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Old 04-09-2013, 09:36 PM   #526
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47 to 65 puts this car in my sweet spot. Wait and see indeed.
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Old 04-10-2013, 07:23 AM   #527
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It will be funny to see the Z/28 owners with there head sticking window to stay cool when driving to the track. I think Chevy took the easy way out. It would have been much harder to make the Z/28 show and go. I think the Chevy engineers are sitting together laughing.. We can market anything and these Chevy nuts will buy it. I feel bad for all those 68' owners. I hope they don't start sanding down there rear windows and pulling 3 speakers. I am sure BMW and AUDI will follow Chevy's (one speaker wonder) move. That's my 2 cents..
I'm afraid that you're still measuring value strictly by the number of extra things that can be hung on a car and on how pretty they might be.

Thing is, enjoyment of the most basic reason for cars to even exist - I'm speaking of the fun that can be had in performing the various physical tasks just driving from here to there - cannot be valued in terms of irrelevant material content. Nor should it.

What you suggest would be to dilute the Z/28 in the much same way that has happened to every generation of Z28 since the original. The halo on a halo car loses a lot of its luster when it becomes little different from the bread and butter versions of the same car.


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Old 04-10-2013, 07:42 AM   #528
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I like what I'm hearing from you guys about the racing qualities of this Z/28...especially regarding how expensive the comparable Fords and others are...

To that end, and I have held my tongue to this point, I have always thought the guesstimates for price...even the "high" mark of 70K...is gonna be....low!....I think you guys are looking at a 100K car all day long...Not saying it's a bad thing, just sayin, 100K seems like a fit to me for what the car is overall...

Not being negative hear at all...but a much higher price than what I've seen here so far wouldn't surprise me...
I'm not saying ur wrong but , how you figure?
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Old 04-10-2013, 08:41 AM   #529
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My estimate is $59,995 base price with a dealer mark up to get it around $64,995 before tax, title & license. So out the door, around $68-70,000
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Old 04-10-2013, 08:53 AM   #530
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I like what I'm hearing from you guys about the racing qualities of this Z/28...especially regarding how expensive the comparable Fords and others are...

To that end, and I have held my tongue to this point, I have always thought the guesstimates for price...even the "high" mark of 70K...is gonna be....low!....I think you guys are looking at a 100K car all day long...Not saying it's a bad thing, just sayin, 100K seems like a fit to me for what the car is overall...

Not being negative hear at all...but a much higher price than what I've seen here so far wouldn't surprise me...

No. $100,000 for a camaro besides the COPO? Wont happen. Ppl might as well jump up and grab a lighter weight car with perhaps a bit less or equal HP to the LS7 and have basically a track luxury car. In other words, if youre going to spend 6 figures, youre retarded not to go euro with it. The Z is 38-3900 lbs. Still too much weight in my opinion. But they've done an excellent job with the car.
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Old 04-10-2013, 08:57 AM   #531
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IMO I think they didnt...If you look at what we are all doing to our SSs' we are modding the F*(K out of them turning them to drag cars, race cars, etc. So they offered something stock to eliminate modding it. Z28 ZL1 1LE track cars, COPO drag, SS mod it!!
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Old 04-10-2013, 09:01 AM   #532
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A lot of folks do "get it". Thankfully
..absolutely. Built it, and they will come...........
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It will be funny to see the Z/28 owners with there head sticking window to stay cool when driving to the track. I think Chevy took the easy way out. It would have been much harder to make the Z/28 show and go. I think the Chevy engineers are sitting together laughing.. We can market anything and these Chevy nuts will buy it. I feel bad for all those 68' owners. I hope they don't start sanding down there rear windows and pulling 3 speakers. I am sure BMW and AUDI will follow Chevy's (one speaker wonder) move. That's my 2 cents..
...and all that gobbly gook from a Dodge owner, who have nothing to offer against a ZL1, 1LE, or Z/28.
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It is way more than we the Z/28 faithful in this part of the forum would of ever thought.
....boy and how!!!

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Don't beat up the fact that GM made the Z28 a "street"/track car just because of pricing. Be glad that they did not compromise. Chevy has always been a value based brand and the Z28 has every bell and whistle a "true" driver could want straight from the factory. It's the first car I can honestly say there is really nothing to mod performance wise. Why buy a $45,000. car you want to throw another $10 - $20k at when its already been done by the factory.
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:06 AM   #533
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Not beating up just potentially disappointed. Reading through more and more on this car I realize it is a beast and should be celebrated as such.

It is way more than i expected GM to do.

As for price there comes a point when the $$ for this car approaches an amount that I might want to spend elsewhere.

Example - I would love to build a killer 1st gen camaro with all the DSE gear and an LSX power plant. For what i would want to build that would push the 60k mark.

If the Z/28 was 50k - id jump at the new Z/28. If it is more like 70k then I have to think long and hard about what I really want to do.

I may have been a bit harsh in earlier posts but I do have a price point in mind. If it blows past that then the Z/28 will not be in my future.
Frankly, Boris, it's a LOT more car than I expected...or requested...but "it is what it is", and will have a correspondingly higher price point than "just" a 1LE-LS7 would have required. With a correspondingly increased performance potential... But throwing a hydro-formed DSE front end and LSX driveline under a '69 Camaro ain't cheap, either.

Unless you just won the PowerBall, or are a trust-fund recipient, you (like me) only have so many beans to bake into a "fun ride". A DSE-inspired LS-engined '69 would be very cool...and likely as plentiful as the '14 ZEE will be...

BTW, Kyle Tucker of DSE has an entry in this year's One Lap of America, which runs in about a month. We'll see how he does against the recently all-conquerring GT-Rs...
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:25 AM   #534
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Something unmentioned in this thread so far (iirc) is the fact this iteration of the ZEE is potentially a game-changer for others. Mopar and Ford BOTH will be obliged to answer this "shot across the bow" with something both "able" AND "streetable", NOT just a race-ready COPO-style "not street-legal" version. Why? Because, NOW, their loyalists EXPECT and DEMAND such a piece...

THAT, folks, is the "power" AND "influence" of a well-executed "halo" product. Not just on "your" product line, but others, as well...
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:48 AM   #535
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Darn this is one long thread, and no way have I read all the pages. But to the OP, I believe they were listening to the readers on these forums concerning thier opinions of what the Z28 should be. For that reason alone, I feel they were right on course with this car. Hopefully they can keep th price under 60k, but will
have to wait and see how that plays out. I can't wait to see one and person and check out those seats and the sound of that engine.
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:59 AM   #536
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I'm not saying ur wrong but , how you figure?
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No. $100,000 for a camaro besides the COPO? Wont happen. Ppl might as well jump up and grab a lighter weight car with perhaps a bit less or equal HP to the LS7 and have basically a track luxury car. In other words, if youre going to spend 6 figures, youre retarded not to go euro with it. The Z is 38-3900 lbs. Still too much weight in my opinion. But they've done an excellent job with the car.
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THAT, folks, is the "power" AND "influence" of a well-executed "halo" product. Not just on "your" product line, but others, as well...
I put out the 100K price...and here's some of my reasons why....After reading most of the posts discussing the pros and cons of this Z/28 from racers, the GM folks, and all the other interested members, what sticks out most to me is this: (gonna paraphrase best I can)...

"The car is targeted for a sub-set of those who actually track their cars"...

"Z/28 has out performed more than just the ZL1, but other more exotic and way more expensive track cars...."

"It's street-legal, but not meant for the street"...

"It's production numbers will be limited"...

Those ideas and others, tell me that this is definitely "Not the car for you...if...etc."...(Definitely not for me)...

It is the "Halo Car" and a "game-changer"....

I think the rationale for comparing it's features and pricing as if it's another assembly line car, like the ZL1 and even the Corvettes, to try and guesstimate a price for the Z/28 are way off and do not, and cannot apply to this car....It is beyond any leap-frog game to compete with lot sales for a comparable Ford or Dodge...It's gonna be a world-class competitor and winner on the world-stage...and will be priced accordingly...

...Not trying to be a downer or negative at all...I think when it comes to what we expect or what we think this car is all about, we haven't really seen anything yet...and the price will fall into that category also...
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Old 04-10-2013, 11:37 AM   #537
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I put out the 100K price...and here's some of my reasons why....After reading most of the posts discussing the pros and cons of this Z/28 from racers, the GM folks, and all the other interested members, what sticks out most to me is this: (gonna paraphrase best I can)...

"The car is targeted for a sub-set of those who actually track their cars"...

"Z/28 has out performed more than just the ZL1, but other more exotic and way more expensive track cars...."

"It's street-legal, but not meant for the street"...

"It's production numbers will be limited"...

Those ideas and others, tell me that this is definitely "Not the car for you...if...etc."...(Definitely not for me)...

It is the "Halo Car" and a "game-changer"....

I think the rationale for comparing it's features and pricing as if it's another assembly line car, like the ZL1 and even the Corvettes, to try and guesstimate a price for the Z/28 are way off and do not, and cannot apply to this car....It is beyond any leap-frog game to compete with lot sales for a comparable Ford or Dodge...It's gonna be a world-class competitor and winner on the world-stage...and will be priced accordingly...

...Not trying to be a downer or negative at all...I think when it comes to what we expect or what we think this car is all about, we haven't really seen anything yet...and the price will fall into that category also...
IF this car is prices at $90k+, its HUGELY over priced. Heres my reason why: The parts added to the car do NOT compensate for a price near this amount. An LS7 minus an LS3, seats, shaved glass, racing tires, CC brakes and suspension do not add up to $55000. My question is what kind of suspension was put on the car? MRC'd suspension to me would be THE suspension for the car which is doesnt include meaning its suspension costs less than MRC.No way this car is priced near your mark.
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Old 04-10-2013, 12:54 PM   #538
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IF this car is prices at $90k+, its HUGELY over priced. Heres my reason why: The parts added to the car do NOT compensate for a price near this amount. An LS7 minus an LS3, seats, shaved glass, racing tires, CC brakes and suspension do not add up to $55000. My question is what kind of suspension was put on the car? MRC'd suspension to me would be THE suspension for the car which is doesnt include meaning its suspension costs less than MRC.No way this car is priced near your mark.
I tend to agree.

The retail on a complete LS7 is 18-20k. Id bet the LS7 then costs GM about 5-7k to make (GM to distributor to retailer to customer - everyone has to get theirs).

Seats will be slightly more but you are replacing the old seats so maybe 1000 on the very high end

The other stuff is more expensive but once again it is replacing a stock part. The cost is not added in on top of the stock parts.

I am willing to bet this will also be built on the line with the regular Camaros(i have not seen anything that states otherwise so if you have it please link it for me). So overhead and labor are equal to that of a Camaro.

In my head im thinking this is a 60k car. I don't think it really can be much more because of the Corvette and CTS-V.

I know this is a track car well - those two are also track capable cars and one brings a boatload of luxury with it.

If it gets to the 70k mark then you will have people opting for a Z06. If it touches 100k now you are in ZR1 land.

Any track happy person picking the Z/28 over the ZR1 or Z06 would seem silly to me (but we all have our own tastes so...)

I really think it depends on what GM wants to do with it. If it is a limited number run then it will probably be very expensive. If anyone who wants one can get it - then i think in the 50s for this car. maybe even high 40s.
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Old 04-10-2013, 01:00 PM   #539
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Something unmentioned in this thread so far (iirc) is the fact this iteration of the ZEE is potentially a game-changer for others. Mopar and Ford BOTH will be obliged to answer this "shot across the bow" with something both "able" AND "streetable", NOT just a race-ready COPO-style "not street-legal" version. Why? Because, NOW, their loyalists EXPECT and DEMAND such a piece...

THAT, folks, is the "power" AND "influence" of a well-executed "halo" product. Not just on "your" product line, but others, as well...
I don't think Chrysler/Fiat is interested. I mean they started the Factory S/S competition back up but you really don't see much in the way of performance track Challengers. Hell they even locked their ecu's so aftermarket companies like procharger have had a heck of a time developing a system for them.

Chrysler did make their Charger SRT and going for the fast family car market (which i almost bought last year but the wife thought it was ugly )

I think the competition is Ford v Chevy here. A new Mustang is in the works and they are taking notes. I bet they fire back with something big that is unless the government gets in the way
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Old 04-10-2013, 01:07 PM   #540
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Frankly, Boris, it's a LOT more car than I expected...or requested...but "it is what it is", and will have a correspondingly higher price point than "just" a 1LE-LS7 would have required. With a correspondingly increased performance potential... But throwing a hydro-formed DSE front end and LSX driveline under a '69 Camaro ain't cheap, either.

Unless you just won the PowerBall, or are a trust-fund recipient, you (like me) only have so many beans to bake into a "fun ride". A DSE-inspired LS-engined '69 would be very cool...and likely as plentiful as the '14 ZEE will be...

BTW, Kyle Tucker of DSE has an entry in this year's One Lap of America, which runs in about a month. We'll see how he does against the recently all-conquerring GT-Rs...
Oh I know what you mean. I have the ability and the tools (well with my brothers as well) to build a screaming 69 pro touring car. I rode in a well sorted 68 with the speedtech track kit on it with a 468 big block and would just love to drive that beast every day.

But I also have a 55 that is a street/strip project as well. It gets to a point that if this Z/28 goes over that - i have a hard time justifying it over building another pro-touring car. If it is under that then the choice becomes a bit easier. Less money + warranty + just as fast out of the box factory hot rod = win in my book.
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Old 04-10-2013, 01:47 PM   #541
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If it touches 100k now you are in ZR1 land.
At 100k I would expect it to NOT come with a proper VIN.



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Old 04-10-2013, 02:24 PM   #542
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Frankly, Boris, it's a LOT more car than I expected...or requested...but "it is what it is", and will have a correspondingly higher price point than "just" a 1LE-LS7 would have required.

So what do you think the car will MSRP for?
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:10 PM   #543
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Since you asked, directly (I've avoided the "guessin' game", thus far), I'm a-thinkin' $60ish... Frankly, folks, these $70-80-90+ guesses are only going to encourage a potentially higher price point, imvho.

LS7s possess about $6,000 worth of ti rods, bought individually and at Retail. The selling price of that engine in crate form (as low as $13ish) leaves little in the way of profit. Special features add special costs. The brakes aren't NAPA pieces...yada yada yada... Add all that, and cert/val costs, to a 1SS/1LE and you'll easily top the ZL1...but HOPEFULLY not by much!
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:46 PM   #544
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......I agree with Lowdown and his price perspective. We went through the same guessing game and commentary over the ZL1, and... most were pleasantly to very surprised at the MSRP, despite all that it had to offer. I predict the Z/28 will be the same way, another huge bang for the buck.
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:47 PM   #545
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Since you asked, directly (I've avoided the "guessin' game", thus far), I'm a-thinkin' $60ish... Frankly, folks, these $70-80-90+ guesses are only going to encourage a potentially higher price point, imvho.

LS7s possess about $6,000 worth of ti rods, bought individually and at Retail. The selling price of that engine in crate form (as low as $13ish) leaves little in the way of profit. Special features add special costs. The brakes aren't NAPA pieces...yada yada yada... Add all that, and cert/val costs, to a 1SS/1LE and you'll easily top the ZL1...but HOPEFULLY not by much!
Right, I'm with you on that. MSRP won't be more than $62k. Dealer mark up and your tapping $70k out the door.
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:51 PM   #546
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Something unmentioned in this thread so far (iirc) is the fact this iteration of the ZEE is potentially a game-changer for others. Mopar and Ford BOTH will be obliged to answer this "shot across the bow" with something both "able" AND "streetable", NOT just a race-ready COPO-style "not street-legal" version. Why? Because, NOW, their loyalists EXPECT and DEMAND such a piece...

THAT, folks, is the "power" AND "influence" of a well-executed "halo" product. Not just on "your" product line, but others, as well...
Good point. Ford only makes one car that's even close, at present -- and it doesn't have a VIN. The Boss 302S is the only Ford that stands a chance of sticking with the Z/28 on a road course, and it's left at the gates (or on the trailer) when you drive the Z/28 home...
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Old 04-10-2013, 09:41 PM   #547
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Eagerly awaiting the response in the form of a GT350.
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Old 04-10-2013, 10:55 PM   #548
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Eagerly awaiting the response in the form of a GT350.
Speculating with a TT 5.0 perhaps...

More and more each day I have a feeling the Z/28 will be north of 70K... I wish it won't be since my guesstimate is 60-65k but we'll all see...
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Old 04-11-2013, 06:09 AM   #549
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No way this car will be 90 or 100k. Look at what GM added with the 1LE package for $3500. This car will be no more than 70k tops.
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:30 AM   #550
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If any spends over $75k on this, they need to go to rehab because they're smoking some very serious shit.
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