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Old 03-06-2013, 09:11 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by BlackinBlack View Post

Sure adding just a supercharger to a 1LE will make power like a ZL1. But you will upset the balance of the car.... so you fix that. At a minimum by adding new tires...$$$. (305 goodyears to match the front?) But to make the car more neutral with the added power a change of the sway bars is more likely going to be needed....$$$. So now the car is handling right and has the power or more than a ZL1. So you go to the track.... clutch dies.... no problem you added a ZR1 clutch.... $$$. Then you break the axles so you put in gforce or DSS 1400 HP axles.... more $$$. Then the rear breaks so you put a ZL1 rear or 9" .... major $$$. Transmission goes....$$$. All with no warranty. So you get the car running fast..... but the car's aero produces lift making the car scary at the higher speeds it now can run at so you added the complete ZL1 aero package to get downforce.... more $$$. Then are the brakes up to the task?.... CTSV/ZL1 front breaks..... more $$$.

Sure a 1LE with a supercharger on paper looks to be a better deal but one major failure and the savings are gone. If you drive the car hard it will be a matter of time. With a ZL1 you get stronger parts and a warranty for 5 years on and off the track. On a ZL1 add a cold air intake for under $400 and add 35 proven HP. So that 80 HP advantage becomes 45 HP and the ZL1 still has a warranty, mag ride, better aero and is fully loaded even as a base model. (To be fair you should compare a 2SS 1LE to a ZL1) Also when you decide to trade it in after a few years.... ZL1 will be worth a ton more than a modded 1LE. The 1LE will be worth what a stock 1LE is worth to a dealer... maybe more if you find private buyer who is willing to pay more.

The 1LE is a great option package but value to $$$ the ZL1 is a far better deal if you dive deeper than skidpad and HP numbers.

One more thing.... you can buy a ZL1 under MSRP. I did back in September and they are more common now. Just like the 1LE deals can be struck. So at MSRP ZL1 Vs under MSRP 1LE....
The bottom line for me is I do not want to spend $50+K on a car. And for the purposes I will use it for, there would be very little, if any difference, in performance from a 1LE/Z and a ZL1. That use would be spirited street driving, the drag strip, an occasional track day, and maybe autocross. What I lose is my drive train warranty and a good ride when I do not feel sporty.

At ten tenths of the cars performance you have a point. Few of us go there.

With all that said, I would rather have a ZL1.
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Old 03-06-2013, 09:15 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by tones2SS View Post
And don't forget your install fees.
Don't get me wrong, you could do it under for what a ZL1 will cost, but you won't have the ZL1 mag ride and other little items that make a ZL1 a ZL1.
$7,000 would cover install and tune. I have a price right now at $6,500 and no sales tax. I would spend that extra $500 (or maybe $750) on self installed long tubes. They would be on before I go in to get the FI installed.
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Old 06-11-2013, 10:47 PM   #28
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Sorry for the late reply...just came across this thread. In theory, it sounds good, and I may have come out ahead if I started with the base SS. However, for what I spent on my 2SS, all my mods and finally the supercharger, I could've just bought the ZL1. And yes, a good blower installed by a good shop is going to run you more than 6K.

Here's the way I look at it, though. Yes, I'd take a ZL1, but I think my car is at least as much fun. It has at least the same whp, but it's got all my custom mods. You can't just go to a Chevy dealer and purchase my car off the lot. It's the way I wanted it, with the gears I wanted and everything else. So I'm a happy camper
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Old 02-05-2014, 08:00 PM   #29
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Old 02-05-2014, 09:04 PM   #30
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Redline

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Originally Posted by SUKXOST View Post
My 1LE (2SS; RS; NPP; premium audio) add the chiller kit; drop springs; tint; full TVS build with all supporting mods; parts and labor and tuning; all other small cosmetic mods etc....my build is easy 2-3K less than than a BASE ZL1....200lbs lighter and has 75-80 more WHP on a fairly conservative tune.

By conservative I mean:
-boost is 10lbs but sometimes 11 and touches 12lbs in cold weather
-AF is lean...pretty much 10 until high RPMs
-we lowered stock redline to 6400 bc of boost levels

*disclaimer...I'm getting retuned in a couple few weeks to improve AF (11.6ish)and possibly lower boost and still maybe get more performance/better #s

At the end of the day...I WANTED the ZL1 bad but IMO I'm way better off for the money (minus the warranty going bye bye)
You said you lowered the redline to 6400 due to Boost levels. What is the stock redline, i thought it was around 6400.
I have a stock 1LE and the only thing I hate is the redline which seems to be around 6400. I would prefer the engine could approach 6800 to 7000 rpm.

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Old 02-05-2014, 09:30 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Jims Mongoose View Post
You said you lowered the redline to 6400 due to Boost levels. What is the stock redline, i thought it was around 6400.
I have a stock 1LE and the only thing I hate is the redline which seems to be around 6400. I would prefer the engine could approach 6800 to 7000 rpm.

Jim
Curious why you'd want redline at 7k or so. When I've dynod I've seen a rapid decrease in rwhp starting at 6400. Between 6200k and 7k rpm your probably looking at a steady 50 rwhp loss. Peak seems to be between 5500 and 6200 followed by a rapid drop off
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Old 02-05-2014, 09:33 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Jims Mongoose View Post
You said you lowered the redline to 6400 due to Boost levels. What is the stock redline, i thought it was around 6400.
I have a stock 1LE and the only thing I hate is the redline which seems to be around 6400. I would prefer the engine could approach 6800 to 7000 rpm.

Jim
LS3s peg the limiter @ 6600 rpms. The tach might not keep up when accelerating, though...
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Old 02-06-2014, 11:27 AM   #33
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I should have been clearer

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Curious why you'd want redline at 7k or so. When I've dynod I've seen a rapid decrease in rwhp starting at 6400. Between 6200k and 7k rpm your probably looking at a steady 50 rwhp loss. Peak seems to be between 5500 and 6200 followed by a rapid drop off

Yes the way the LS3 is now and after many HP improvements the power does fall off after 6300 or less.

I would like my build when I do it to not only increase HP, but shift the curve to achieve good HP up to 6800 t0 7000 RPM.
I personally believe if you can keep making power longer and shift later then you will often have better acceleration overall especially in the lower gears.

I believe that is one of the advantages the Mustang has over our cars.

It also seems that if I don't shift when the heads up display hits no more than 6200 it goes into governing mode. Annoying.

Just my opinion

Would one of those shift lights help?

Jim
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Old 02-06-2014, 11:29 AM   #34
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The biggest problem you have with a PD Force Induction 1LE is the traction with so much low end torque. The car becomes extremely tail happy. Even with traction control fully on, the car will step out in 3rd gear in warm weather around mild corners on the power. You can go about 30-40 degrees rotated out of line it happens so fast, before the traction control catches you. What you also get with the ZL1 is a properly functioning traction control system as well that is more suited to the power.
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Old 02-06-2014, 11:41 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by 1LE Red Dragon View Post
The biggest problem you have with a PD Force Induction 1LE is the traction with so much low end torque. The car becomes extremely tail happy. Even with traction control fully on, the car will step out in 3rd gear in warm weather around mild corners on the power. You can go about 30-40 degrees rotated out of line it happens so fast, before the traction control catches you. What you also get with the ZL1 is a properly functioning traction control system as well that is more suited to the power.
Great point. At big power levels death can come quickly. With big power even going straight is a challenge for the novice. I have seen that and kissing the wall without injury is a good life lesson.

But wouldn't you agree that going centrifugal or single turbo the HP rush is not so abrupt at low rpms if the HP numbers are sane? This kind of power is more manageable and also is much easier on the drive train.
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Old 02-06-2014, 11:47 AM   #36
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It also seems that if I don't shift when the heads up display hits no more than 6200 it goes into governing mode. Annoying.

Just my opinion

Would one of those shift lights help?

Jim
Yes! I love mine and it's a 15 minute install. Works best at night. But without it shift with the tach, not the hud. It's seems more accurate, but not as good as a light. A loud beep would be nice. My ETs are much more consistent now. I wish the light could help my 60'.
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Old 02-06-2014, 11:57 AM   #37
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Do you know your cars exact weight before blower install. I am tempted to add a blower as well but don't want to ruin my cornering balance I have now. My car is now way too neutral.
Have you considered the AGP setup?

Weight is low where the frame basically is, and near the firewall, as opposed to a blower adding the weight up front and high(not good at all for CG).
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