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Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics Discussions related to the 5th gen Camaro Z/28 model

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Old 04-01-2013, 10:24 PM   #226
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i will take those brakes and maybe the seats to put on my car i dont like the rest
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Old 04-01-2013, 11:23 PM   #227
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I do not understand all the Z/28 haters. The Z/28 is going to be an exclusive, expensive car. There will be two types of buyers, track lovers with big bucks who will drive the hell out of it and collectors. It is the only collectable 5th gen Camaro so far. So if you buy one, you might not make money for a long time, but the value will hold. I do not think anyone who can afford to buy one will be sorry they did.

The Z/28 does disappoint many who were waiting for this car. But the good news is all the work that went into the HP Camaros has produced the 1LE. And if you can afford a Camaro, you can afford a 1LE. For about $3k you can bump the HP of a 1LE pretty close to an LS7 and keep your warranty intact. With some key suspension mods you can raise the handling bar even further. Running the 1LE on a real track more than occasionally requires big bucks, but Autocross is a cheap playground.

Then when you sell the car you can put all the stock parts back and sell the aftermarket parts. A sensible, low cost, fun plan.

You can also build a Camaro with silly HP and suspension mods, but unless you are a pro level driver to handle all that HP, you would be looking at disappearing Z/28 taillights being driven by an average track experienced driver.

But how often does anyone race their expensive Camaro all-out on a track against one another? So all balls-out comparisons are only Internet racing. 7/10s effort Track days are all about the driver and not so much the car.

I am a big fan of the Z/28. But I do not want one unless I could afford it as a second car. But even if I could, I would not want to pay big ADM that for sure will be attached to Z/28s.
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Old 04-03-2013, 05:34 PM   #228
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I have to disagree with the feller who posted that the Z28 is the only collectible Camaro5. The ZL1 got built, I went to the dealer, collected one, and drove home. Bam. Collectible. In my garage this very minute.
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Old 04-03-2013, 05:35 PM   #229
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I have to disagree with the feller who posted that the Z28 is the only collectible Camaro5. The ZL1 got built, I went to the dealer, collected one, and drove home. Bam. Collectible. In my garage this very minute.


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Old 04-03-2013, 05:37 PM   #230
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Old 04-03-2013, 07:46 PM   #231
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...Can you build a Z/28 like Camaro? Of course and we have since the release back in 2009. Can you build them cheaper is the real question. Everything on the Z/28 has been validated to meet OEM standards for durability and warranty. That sets the bar pretty high.
You nailed it! The best analogy I can think of is the Boss 302S. You can buy a body in white and build something as good or better, but you'll spend $20K more than what Ford charges. This will be the ultimate track Camaro that is still street legal. No matter what they charge, it will be a LOT of car for the money...
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Old 04-03-2013, 09:42 PM   #232
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the question is whats the cost of the car and are they goimg to over price it and then not understand why it don't sell. Thats just what they have done with the zl1. not worth the cost. If you look around there are tons of zl1's, used for sell. either buyers got in to deep and could not aford them or the car did not add up to all it was made out to be. pricing these cars to high is just what the problem is today. you want to make money make them affordable.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:03 PM   #233
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^^Even assuming what you said is correct GM has already made money by selling the car. Used indicates GM sold it... Not sure what your point is. Plus if you sell at a loss you still aren't making money; affordable or not.
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:35 PM   #234
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I don't think that people understand the expense of building a car like the Z/28 today. I was privileged to meet the 'test pilot' for the original GTO. They called him that because he held a private pilot license. I asked what the testing was for the GTO. If you pull up an aerial of the Tech Center you'll see a road that runs on the edge of the property. He took a mule out and ran it around that road. He git it up to 100 MPH and pronounced it good to go.

In 1966 there were few safety standards, no EPA regulation and the Z/28 had a whopping 290 HP which if rated today would be lower. The Z/28 is lower than a production SS or ZL1. It had to be crash tested $$$$. They deleted wires that would not be used to create a Z/28 specific wiring harness. It had to be validated $$$$ The dry sump system for the LS7 had to be validated $$$$ The design for the ultra light weight wheels had to be tested and pass the crater like pot hole tests that GM requires for validation $$$$ If it is different than what you find in a standard production Camaro it had to be validated $$$$. The lead engineer wanted to use a new F1 style valve system for the Z/28 struts. This technology has never been used in a street car. $$$$ validation of that system to GM standards $$$$Every where you look at the ZL1 or Z/28 you should be seeing $$$$$

I have been involved in numerous 5th Gen Camaro builds. They ain't cheap. Forgeline wheels retail at 5K with lightening pockets, titanium hardware and internal TPMS. A set of 4 Michelin Pilot Sport Cups cost $2,600 at Tire Rack. A Brembo GT-R brake kit retails at $18,000 with iron rotors. Add another $6,000 at a discount for CC rotors. The lowest price I found for an LS7 crate motor is just under $14,000. We are at $45,000 without labor, without a dry sump system, without headers, without Recaro seating, without suspension upgrades and you have to have a Pedders Justice System on a Z/28 like build which adds another $6,000 in parts. We are now over $50,000 is parts and I used discounted prices for the LS7, tires and brakes. Add that to the cost of a 1LE. We'll part out the discards to reduce costs $10,000 and we are at $80,000.

I am sure many of you will look at the numbers and say you can do it for less. Maybe you can, but as a business owner that gets promotional product and deeply discounted product my builds are still expensive. It is never a bolt and go. It is a bolt, test, adjust, tweak again, almost perfect almost done, almost done... If the Z/28 rolls out at $80,000 it would be the same price bump as the Z06 over a base Vette. The same LS7, Carbon Ceramic Brakes, Weight Savings...

I am not sure I understand what people were expecting when the pricing already exists with the Vette.
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:33 PM   #235
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"I am not sure I understand what people were expecting when the pricing already exists with the Vette."



+1

Thanks to Banks swindling the American Home Owner out of 37-trillion and many more Trillion being printed by the Fed each year you will never again get the bang for the buck of a $ 5,000 muscle car of yesteryear.

Try 40K to start and 70K+ to play with the big dogs.
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Old 04-04-2013, 10:29 AM   #236
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I see lots of people want to compare the pricing of the new Z/28 with the price of the first gen Z/28s. Since it has an all aluminum 427 engine, I think we should compare the pricing with the first gen that had an all aluminum 427 engine, the 1969 427 COPO 9560. The price of the engine option alone was $4100, making the engine option more expensive than the car itself, and making it more expensive than a 1969 Corvette. Those cars were considered overpriced at the time and didn't sell well at all, but they now regularly bring $300,000+. With that in mind, I'd gladly pay sticker for one. This car may be overpriced, but it's certainly not unprecedented. I have no idea what GM's going to have in the these things, but sometimes they build vehicles that, for various reasons, they don't want to sell a lot of, and price them accordingly.
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Old 04-04-2013, 11:33 AM   #237
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[QUOTE=Rocky1974;6380719]I see lots of people want to compare the pricing of the new Z/28 with the price of the first gen Z/28s. Since it has an all aluminum 427 engine, I think we should compare the pricing with the first gen that had an all aluminum 427 engine, the 1969 427 COPO 9560. The price of the engine option alone was $4100, making the engine option more expensive than the car itself, and making it more expensive than a 1969 Corvette. Those cars were considered overpriced at the time and didn't sell well at all, but they now regularly bring $300,000+. With that in mind, I'd gladly pay sticker for one. This car may be overpriced, but it's certainly not unprecedented. I have no idea what GM's going to have in the these things, but sometimes they build vehicles that, for various reasons, they don't want to sell a lot of, and price them accordingly.[/QUOTE]

Well...niche, special editions are low numbered with collectibility in mind no doubt. Many manufacturers make them, not just GM. Prices are subject to what they come with, not tacked on, padded, or added over or above with the intent of making them costlier and harder to get. Now, dealers, with ADM's, that's another story. GM has no control over them. I saw a 2013 1LE with a $2,995.00 ADM on the lot last week...sheesh..
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