line Mark at the opposite end of the plate.




4. Secure the plate. Use a center punch and hammer to mark the holes.



5. Drill the holes.



6. Align and insert the coilover / camber late assembly and tighten the nuts.





Adjusting camber is cake. Raise th car with a floor jack to take the load off the plate. Loosen the four cap screws and slide to the desired position. Tighten the screws.



Adjusted for an additional -1.9 Degrees of Camber the screws are close to covered up, but you can reach them. I suspect the heavy track and autocross users will relive the OE strut hole for easier access to those screws.
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Old 12-15-2012, 09:33 AM   #17
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Those are really nice looking parts, Pete.

I do have one very autocross-specific comment, however.

Quote:
Adjusted for an additional -1.9 Degrees of Camber the screws are close to covered up, but you can reach them. I suspect the heavy track and autocross users will relive the OE strut hole for easier access to those screws.
Autocross guys running under SCCA or other organizations that have "borrowed" the SCCA car classification scheme will need to keep in mind what's legal for the class they want to run in. IIRC, as soon as you modify the center hole for any reason, you go straight to C-Prepared running against dedicated "race cars" on non-DOT slicks. The camber plates alone will bump you up out of the "Stock" category.

That said, there's no harm in running in Street Touring or higher as a newbie, but you're better off knowing this going in than finding out at the event itself. Or afterward, if you were to get protested and re-classed (I've been there, sort of, a long time ago when my original class was incorrectly entered by the person from a different car club handling registration). At this point, I'll just make the mods I want for the rest of my driving, let the autocross class fall wherever it may, and just go have fun.

Optima Challenge events, autocrosses at marque gatherings, and events put on by some other autocross organizations aren't as fussy about mechanical mods like that.


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Old 12-15-2012, 12:06 PM   #18
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As always, another spot on post from Norm who is coming to C5FEST

OUSCI is like outlaw racing run whatcha brung. There is only one class. There are some safety requirements that take a hard line on as well as tire tread wear racing. I think that approach to the rules has made it very attractive. Dream it. Build it. Run it.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:25 PM   #19
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But... all the roads between town & my house are twisty, and I'm nothing if not aggressive in the turns.

I guess I'll just have to buy new tires pretty often.

Seriously though, another winning idea/product.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:42 PM   #20
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Those are really nice looking parts, Pete.

I do have one very autocross-specific comment, however.


Autocross guys running under SCCA or other organizations that have "borrowed" the SCCA car classification scheme will need to keep in mind what's legal for the class they want to run in. IIRC, as soon as you modify the center hole for any reason, you go straight to C-Prepared running against dedicated "race cars" on non-DOT slicks. The camber plates alone will bump you up out of the "Stock" category.

That said, there's no harm in running in Street Touring or higher as a newbie, but you're better off knowing this going in than finding out at the event itself. Or afterward, if you were to get protested and re-classed (I've been there, sort of, a long time ago when my original class was incorrectly entered by the person from a different car club handling registration). At this point, I'll just make the mods I want for the rest of my driving, let the autocross class fall wherever it may, and just go have fun.

Optima Challenge events, autocrosses at marque gatherings, and events put on by some other autocross organizations aren't as fussy about mechanical mods like that.


Norm
This is the thing that bothers me most about the SCCA, something as simple as an intake will bump you to Street Prepared, where, in my region anyway, there are some demonic cars waiting to rip a newbie to shreds. I LOVE drooling all over these shiny new parts Pete keeps showing us, but the only thing I can add and stay in "F" Stock is a sway bar. Guess I'll just save my money for another year or two, lol.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:29 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT View Post
newbie, learning here. So if I understand correctly having more camber will help the car steer (or maintain front end traction better)?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm Peterson View Post
I'll say that the desired amount of camber at any given lateral g's is slightly dependent on your speed, but probably not in the way you might think. At lower speeds, the turns are by definition tighter, and as you steer the front tires further away from straight ahead, the greater the effect of your caster setting rolling into a small (and favorable) camber change.

.....

Chassis and suspension is a complex topic. Fascinating, but there's a huge amount of it.

My advice - don't be afraid to tinker with it, but don't get carried away with a "some's good, more's better, and too much is just enough" mentality when you do.

Norm
Norm has some great comments here and we will echo them. Especially his last advice about not getting carried away.

To truly take advantage of camber for additional grip, you really need to have whats referred to as the "camber curve" of the suspension as well as the "camber curve" of the tire. Different types of suspension designs come with advantages/disadvantages of both. A SLA or "Short long arm" suspension typically has a more advantageous camber curve, which sees a good amount of camber gain during body roll, but not excessive. A strut based suspension the the front of the 5th Gen Camaro is a little less desirable from this aspect, as the camber curve is typically very high and can result in too much dynamic change and overloading the tires, ultimately making it hard to set up static Camber values.

The tires are the same way, each tire has different characteristics that produce their highest levels of lateral grip at X degress of camber, and then it drops off drastically from there. There is something even more important in this equation that is called "Slip Angle", and will also create different lateral grip values. That is a little beyond the scope of your question though. But understanding all of this is why all real race teams either do this testing themselves (if you have a giant budget ) at a facility like Calspan Tire Reseach Facility in upstate NY, or they have this data give to them by the manufacturer. I have spent some time with this myself at Calspan and I'll tell you it is actually really fascinating.

We want to be pretty clear here and not just come in and sell people parts they don't need. What other people won't tell you is that you can actually achieve a LOT of negative camber by using the factory adjustment. The actual number depends on the ride height you are at. But it will be over 2 full degrees which is more than anyone will actually need for all of street use and most race use. Both SCCA World Challenge Camaro teams run Pfadt Camber/Caster plates because to take advantage of the spec tires in that series, they need to run OVER what the factory adjustment allows them to. Plus, all Camaro race cars need additional Caster for competition. I won't explain the benefits of Caster in detail here, because you did not ask for them. But in short, Caster increases straight line stability, and will give you dynamic camber gain without having to worry about adverse tire wear directly or the disadvantages of static camber during braking. Caster is not adjustable from the factory, and if it isn't set to the same value left to right, it will create undesirable handling effects.


With that said, we are the first to address Camber AND Caster optimization via an adjustable kit we introduced in 2010 and I want to give a little background on this product's design and intent.

The OEM upper strut mounts on the front suspension of the new Camaro are not designed to allow articulation of the spring and damper together as one collinear assembly. Because of this, a bending moment in the shock is introduced when the front suspension goes into bump or rebound, which isn't the most ideal of situations. The OEM mount allows for this deflection by using soft rubber to isolate the assembly. This will wear out of course, like any soft rubber bushing.

As the ONLY total solution to this, Pfadt Race Engineering has engineered a complete system that not only allows the collinear articulation of your front suspension springs and dampers, but ALSO allows for you to quickly and accurately change front camber and caster, without having to remove the front wheels. Caster is NOT adjustable from the factory and you can stand to gain a lot of performance by increasing Caster. This is what you need for your front suspension, whether you have OEM front struts and drop springs (ours or anyone else's), or Coilovers. Our coilovers address this in the rear as well, no competitor's units do.

This is the only solution for people who track their car occasionally, be it autocross or road racing, or are worried about tire wear when using a "performance alignment." This kit accommodates extra degrees of negative camber in the front suspension. This is a must for everyone interested in getting the most performance out of their Camaro alignment and tires. The Pfadt Camber/Caster Kit mounts in the factory location with no modification necessary to the strut tower. NO DRILLING! The completed package is the best strut mounting solution for the 2010 Camaro available, and is available in for multiple spring sizes, be it OEM or racing springs. Just let us know what you have.

Pfadt 2010 on Full Camber/Caster adjustment Kit

-Simple and straightforward adjustment for CASTER and CAMBER
-up to 2 additional degrees of Caster and Camber, based on your configuration
-Engineered for the 5th Gen Camaros, not adapted from another vehicle product
-Available for ALL COILOVER SPRINGS and OEM Springs and LOWERING Springs
-High Strength and lightweight aluminum contraction
-High articulation friction-free spherical bearings
-Durability tested on our in-house coilover destroyer and multiple SCCA World Challenge Race teams




Take a look below and let us know what you think! Let me know if you have any questions on this.
Camaro5 Classifieds Thread

In addition, here is a quick sheet showing you the recommended Camber values for different uses with different tires and parts. Ask questions if needed, that is what we are here for:







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Old 12-15-2012, 03:05 PM   #22
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It is all in the Book of 5th Gen and has been for years.


Bush Timing, Alignment and Torque Specs


Do NOT use camber adjusting offset bolts on the Camaro



If you want to put them on your Honda or Subie it is up to you. They are not as strong as the OEM clevis bolts and are absolutely necessary on a 5th Gen Camaro. It is in the

This is the correct way to adjust front camber on the 5th Gen. One the alignment machine with the clevis bolts loose turning the camber screw tighter (Righty Tighty, Lefty Loosy) will push the knuckle away from the strut. Loosening the camber screw allows the knuckle to fall in toward the strut.



Your alignment shop may have a T.O.M.C.A.T. Air-Assisted Multiple Camber Adjustment Tool air bag. It fits between the wheel and the strut and works in the same way as the camber screw. Inflate (Righty Tighty) the bag to push the knuckle away from the strut or deflate (lefty Loosy) the bag to allow the knuckle to fall into the strut. If they don't, they have a guy that can push or pull on the wheel while they tighten it. Never, ever use those lame camber eccentric bolts on a Camaro. EVER!



Anyone that tells you different, have them call me

Pedders foundation as a company is more than just a range of bits, we are Suspension specialists committed to delivering a Pedders Driving Experience. A lowered vehicle should have a full range of alignment adjustments. The Camaro delivers from Chevrolet with a fixed Castor position. The radius arm bolts into round holes with no available adjustment. Front Camber is adjustable from the factory. There is a threaded hole for front Camber Adjustment Bolt / Screw, but no bolt is installed and no part number is listed by Chevrolet. The rear OEM eccentric adjusters for Toe and Camber provide approximately one degree adjustment range. For an alignment specialist, this is unacceptable. You want to get your Camaro perfectly setup. This is what Pedders is all about. Our solution is a set of cadmium plated eXtreme Alignment Bolts. While GM made the hole round for the front Castor Adjustment or lack thereof, they did weld in brackets for an eccentric to work against. Your local Pedders Dealer can create a slot to provide Castor adjustment with Pedders Camaro Alignment Bolts. The kit provides the front Camber screws that GM didn't.



For the Camaro GM decided to produce the front sub-frame with only a single non-adjustable round hole precluding any form of adjustment. For a performance driver a vehicle without full alignment adjustment capability it feel like driving with one hand tied behind your back. Pedders made the decision to make the Camaro front suspension fully adjustable. We will be releasing the Castor Eccentrics for the G8 next week.

Step one requires the technician to drill two holes in the bracket.



Step two requires CAREFUL GRINDING. We use the two holes to make the grinding process more accurate while the technician creates a slot. The eccentric that will be used does not reach all the way to the bracket sides so a bit of excess metal is not an issue. The technician can check the clearance with a Pedders Castor Eccentric Bolt as they grind to make sure the fit is Pedders Perfect.



When assembled the Cadmium plated eccentric allows the alignment technician to increase or decrease Castor. A fully Pedderised Camaro with good tires will not require ANY BIAS in the alignment. We can do a road course style alignment and your Camaro will not pull. This is because the Pedders component have made the suspension more stable by reducing excess motion. Should your Camaro be tweaked and develop a pull the same Pedders Castor Eccentric Bolts can be used to create a bias to correct the pull. We strongly recommend that before you alter your alignment due to a pull that you have a qualified technician, because the machine is only as good as the tech, check your tires on a road force balance machine to make certain the pull is not induced by a tire. We will adjust them on the alignment rack. Here is the installed eccentric.



Alignments are Pedders core business so we decided to make the front camber screw part of the Camaro Alignment Bolt Kit. To install the Pedders Front Camber Screw it is essential that you use LocTite Blue. The Camber screw will never bear a load while driving, but we want to make certain they never vibrate out. LocTite Blue is ideal for this.



Pedders Rear Eccentrics are virtually bullet proof with approximately 2 degrees or double the factory adjustment. With the Camaro alignment Kit installed your Camaro can be setup for the drag strip, road course, auto cross or every day flawless driving. Even better, Pedders alignment eccentric bolts carry a unique warranty feature. Should a Pedders eccentric ever fail while you own the vehicle we will replace it. You get a superior alignment, improved driving experience and a life time warranty with Pedders Camaro Alignment Bolt kits.

To get the aggressive alignment we prefer Pedders Full Camaro Alignment Kit is required. They increase the adjustment range by 1 degree or in layman's terms a lot. We achieve this result my moving the eccentric to the outer edge of the bolt. The eccentrics are cut on a water jet, assembled in a jig and welded. This is a time consuming process. To finish the bolts we have them cadmium plated.



Eccentrics have a bad habit of drifting under high loads. We address that with more material. We make our eccentrics out of stock that is much thicker than the OEM bolts. More material means more strength and improved holding power.




We use a thick 'holding' nut and a thin jam nut. Unlike quenched nuts, you can use these again and again.


FE4 / FE5 / ZL1 / Pedderised Track Alignment

Front
Caster: Max it out with Pedders Caster Eccentrics
Camber: -2.5 Do NOT run a strut tower bar, let the car work for you in the turns. If you have one, take it off
Toe: OUT 0.50
Total Toe OUT 1.00

Rear
Camber -0.80
Toe: IN .20

Pedders Full Camaro Alignment Kit is required.

Bush Timing

Step 1. Lift the car on a two post lift and raise it.

Step 2. Loosen the following bolts/nuts:
Front:
---Inner Control Arm Bushing
---Inner Radius Rod
Rear:
---Trailing Arm Bushings (both ends)
---Toe Rod Bushings (both ends)
---Lower Control Arm Bushings (Inner)
---Upper Control Arm Bushings (Rearward)
---Lower Strut Bushings

Step 3.
Lower the car and drive it around the parking lot SLOWLY and on to the alignment lift.

Step 4.
With the weight of the car on the wheels tighten all of the nuts/bolts to spec.

Step 5.
Align the car at the new ride height.

Alignment




Front and Rear Bolt Torque Values




NOTE: Torque specifications that read XX torque value and XX degrees are usually TTY and require replacement of the bolt, nut or both. If replacement parts are not available from GM the minimum acceptable torque will be those values stated along with a liberal application of a thread locker i.e. LocTite.

PEDDERS BOOK of 5th GEN

Pedders 2010 Chevrolet Camaro Suspension Evaluation

Foundational 5th Gen Required Upgrades

Lowering Coils and Coilovers

Trouble Free, OEM Quiet V6 Lowering

Sway Bars

Suspension Bushes

ZL1 / CTS-V Brake Upgrade for the SS

Wheels and Tires

Bush Timing, Alignment and Torque Specs

Pedders USA Camaro 2.0

Lingenfelter L/28 Tech

5th Gen Wheel Hop and Drag Race Setup

Thermal Management

Running Changes Made to the 5th Gen by Chevrolet

Public Track Test #1

Public Track Test #2 Camaro vs. Mustang Supercar Shootout
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Last edited by JusticePete; 12-15-2012 at 03:19 PM.
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:47 AM   #23
IPT

 
Drives: '02 Trailblazer, '12 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: AK
Posts: 780
hmm, now that is a lot of information!! I'll have to read that about 10 more times, Sort of seems like you guys are saying the same thing (almost), but going about it differently.

Maybe Norm or someone only slight biased (or unbiased) to either of these companies can chime in and dichper, or pro and con these two approaches and philosophies? One thing obvious to me right now after my preliminary read is Pedders requires drilling and PFadt does not.
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Old 12-16-2012, 01:34 AM   #24
JusticePete
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Drives: Camaro Justice
Join Date: Jun 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IPT View Post
hmm, now that is a lot of information!! I'll have to read that about 10 more times, Sort of seems like you guys are saying the same thing (almost), but going about it differently.

Maybe Norm or someone only slight biased (or unbiased) to either of these companies can chime in and dichper, or pro and con these two approaches and philosophies? One thing obvious to me right now after my preliminary read is Pedders requires drilling and PFadt does not.
How is this for unbiased?

Pedders Camber Plates with Dual Bearings (banded thrust washer and a monoball) and 1.9 degrees of additional camber, clearly indexed for repeatable adjustment, hard mounted for durability , drift free operation and an 18mm thick plate that will not bend.
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Old 12-16-2012, 02:01 PM   #25
IPT

 
Drives: '02 Trailblazer, '12 Camaro 2SS/RS
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: AK
Posts: 780
Well I sure hope that mods do not tangle with this thread! There has been no bashing and a lot of information presented.
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