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Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics Discussions related to the 5th gen Camaro Z/28 model

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Old 04-11-2013, 07:50 AM   #551
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:59 AM   #552
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No way this car will be 90 or 100k. Look at what GM added with the 1LE package for $3500. This car will be no more than 70k tops.
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If any spends over $75k on this, they need to go to rehab because they're smoking some very serious shit.
I would just keep in mind that this Z/28 isn't going to be another high volume option/model like when the ZL-1 and the 1LE were added to the line-up for a customer's choice at the lot...

They're not gonna price this car so that it takes away sales from their own line up that is now offered...

The sales numbers for the Z/28 won't be large enough to make it "affordable" like the others and have it's costs spread out with higher volume sales...

IMO, it's part of the "Z/28" thing, instead of the "Z28"....Just my take on it...

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Old 04-11-2013, 08:05 AM   #553
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for the people saying only like 5-8K in dealer mark ups, you must have very friendly dealers haha. In my area if one of my dealers land one of these I expect at least a 10K dealer mark up on the first ones.
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Old 04-11-2013, 10:04 AM   #554
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I would just keep in mind that this Z/28 isn't going to be another high volume option/model like when the ZL-1 and the 1LE were added to the line-up for a customer's choice at the lot...

They're not gonna price this car so that it takes away sales from their own line up that is now offered...

The sales numbers for the Z/28 won't be large enough to make it "affordable" like the others and have it's costs spread out with higher volume sales...

IMO, it's part of the "Z/28" thing, instead of the "Z28"....Just my take on it...
The ZL1 and 1LE aren't high volume models. At any price, the Z/28 won't take away any sales from the ZL1 or 1LE. There are clear cut delineations in performance between them, and they are priced accordingly...and reasonably.
Affordability is subjective.The Z/28 is a special purpose, purpose built car for one target group. It will be priced no differently, with the same cost to profit ratio as the other models. They only project to make X amount of these specialty vehicles, and it's baked into the cake with the allocations. That can be adjusted over time. They are all very low in production, as compared to cars designed for mass transportation, where the cost of production over total volume would probably have a more tangible effect. The Z/28 will no doubt be a pleasant surprise where it comes in at with it's MSRP. It will fall in line with it's other Camaro HP brothers. I can't wait to find out the final build information and specifications. This is mean motor scooter, bad go getter Camaro I truely desire, after all these years.
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Old 04-11-2013, 10:18 AM   #555
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The ZL1 and 1LE aren't high volume models. At any price, the Z/28 won't take away any sales from the ZL1 or 1LE. There are clear cut delineations in performance between them, and they are priced accordingly...and reasonably.
Affordability is subjective.The Z/28 is a special purpose, purpose built car for one target group. It will be priced no differently, with the same cost to profit ratio as the other models. They only project to make X amount of these specialty vehicles, and it's baked into the cake with the allocations. That can be adjusted over time. They are all very low in production, as compared to cars designed for mass transportation, where the cost of production over total volume would probably have a more tangible effect. The Z/28 will no doubt be a pleasant surprise where it comes in at with it's MSRP. It will fall in line with it's other Camaro HP brothers. I can't wait to find out the final build information and specifications. This is mean motor scooter, bad go getter Camaro I truely desire, after all these years.

Good points...I knew my sales comment would come off bad...lol...I think your use of "specialty" is something too consider...1LE, ZL1...sort of a mixed bag of upgrades to the SS, (please don't slam me for that one, but in general, you get my drift...lol) built with components used in other models...Not a "high" volume, as you say, but certainly more than what the Z/28 will be...

...Just sayin' this Z/28 uses nothing...brakes,suspension, tires, wheels, engine, rear-end, seats, widened fender flares, weight reduction,etc...that any of the other models do...It will be very pricey....

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Old 04-11-2013, 11:14 AM   #556
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Good points...I knew my sales comment would come off bad...lol...I think your use of "specialty" is something too consider...1LE, ZL1...sort of a mixed bag of upgrades to the SS, (please don't slam me for that one, but in general, you get my drift...lol) built with components used in other models...Not a "high" volume, as you say, but certainly more than what the Z/28 will be...

...Just sayin' this Z/28 uses nothing...brakes,suspension, tires, wheels, engine, rear-end, seats, widened fender flares, weight reduction,etc...that any of the other models do...It will be very pricey....
Well, it's all good as they say! We need to pass the time until the final specs and figures come out on the Z/28! OK, you have generalized a bit too much by saying the Z/28 uses nothing over...IMHO the Z/28 will use a good amount of what the '13 and the refresh Camaro will use. Major revisions will be the nose/fascia/hood, tail/fascia,decklid (and lighting). The LS7 has been around since '08 I believe, and I betcha from the bellhousing backward it will be the same as the 1LE, (TR6060, driveshaft, rear axle housing/ratio/half shafts). Weight reduction saves money actually on the build. Recaro's are probably same in some way as used in other models, except stripped down with no power. That's all cost saving. The carbon ceramic brakes, DSSV dampers and springs/stab bars will be new. It should not have to be anything more than 64,995 MSRP to make a handsome profit.
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:29 AM   #557
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Yeah, that "passing the time"...lol...How's that supposed to work?...lol
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:36 AM   #558
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Wow im shocked that I actually made it through ever single post in this thread lol A lot of folks keep saying the same thing even after it was stated by Fbodfather what a Z/28 is.


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Originally Posted by FINALLYSATISFIED View Post
I'll wait until GM releases a Z/28 like the 4th Gen which was a DD.
There never was a Z/28 in a 4thgen. There was a Z28

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I respect your wishes but I hope GM never goes there again with this car.
I hope you're right





Folks the Z/28 was a Track car!!!! Yall are used to going to car shows and seeing a garage built show queen with Z/28 emblems on it.

I think the Camaro team needed to do this. So many folks call themselves Camaro Enthusiast and they dont even know the history of this car.


I hope GM doesnt even sell the emblems aftermarket. Only a Real car deserves to wear the Z/28 badge.
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Old 04-11-2013, 12:20 PM   #559
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Because not all track driving is wheel to wheel competition and fighting for position/coaxing the other guy into making a mistake that lets you get past him, and the not-racing side of it seems to be growing. For example, NJMP here in NJ has been sending out direct advertising via email about driving your street car on their tracks with several dates planned. Approaching/entering Turn 7 on the 1.9 mile Lightning course shown below. Not all of the cars are street legal.

Think "run what you brung" open-tracking at slightly/somewhat less than 10/10ths, "point-by" passing on straights only, and where the cars out on the track during any given session would very likely never fit into the same competition class anyway. And although there generally isn't any official lap timing, most folks do like to pick up the pace as they gain experience.

Not everybody cares to then have to own a truck (that they'd at most rarely use otherwise), plus the trailer (ditto), and then find a place to park all three vehicles, which is what you'd be facing with operating a non street-legal track car.





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Old 04-11-2013, 12:50 PM   #560
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Sure it can be driven on the street, but with no amenities. I think they should have made this into a more streetable car. Drop in the ls7 and a few other goodies. The price could be in the 40's then.
No amenities? I guess I grew up in a time where I think it has to many still, lol.
Crank windows would be nice, no A/C is great, cruise control can't use on the track why have it, power mirrors don't need, etc etc.

Just my input, wish the LS base model didn't have so many amenities!
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Old 04-11-2013, 12:53 PM   #561
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Wow im shocked that I actually made it through ever single post in this thread lol A lot of folks keep saying the same thing even after it was stated by Fbodfather what a Z/28 is.




There never was a Z/28 in a 4thgen. There was a Z28



I hope you're right





Folks the Z/28 was a Track car!!!! Yall are used to going to car shows and seeing a garage built show queen with Z/28 emblems on it.

I think the Camaro team needed to do this. So many folks call themselves Camaro Enthusiast and they dont even know the history of this car.


I hope GM doesnt even sell the emblems aftermarket. Only a Real car deserves to wear the Z/28 badge.
Thank You, thank you, thank you!
Yes, the ORIGINAL Z/28 was made to qualify for the Trans-Am racing series and that is what THIS Camaro is about! Drive it on the street but drive it on the track also.

Thank You Team Camaro, GM, and all involved in putting this Camaro out!
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:36 PM   #562
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Well, it's all good as they say! We need to pass the time until the final specs and figures come out on the Z/28! OK, you have generalized a bit too much by saying the Z/28 uses nothing over...IMHO the Z/28 will use a good amount of what the '13 and the refresh Camaro will use. Major revisions will be the nose/fascia/hood, tail/fascia,decklid (and lighting). The LS7 has been around since '06 MY I believe, and I betcha from the bellhousing backward it will be the same as the 1LE, (TR6060, driveshaft, rear axle housing/ratio/half shafts). Weight reduction saves money actually on the build. Recaro's are probably same in some way as used in other models, except stripped down with no power. That's all cost saving. The carbon ceramic brakes, DSSV dampers and springs/stab bars will be new. It should not have to be anything more than 64,995 MSRP to make a handsome profit.
...and don't forget the unique-to-Z/28 forged 19s and corresponding R-like rubber...
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Old 04-11-2013, 01:44 PM   #563
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Well, it's all good as they say! We need to pass the time until the final specs and figures come out on the Z/28!

Weight reduction saves money actually on the build.
I gotta respectfully disagree with this one...I think the engineering, etc.,to reduce the weight in the Z/28 is one of the many things unique to this vehicle that will make it more expensive...Sounds bass-ackwards, but I think it's true...
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Old 04-11-2013, 03:13 PM   #564
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I gotta respectfully disagree with this one...I think the engineering, etc.,to reduce the weight in the Z/28 is one of the many things unique to this vehicle that will make it more expensive...Sounds bass-ackwards, but I think it's true...
....I believe the only weight saving new engineering you refer to that would cost money in real terms would be the thinner rear window glass, no? The rest is stuff physically not placed in the car, the rear seat material and divider, speakers, sound deadening material, wiring from harneses, radio, A/C unit, not like they structured a new frame and chasis from space age materials, or brought forth new manufacturing proceses. The money will be in the addition, rather than the subtraction......it's going to be a far less bitter pill to swallow monetarily I feel than most suspect!
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Old 04-11-2013, 05:23 PM   #565
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I would just keep in mind that this Z/28 isn't going to be another high volume option/model like when the ZL-1 and the 1LE were added to the line-up for a customer's choice at the lot...

They're not gonna price this car so that it takes away sales from their own line up that is now offered...

The sales numbers for the Z/28 won't be large enough to make it "affordable" like the others and have it's costs spread out with higher volume sales...

IMO, it's part of the "Z/28" thing, instead of the "Z28"....Just my take on it...
I agree, but the parts added and what the car will be doesnt compensate for more than $70k out the door. Sure it's a race car, but those deleted items to make it lighter would subtract from original price of a car then added parts in. If its more than $70k, you're simply paying for a name. I mentioned why I believe it'd be $70k out the door. A ZL-1 is not considered in the fleet. It's a specialized camaro as well. A 1LE is considered in the fleet because its a hair over an SS. What they sell production wise on ZL-1s in 2012? 2000?def not what they sold your avg camaro for. It'll be more than a ZL-1, but maybe $10k over. Otherwise you'd just get a Vette IMO.
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Old 04-11-2013, 06:15 PM   #566
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Well, I hope for everybody's sake it's at least priced "reasonably"...When the heck is the price supposed to come out, anyway?
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Old 04-11-2013, 06:40 PM   #567
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Figure in about 6 months, when sourcing is complete...
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:32 PM   #568
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Figure in about 6 months, when sourcing is complete...
Thanks...Just wondering if there's any chance GM could put a stop to this "dealer mark-up" bs over MSRP on this one...I don't get how that they can let that fly...Sure seems like a rip-off and terrible P.R......

(They didn't have that with the '67 Z/28's did they?....lol)
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:52 PM   #569
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Thanks...Just wondering if there's any chance GM could put a stop to this "dealer mark-up" bs over MSRP on this one...I don't get how that they can let that fly...Sure seems like a rip-off and terrible P.R......

(They didn't have that with the '67 Z/28's did they?....lol)
You do know GM has ZERO to do with the price a dealer sets for a car right?

If you want to buy a Zed at MSRP just contact Becky. I know for a fact she won't charge you a dime over MSRP.
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:59 PM   #570
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You do know GM has ZERO to do with the price a dealer sets for a car right?
Perhaps you are right, but I would think GM sure could determine who they send them to, or allocate them to...and if it's a dealer that plans on jacking it up over MSRP......., then..........well, they don't get one to sell at all.....
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Old 04-11-2013, 08:06 PM   #571
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Just read this whole thread...
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Old 04-11-2013, 08:14 PM   #572
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Perhaps you are right, but I would think GM sure could determine who they send them to, or allocate them to...and if it's a dealer that plans on jacking it up over MSRP......., then..........well, they don't get one to sell at all.....
GM gives allocations based on sales. Why should GM care if a certain dealership's customers are dumb enough to pay over MSRP? GM's goal is to sell cars, as is the dealership's, if people simply refused to pay over MSRP then dealerships would stop doing it.

Simple economics.
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Old 04-11-2013, 08:19 PM   #573
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GM gives allocations based on sales. Why should GM care if a certain dealership's customers are dumb enough to pay over MSRP? GM's goal is to sell cars, as is the dealership's, if people simply refused to pay over MSRP then dealerships would stop doing it.

Simple economics.
Well, alrighty then!!...lol....I think Becky is gonna be busy with this one...lol
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Old 04-11-2013, 11:05 PM   #574
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I don't see Ford doing anything to try and "respond" to GM's z/28. Frankly, there just isn't a market for it. If someone wants to road race a Ford, there are already options available to them via Ford Racing. Granted, they are not street-legal, whereas the z/28 is, but if your real intent is to compete in a sanctioned road racing series, why would you need it to be street legal?

IMO, this car was built to appease a vocal segment within the Camaro community and they will likely sell every one they make but it will still be a street car pretending to be a track-specfic race car. That being the case, why in the world would Ford waste time and money trying to develop a direct competitor for it? If memory serves, GM never "responded" back in the day to Ford's 2000 Cobra R.
Simply sorting out the IRS in the new lighter body and taking off where the Boss left off will do it until GM has time to respond with the lighter car. Bet on it, Ford (and ADM happy dealers) love the speciality Mustangs. Without a Corvette, there's lots of room to play.
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Old 04-12-2013, 08:17 AM   #575
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I don't see Ford doing anything to try and "respond" to GM's z/28. Frankly, there just isn't a market for it. If someone wants to road race a Ford, there are already options available to them via Ford Racing. Granted, they are not street-legal, whereas the z/28 is, but if your real intent is to compete in a sanctioned road racing series, why would you need it to be street legal?

IMO, this car was built to appease a vocal segment within the Camaro community and they will likely sell every one they make but it will still be a street car pretending to be a track-specfic race car. That being the case, why in the world would Ford waste time and money trying to develop a direct competitor for it? If memory serves, GM never "responded" back in the day to Ford's 2000 Cobra R.
Ford will definitely come up with something to "compete" I don't know if they will go as extreme, but they might. You mentioned the Cobra R. Maybe its time for Ford to resurrect the Cobra R, the 2000 Cobra R only 300 built, unique engine, stripped of all amenities so maybe they will respond with something "equal".

Ford has been pretty good at responding lately, Camaro comes back witha 426HP LS3, Next year Mustang gets the 5.0 Back with 412HP, ZL1 is announced with 580HP Ford upgrades the GT500 to 662 HP. Also to try and regain sales, the Mustang has received 2 face lifts since the Camaro came back. The 2010-2012, and then the updated fascias and rear ends on the 2013s and 2014s.

So if I was a betting man, I would wager they will do something, I don't know if they will go to the extreme GM did with the Z/28, but I would bet they have something planned or in the works.
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