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Old 06-11-2013, 02:19 PM   #76
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Sony confirms PS4 pre-owned DRM is up to third parties...
That's the way DRM has always been, and how it should stay. I don't mind codes that unlock multiplayer, but having DRM at the system level is utter bullshit.
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Old 06-11-2013, 02:34 PM   #77
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isn't that on both systems?
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Old 06-11-2013, 02:37 PM   #78
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isn't that on both systems?
Well yes, but I wouldn't buy a new system if not for that game... And PS4 being $100 cheaper... yeah.
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Old 06-11-2013, 02:38 PM   #79
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That's the way DRM has always been, and how it should stay. I don't mind codes that unlock multiplayer, but having DRM at the system level is utter bullshit.
isn't that the same the xbox one is doing? leaving it up to 3rd parties, on used games?
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Old 06-11-2013, 02:45 PM   #80
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isn't that the same the xbox one is doing? leaving it up to 3rd parties, on used games?
No they aren't. MS is locking it down at a system level, Sony is only doing it at a software level, just like it was before.
Here's what it says:
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Publishers of PS4 games, then, can do what's already done on existing PlayStation software: Limit or lock content behind online passes or redemption codes (or opt out of restrictions altogether), which differs from Microsoft's limited licensing of Xbox One software.
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Old 06-11-2013, 03:46 PM   #81
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isn't that the same the xbox one is doing? leaving it up to 3rd parties, on used games?
What Sony is doing really isn't DRM imo. They are doing the same thing that they are doing now like what Mikey's quote said. You know how some games that in order to play online you have to enter a 1 time use code that either comes with the game or you have to pay $10 for another one. Another example is some games come with a code that allows access to bonus content and the only way to get the code is to buy the game new.
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Old 06-11-2013, 04:54 PM   #82
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I just want a release date already!
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Old 06-11-2013, 04:55 PM   #83
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I just want a release date already!
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:03 PM   #84
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I pre-ordered, the expected date is Dec 31st.
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:11 PM   #85
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Dec 31 is way too late since most of the better awesome games come out in November. I bet it will be in Oct or In Nov. for a holiday push If its anything like the Ps3 release they will be sold out Im still going to preorder Friday regardless of when it comes out but I bet on Mid October or To co-inside with a Popular game release date. Heck ill be happy if they say Sept.
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:23 PM   #86
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I pre-ordered, the expected date is Dec 31st.
It's not that late. Some of the PS4 games already have release dates of the beginning of Nov. I expect the system to be out last week of Oct or 1st week of Nov.
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Old 06-11-2013, 05:30 PM   #87
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It's not that late. Some of the PS4 games already have release dates of the beginning of Nov. I expect the system to be out last week of Oct or 1st week of Nov.
That would be awesome, I am only telling you what my amazon.com account currently says.
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Old 06-11-2013, 06:52 PM   #88
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Wait. Microsoft is allowing for drm at the system level. But they are still leaving it up to the developers when it comes to any fees they wanna impose.
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:01 PM   #89
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Wait. Microsoft is allowing for drm at the system level. But they are still leaving it up to the developers when it comes to any fees they wanna impose.
Yes, MS is doubling the ass pounding.

The system has to call home once a day in addition to whatever DRM the software will need IN ADDITION to whatever fees they want to impose.

Sorry MS. I'm out. Cameras/microphones in my house always listening? Nope. Telling me what I can do with games I buy? Nope. Not allowing me to take a disc over to my friends homes to play? Nope. Making me buy used games from you at a price determined by you and then making me buy an access code if required by the developer? NOPE.
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:01 PM   #90
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Wait. Microsoft is allowing for drm at the system level. But they are still leaving it up to the developers when it comes to any fees they wanna impose.
Yes. You can also turn off the "Xbox on" voice command bullshit.
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:02 PM   #91
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Yes, MS is doubling the ass pounding.

The system has to call home once a day in addition to whatever DRM the software will need IN ADDITION to whatever fees they want to impose.

Sorry MS. I'm out. Cameras/microphones in my house always listening? Nope. Telling me what I can do with games I buy? Nope. Not allowing me to take a disc over to my friends homes to play? Nope. Making me buy used games from you at a price determined by you and then making me buy an access code if required by the developer? NOPE.
You can take your games to a friends house. Just sign in to your profile. You can alsp turn off the always listening thing. The rest....well yeah lol
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:08 PM   #92
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You can take your games to a friends house. Just sign in to your profile. You can alsp turn off the always listening thing. The rest....well yeah lol
No see that's STILL BS. I shouldn't have to sign into my friends god damn console (hello security compromises anyone?) to download a game to his XBOX using up his bandwith to play a damn game.

I still don't care if I can turn it "off" it shouldn't be there in the first place. Kinect should just be an add on that can be unplugged. if the software is loaded on the system from the store? fine.

The camera and microphone should STILL be able to be separated from the system for peace of mind. Look at what those schools did when they had integrated cameras into student loaner laptops. Someone figured out a way in and was able to turn on the camera remotely and were able to view what was going on in the homes.

NOPE.
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:17 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by G-Oil Guy View Post
Yes, MS is doubling the ass pounding.

The system has to call home once a day in addition to whatever DRM the software will need IN ADDITION to whatever fees they want to impose.

Sorry MS. I'm out. Cameras/microphones in my house always listening? Nope. Telling me what I can do with games I buy? Nope. Not allowing me to take a disc over to my friends homes to play? Nope. Making me buy used games from you at a price determined by you and then making me buy an access code if required by the developer? NOPE.
That's the thing you misunderstood me. Microsoft is not imposing any fee to play used games. They are leaving it up to the developers. What Microsoft did was take it a step further. Looking at both extremes a developer may not pose any type of fee to play its game used. On the other end a developer may require you to pay a fee to "unlock" the ability to PLAY the game. What this is is a step further than what we have now where developers put in a code that is required to play ONLINE with the game. If you bought the game used and what to play online you would have to pay for that. This whole setup also helps to combat people who tried to cheat the system with a Jtag Xbox and had the ability to download as many games as they liked for free
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:05 PM   #94
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That's the thing you misunderstood me. Microsoft is not imposing any fee to play used games. They are leaving it up to the developers. What Microsoft did was take it a step further. Looking at both extremes a developer may not pose any type of fee to play its game used. On the other end a developer may require you to pay a fee to "unlock" the ability to PLAY the game. What this is is a step further than what we have now where developers put in a code that is required to play ONLINE with the game. If you bought the game used and what to play online you would have to pay for that. This whole setup also helps to combat people who tried to cheat the system with a Jtag Xbox and had the ability to download as many games as they liked for free
I'm not denying that but here's the thing; the world will NEVER be rid of piracy. EVER. It's been there since the dawn of time and it will be there long after we pass.

You build a better mouse trap and evolution will build a better mouse. Make something "idiot proof" and someone will just build a better idiot

Nothing is 100%. Ever. What you have here is companies over inflating their losses and punishing the 90% of people who use their systems as intended and play by the rules to catch the 10% who obtain the games through other means.

Look at it this way: look how long VCR tapes and DVDs and Blu Rays have been around. Even with all of the region locking etc that studios and DVD/Blu Ray manufacturers do, people STILL find ways to counterfit them, or videotape them in movie theatres or get access to DVD/Blu ray quality digital formats and then burn their own or sell them to other people.

The loss they take on that is a drop in the bucket to the money they make from the people who purchase them legitly.

Eventually (and I am not implying that MS is at this point) you make the system so cumbersome and locked down that you lose both your core gamers and your casual audience and then you get stuck where Apple was for so long before Jobs came back. At one point I think they had less then 10% market penetration.

Jobs came back and relaxed the closed environment a little bit (MS products showing up on Mac without having to do anything special to the machine as an example), allowed the double trigger mouse etc and BOOM market penetration is soaring (as of 2010 numbers).

At some point, and I pity the console maker that finds this limit, you will push people to point where they go "you know, I don't need to do this anymmore" or "it's not worth the money and hassle anymore"

Happens all the time. especially in leisure activities.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:21 PM   #95
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I'm not denying that but here's the thing; the world will NEVER be rid of piracy. EVER. It's been there since the dawn of time and it will be there long after we pass.

You build a better mouse trap and evolution will build a better mouse. Make something "idiot proof" and someone will just build a better idiot

Nothing is 100%. Ever. What you have here is companies over inflating their losses and punishing the 90% of people who use their systems as intended and play by the rules to catch the 10% who obtain the games through other means.

Look at it this way: look how long VCR tapes and DVDs and Blu Rays have been around. Even with all of the region locking etc that studios and DVD/Blu Ray manufacturers do, people STILL find ways to counterfit them, or videotape them in movie theatres or get access to DVD/Blu ray quality digital formats and then burn their own or sell them to other people.

The loss they take on that is a drop in the bucket to the money they make from the people who purchase them legitly.

Eventually (and I am not implying that MS is at this point) you make the system so cumbersome and locked down that you lose both your core gamers and your casual audience and then you get stuck where Apple was for so long before Jobs came back. At one point I think they had less then 10% market penetration.

Jobs came back and relaxed the closed environment a little bit (MS products showing up on Mac without having to do anything special to the machine as an example), allowed the double trigger mouse etc and BOOM market penetration is soaring (as of 2010 numbers).

At some point, and I pity the console maker that finds this limit, you will push people to point where they go "you know, I don't need to do this anymmore" or "it's not worth the money and hassle anymore"

Happens all the time. especially in leisure activities.
Worded as is I agree completely. Fortunately for me my limit hasn't been reached
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:21 PM   #96
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Wait. Microsoft is allowing for drm at the system level. But they are still leaving it up to the developers when it comes to any fees they wanna impose.
Yea the Xbox will have two known layers of DRM.

First you have the system level DRM which is required and that is the checking in every 24 hours if it is your console or every hour if you are at a friends house.

Then you have the software level that is up to the devs and publishers to decide if they want to use it. Which is limit trading to one time AND that person MUST be on your friends list for at least 30 days. If you wish to lend it out to anyone else, like if you sale a game, then that person must pay a small fee.

A couple devs and publishers have already said they don't like the idea of DRM and won't use it, and some haven't commented yet one way or the other. There are however a couple that said they like it and might use it, EA is one of these. I swear I hate EA more and more with every generation.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:33 PM   #97
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Yea the Xbox will have two known layers of DRM.

First you have the system level DRM which is required and that is the checking in every 24 hours if it is your console or every hour if you are at a friends house.

Then you have the software level that is up to the devs and publishers to decide if they want to use it. Which is limit trading to one time AND that person MUST be on your friends list for at least 30 days. If you wish to lend it out to anyone else, like if you sale a game, then that person must pay a small fee.

A couple devs and publishers have already said they don't like the idea of DRM and won't use it, and some haven't commented yet one way or the other. There are however a couple that said they like it and might use it, EA is one of these. I swear I hate EA more and more with every generation.
I've already stopped buying their sports titles which is a shame because Tiger Woods Golf, FIFA, and NHL are excellent franchises.
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Old 06-12-2013, 08:45 AM   #98
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If you want to play games with multiplayer features you will need PSN+.
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Old 06-12-2013, 09:44 AM   #99
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If you want to play games with multiplayer features you will need PSN+.
Yea. Which from what I hear is either 5$ a month or 50$ a year
So no more free online play!!
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Old 06-12-2013, 09:54 AM   #100
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Yea. Which from what I hear is either 5$ a month or 50$ a year
So no more free online play!!
yup, copying xbox live.
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