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Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics Discussions related to the 5th gen Camaro Z/28 model

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Old 02-07-2013, 09:49 PM   #51
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A 5th gen Z/28 will happen, a 5th gen Z/28 won't happen, and still we see nothing in the form of a concrete answer either way from Chevrolet. I am quite frankly disappointed that this far into the 5th gen cycle that Chevy/GM has not made an effort to get a proper Z/28 out there. And I see a disappointing number of performance engines for selections now and in the future. Now I realize we'll never see the number of performance engines in a lineup that we had in the '60s, but surely they should be able to develop and commit to three good performance engines that would support an SS, Z/28 and ZL1. I may get surprised and a 5th gen Z/28 may show up yet, I might get surprised and find all three in the 6th gen when it arrives, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for either event to happen. I've been almost 100% GM since I started driving in the mid '60s, but these days like so many other companies GM is limiting their selections/lines and you either buy what little they offer or you look elsewhere. Call me a stick in the mud or a pessimist or what ever else you like, I'm not very hopeful of seeing solutions from Chevy/GM for the vehicle I'm looking for. And I am getting so I rarely post here because of those feelings. I still have a faint hope that they will change my mind, but that is very faint and would be a suprise if it happened.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:28 PM   #52
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Yes.
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That's Ford. They do things with the Mustang that Chevy doesn't do with the Camaro.
That is also true.
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Old 02-08-2013, 01:16 AM   #53
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A 5th gen Z/28 will happen, a 5th gen Z/28 won't happen, and still we see nothing in the form of a concrete answer either way from Chevrolet. I am quite frankly disappointed that this far into the 5th gen cycle that Chevy/GM has not made an effort to get a proper Z/28 out there. And I see a disappointing number of performance engines for selections now and in the future. Now I realize we'll never see the number of performance engines in a lineup that we had in the '60s, but surely they should be able to develop and commit to three good performance engines that would support an SS, Z/28 and ZL1. I may get surprised and a 5th gen Z/28 may show up yet, I might get surprised and find all three in the 6th gen when it arrives, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for either event to happen. I've been almost 100% GM since I started driving in the mid '60s, but these days like so many other companies GM is limiting their selections/lines and you either buy what little they offer or you look elsewhere. Call me a stick in the mud or a pessimist or what ever else you like, I'm not very hopeful of seeing solutions from Chevy/GM for the vehicle I'm looking for. And I am getting so I rarely post here because of those feelings. I still have a faint hope that they will change my mind, but that is very faint and would be a suprise if it happened.
Clyde
I don't have faith in GM to bring back the Z/28 well all want. The Camaro is an excellent car and I more than likely will end up buying a 1LE after I graduate but it still isn't the Z/28 we know they could build if they really wanted to.
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:46 PM   #54
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6QUOTE=wildpaws;6134852]A 5th gen Z/28 will happen, a 5th gen Z/28 won't happen, and still we see nothing in the form of a concrete answer either way from Chevrolet. I am quite frankly disappointed that this far into the 5th gen cycle that Chevy/GM has not made an effort to get a proper Z/28 out there. And I see a disappointing number of performance engines for selections now and in the future. Now I realize we'll never see the number of performance engines in a lineup that we had in the '60s, but surely they should be able to develop and commit to three good performance engines that would support an SS, Z/28 and ZL1. I may get surprised and a 5th gen Z/28 may show up yet, I might get surprised and find all three in the 6th gen when it arrives, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for either event to happen. I've been almost 100% GM since I started driving in the mid '60s, but these days like so many other companies GM is limiting their selections/lines and you either buy what little they offer or you look elsewhere. Call me a stick in the mud or a pessimist or what ever else you like, I'm not very hopeful of seeing solutions from Chevy/GM for the vehicle I'm looking for. And I am getting so I rarely post here because of those feelings. I still have a faint hope that they will change my mind, but that is very faint and would be a suprise if it happened.
Clyde[/QUOTE]
...the answer was already pinned down along time ago by a respectable member on the board when we were having this discussion. I have tried to keep the message alive. It's a business decision, not to take a risk or gamble upon the success of the ZL1 program. It would be like splitting stock IMHO, without the projection of sales enhancement or profit. It's internal competition, without any marketing that can claim one is top dog, and the other will be second....with a tight profit margine between high dollar models closely priced. The Z06 and ZR1 are seperated by much more of a price stratus and performance level, and that is a more tollerable environment for sales, not the Camaro's where both would be too close in performance and price.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:24 PM   #55
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6QUOTE=wildpaws;6134852]A 5th gen Z/28 will happen, a 5th gen Z/28 won't happen, and still we see nothing in the form of a concrete answer either way from Chevrolet. I am quite frankly disappointed that this far into the 5th gen cycle that Chevy/GM has not made an effort to get a proper Z/28 out there. And I see a disappointing number of performance engines for selections now and in the future. Now I realize we'll never see the number of performance engines in a lineup that we had in the '60s, but surely they should be able to develop and commit to three good performance engines that would support an SS, Z/28 and ZL1. I may get surprised and a 5th gen Z/28 may show up yet, I might get surprised and find all three in the 6th gen when it arrives, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for either event to happen. I've been almost 100% GM since I started driving in the mid '60s, but these days like so many other companies GM is limiting their selections/lines and you either buy what little they offer or you look elsewhere. Call me a stick in the mud or a pessimist or what ever else you like, I'm not very hopeful of seeing solutions from Chevy/GM for the vehicle I'm looking for. And I am getting so I rarely post here because of those feelings. I still have a faint hope that they will change my mind, but that is very faint and would be a suprise if it happened.
Clyde
...the answer was already pinned down along time ago by a respectable member on the board when we were having this discussion. I have tried to keep the message alive. It's a business decision, not to take a risk or gamble upon the success of the ZL1 program. It would be like splitting stock IMHO, without the projection of sales enhancement or profit. It's internal competition, without any marketing that can claim one is top dog, and the other will be second....with a tight profit margine between high dollar models closely priced. The Z06 and ZR1 are seperated by much more of a price stratus and performance level, and that is a more tollerable environment for sales, not the Camaro's where both would be too close in performance and price.[/QUOTE]

And that may very well be Chevy's mindset/business decision, yes it is their's to make, but that does not mean I have to be happy about it! Just as the music synthesizer market, the digital camera market, just about every market/product category you can think of, most large companies have today become simply purveyors of an endless sea of "me too" products with very limited choices and/or options. Can I change that? No absolutely not. Today if a product does not sell in anticipated numbers, for the most part there is little effort to change the product line in meaningful ways to be more in line with what consumers really want, it is simply cancelled and the next "latest, greatest" comes into the market place. And we in turn often compromise on what we really want and accept whatever offering is currently in the marketplace. And so it goes, endlessly on and on heading towards a sea of mediocrity. Is GM there yet? No, they have created some awesome vehicles in the last few years, the ZL1 Camaro, the Z06 and ZR1 Vettes, and the Cadillac CTS-V to name a few. Will they still create some great new vehicles? I'm certain they will, but at what price? Many of today's high performance vehicles cost more than my first new home was built for (two ZL1s today would pay off my latest house). My problem is two fold, a "proper" Z/28 built with the original heritage in mind and the fact that if they do build one it will not be a truly affordable (by my standards) performance vehicle. I'm not asking them to build one for $29,995 MSRP, but a more reasonable price in the low to mid $40k range would be ideal. Likely to happen? I don't think so, I think our marketplace, regulations, and cost of goods will prohibit that happening. More and more technology is being incorporated into products every year, technology costs money somewhere along the line (whether it be research, development, purchase, raw materials, whatever). Am I scolding GM/Chevy? No, not really, most companies are in some sort of similar situation. I think what it really is, is that I'm lamenting some of the modernization and changes in today's world.
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:19 PM   #56
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Who knows, maybe they will drop the LS9 into the ZL1 and bump up the price so there is room to fit an LS7 Z/28 into the line up. Or not...
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Old 02-08-2013, 10:24 PM   #57
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...and I agree with you my friend Clyde, but yet, as an individual, listening to the case presented as fact, I have to further my understanding and accept things for what they are..., and go beyond myself and see what the business projects as necessary to stay competitive in a global economy to thrive as it sees fit.
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:32 AM   #58
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A 5th gen Z/28 will happen, a 5th gen Z/28 won't happen, and still we see nothing in the form of a concrete answer either way from Chevrolet. I am quite frankly disappointed that this far into the 5th gen cycle that Chevy/GM has not made an effort to get a proper Z/28 out there. And I see a disappointing number of performance engines for selections now and in the future. Now I realize we'll never see the number of performance engines in a lineup that we had in the '60s, but surely they should be able to develop and commit to three good performance engines that would support an SS, Z/28 and ZL1. I may get surprised and a 5th gen Z/28 may show up yet, I might get surprised and find all three in the 6th gen when it arrives, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for either event to happen. I've been almost 100% GM since I started driving in the mid '60s, but these days like so many other companies GM is limiting their selections/lines and you either buy what little they offer or you look elsewhere. Call me a stick in the mud or a pessimist or what ever else you like, I'm not very hopeful of seeing solutions from Chevy/GM for the vehicle I'm looking for. And I am getting so I rarely post here because of those feelings. I still have a faint hope that they will change my mind, but that is very faint and would be a surprise if it happened.
Clyde

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Old 02-09-2013, 11:41 AM   #59
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Keep the faith. It will come and should be the best one ever.
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Old 02-09-2013, 01:41 PM   #60
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The business case would be to fill the gap in pricing as has been said all along. A price point in the mid $40's is doable and also a better reach for someone who would look to buy a mid to high $30's Camaro. Stretch your customers buying desires make them rationalize the jump. That is he came in for the...and talked himself into the...
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:08 PM   #61
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I want an LS7 Z/28 to be built pretty damn bad. It would make an awesome car but time is running out and we haven't heard any reliable noise at all. Nothing. Just some vin car from 2 months ago and that's it. We haven't seen any spy shots of a mysterious camo'd Camaro running around the Ring. If they are building a Z/28, they are doing a much better job hiding it than they did with the C7.
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:15 PM   #62
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I have heard some things from around town. I think it's in the plan. Total speculation on ,y part but I believe there is a real good chance.
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:35 PM   #63
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I have heard some things from around town. I think it's in the plan. Total speculation on ,y part but I believe there is a real good chance.
That's my issue is its all speculation.
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Old 02-09-2013, 08:06 PM   #64
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But my speculation is based on things I have heard from people that have some direct insights.
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:40 PM   #65
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But my speculation is based on things I have heard from people that have some direct insights.
What have you heard?
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:16 PM   #66
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It's coming.
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Old 02-10-2013, 04:02 AM   #67
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I am all in. Hope it comes in $45,999 base..
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Old 02-10-2013, 08:04 AM   #68
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I am all in. Hope it comes in $45,999 base..
I'm guessing that's going to be a pipe dream. I'm thinking somewhere north of $50K. I would bet close to the ZL1.
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Old 02-10-2013, 07:16 PM   #69
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I'm guessing that's going to be a pipe dream. I'm thinking somewhere north of $50K. I would bet close to the ZL1.
Which is why it probably won't happen. There's no point in having two versions of the same car that cost the same.
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Old 02-10-2013, 07:29 PM   #70
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Which is why it probably won't happen. There's no point in having two versions of the same car that cost the same.
They will not be the same car. One will be a high winding lighter weight track car with an NA engine. How is this the same as a ZL1? I would bet the new car could be $4k below the ZL1. Plenty of people wold buy it. Who knows, maybe they stop offering the ZL1.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:16 AM   #71
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They will not be the same car. One will be a high winding lighter weight track car with an NA engine. How is this the same as a ZL1? I would bet the new car could be $4k below the ZL1. Plenty of people wold buy it. Who knows, maybe they stop offering the ZL1.
I know they won't be the same car but if they are close in price, I doubt the Z/28 will be made. That's just my opinion.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:32 PM   #72
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I'm guessing that's going to be a pipe dream. I'm thinking somewhere north of $50K. I would bet close to the ZL1.
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Which is why it probably won't happen. There's no point in having two versions of the same car that cost the same.
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They will not be the same car. One will be a high winding lighter weight track car with an NA engine. How is this the same as a ZL1? I would bet the new car could be $4k below the ZL1. Plenty of people wold buy it. Who knows, maybe they stop offering the ZL1.
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I know they won't be the same car but if they are close in price, I doubt the Z/28 will be made. That's just my opinion.
And this in my opinion, is why the Z28 may not be made in the fifth gen. If it comes in that close to the ZL1 and is capable of competing with it performance wise, its to much of the same car. Why would anyone buy a ZL1 if they could buy a Z28 with near identical performance for less money?

Yes I know the Z06 is close to the ZR1 on track performance, but the price gap is much greater and puts the ZR1 in more of an exclusive territory.

I see both sides to the argument of why it could or couldnt happen. It would be the perfect way to keep excitement around the 5th gen as it goes out, with a new mustang on the horizon. BUT If the car is built like many here want it it would be IMO too close in performance to the ZL1 at to similar of a price point. If you look at the VIR Lightning lap results, the 1LE is damn impressive. Give that car better brakes and a LS7 and it would be right there with the ZL1 IMO.
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Old 02-11-2013, 03:04 PM   #73
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The "final" price of an LS7'd ZEE will be predicated on what level of trinkets 'n toys the car bears.

A) If you want a ZL1-level of equipment (MRC, embroidered leather, 6-piston Brembos, HD diff/axles etc.), expect a ZL1-like price.

B) If you expect a 1SS/1LE level of equipment (FE4, cloth, 4-piston Brembos, HD axles-only etc.), expect an under-$50K price, easily.

Something "in between" would co$t something in between...

Personally, example B would do, with ZL1 brakes and the HD carrier. Still $50ish...and I'm still waiting to order one...
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:13 PM   #74
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The "final" price of an LS7'd ZEE will be predicated on what level of trinkets 'n toys the car bears.

A) If you want a ZL1-level of equipment (MRC, embroidered leather, 6-piston Brembos, HD diff/axles etc.), expect a ZL1-like price.

B) If you expect a 1SS/1LE level of equipment (FE4, cloth, 4-piston Brembos, HD axles-only etc.), expect an under-$50K price, easily.

Something "in between" would co$t something in between...

Personally, example B would do, with ZL1 brakes and the HD carrier. Still $50ish...and I'm still waiting to order one...
I'd like B but with 6 piston brakes and some aero upgrades.
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Old 02-13-2013, 04:01 PM   #75
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This is what I truely expect us to see: SS/1LE level of equipment + adjustable coilovers, 6-piston Brembos, (HD diff/axles?), Z28 specific cosmetics (hood, spoiler) and I hope for $48k price tag but I suspect GM to price it close to the Boss.
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