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Old 05-18-2013, 02:07 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
It's really OK you don't get it.
No I GOT it! You're OK, I'm OK! What I get is the Z/28 will be truly a race car that's street! Anyone who's been around understands the supercharger issues. You're starting to sound like messenger killer. Puff daddy! All I said was put the soft tires and brakes on the heavier ZL1 and the 3 seconds on the "test lap" and Voila......the 3 seconds will disappear. Now I am not talking about a 20 lap racing contest. Oh, and don't forget, if you add back all the weight cutting items back on the Z/28 to gain a few creature comforts .... No, I'll stop b4 I confuse you.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:10 PM   #100
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i didn't compare torque numbers between the two engines. i'm saying the LS7 is a torque monster, and the Z/28 will already be carrying more speed through the corners than the ZL1 because of the weight advantage and lower COG, and with the big engine it's going to fly out of that corner faster than the ZL1. i mean, that's the whole point of this thread right, that the Z/28 has alread proven faster around one track by 3 seconds? it's going to be more of the same on any other track unless there's a lot of long straights where the ZL1 can take advantage of its HP.
The LS7 has monster torque, the LSA even more so.....

The Z/28 according to GM will carry more speed through a corner, has a better power to weight ratio (accelerate faster). Even on the long straights the Z/28 is going to pull on the ZL1 Camaro, the Z/28 is going to be faster in every area. After all at the end of the day the power difference is only going to be about 30-40BHP between the Z/28 and ZL1 Camaro.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:10 PM   #101
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Now we are into ""who has deeper pockets" territory.....

Of course.... Agree. Same as if you want to add street comforts to the z/28.

It's not about the cost however. Just the affect of the softer tires and brakes on test laps. Inquiring minds want to know.
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:23 PM   #102
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Lets see we shed weight, added the high-revving fire-breathing torque monster ls7 under the hood, recaro seats, finely-engineered track-tuned suspension, and supercar performance (so far even better than the zl1). Considering camaro was always for guys looking for performance I'd say GM put everything fun about camaro back INTO the car! Cheers!

+1!!!
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Old 05-18-2013, 07:39 PM   #103
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Of course.... Agree. Same as if you want to add street comforts to the z/28.

It's not about the cost however. Just the affect of the softer tires and brakes on test laps. Inquiring minds want to know.
Adding CCB and 60 wear tires to a ZL1 is the same as adding speakers to a Z/28???
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:32 PM   #104
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Don't be facetious.. speakers dont weigh 300 lbs. Not any I have ever seen LOL. But all of the creature comforts removed do. I didn't say "speakers" .... I said "all of the creature comforts".... AC, Electric seats, sound deadener, Elec Windows, heavier rear glass and so on......

I'll give you a second chance to understand. Wouldn't you like to know what a ZL1 would do if it simply had the tires and brakes of the Z/28? Give the ZL1 just a couple of the Z/28 upgrades, without changing any of the other issues. Then we see what happens on a "test lap".... not an endurance race. I'd like to know if those famously quoted "3 seconds" would mean as much if you just made those two changes (tires/brakes). Hell, for a couple "test laps", I'd be curious with just the tire change! After all, those brakes are fairly pricey.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:35 PM   #105
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Don't be facetious.. speakers dont weigh 300 lbs. Not any I have ever seen LOL. But all of the creature comforts removed do. I didn't say "speakers" .... I said "all of the creature comforts".... AC, Electric seats, sound deadener, Elec Windows, heavier rear glass and so on......

I'll give you a second chance to understand.
Obviously this is just my opinion but I don't think the people that are going to buy this car care about creature comforts. I guess I just don't see the point of buying this car then adding a bunch of weight.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:54 PM   #106
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I don't know what to say except who didn't know it was fasterm the led out with that info.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:07 PM   #107
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Don't be facetious.. speakers dont weigh 300 lbs. Not any I have ever seen LOL. But all of the creature comforts removed do. I didn't say "speakers" .... I said "all of the creature comforts".... AC, Electric seats, sound deadener, Elec Windows, heavier rear glass and so on......

I'll give you a second chance to understand. Wouldn't you like to know what a ZL1 would do if it simply had the tires and brakes of the Z/28? Give the ZL1 just a couple of the Z/28 upgrades, without changing any of the other issues. Then we see what happens on a "test lap".... not an endurance race. I'd like to know if those famously quoted "3 seconds" would mean as much if you just made those two changes (tires/brakes). Hell, for a couple "test laps", I'd be curious with just the tire change! After all, those brakes are fairly pricey.
But why would you want to know that? what would it prove? Do you feel your car is less superior because of the Z/28? Excuse my ignorance, I'm just not as intelligent and informed as some of the members here in this thread.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:08 PM   #108
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Don't be facetious.. speakers dont weigh 300 lbs. Not any I have ever seen LOL. But all of the creature comforts removed do. I didn't say "speakers" .... I said "all of the creature comforts".... AC, Electric seats, sound deadener, Elec Windows, heavier rear glass and so on......

I'll give you a second chance to understand. Wouldn't you like to know what a ZL1 would do if it simply had the tires and brakes of the Z/28? Give the ZL1 just a couple of the Z/28 upgrades, without changing any of the other issues. Then we see what happens on a "test lap".... not an endurance race. I'd like to know if those famously quoted "3 seconds" would mean as much if you just made those two changes (tires/brakes). Hell, for a couple "test laps", I'd be curious with just the tire change! After all, those brakes are fairly pricey.
I'd love to see a comparo with just the tires. I'm sure there are many intelligent magazine and online review persons who will do exactly that comparison.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:13 PM   #109
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But why would you want to know that? what would it prove? Do you feel your car is less superior because of the Z/28? Excuse my ignorance, I'm just not as intelligent and informed as some of the members here in this thread.
We want to see that because GM claimed to have engineered this drastically better track car than a zl1, but compared the two while putting street tires on one and road race (slick compound) on the other. If GM wants to market their new product by comparing it to the older one, run the both in running shoes, instead of having one wear slippers (pun intended)
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:14 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by htron50 View Post
Don't be facetious.. speakers dont weigh 300 lbs. Not any I have ever seen LOL. But all of the creature comforts removed do. I didn't say "speakers" .... I said "all of the creature comforts".... AC, Electric seats, sound deadener, Elec Windows, heavier rear glass and so on......

I'll give you a second chance to understand. Wouldn't you like to know what a ZL1 would do if it simply had the tires and brakes of the Z/28? Give the ZL1 just a couple of the Z/28 upgrades, without changing any of the other issues. Then we see what happens on a "test lap".... not an endurance race. I'd like to know if those famously quoted "3 seconds" would mean as much if you just made those two changes (tires/brakes). Hell, for a couple "test laps", I'd be curious with just the tire change! After all, those brakes are fairly pricey.
First no need to be condescending ("I'll give you a second chance to understand.")
The point is its apples and oranges. The cars are built for different purchasers for different missions. And yes the ZL1 would perform better with upgrades, but any car can perform better with the right upgrades.
And the Z/28 has AC, electric windows...I don't think the heavier rear window is a creature comfort. Also, the 300+ lbs includes the SC which I wouldn't call a CC.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:22 PM   #111
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We want to see that because GM claimed to have engineered this drastically better track car than a zl1, but compared the two while putting street tires on one and road race (slick compound) on the other. If GM wants to market their new product by comparing it to the older one, run the both in running shoes, instead of having one wear slippers (pun intended)
But shouldn't the comparo's be based on if the upgrades were either options or stock? and if the "upgrades"(tires) were stock, that would make the ZL1 less desirable because of the frequency and expense of replacing the tires.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:23 PM   #112
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The point is its apples and oranges. The cars are built for different purchasers for different missions. And yes the ZL1 would perform better with upgrades, but any car can perform better with the right upgrades.
I don't understand how so many people are missing this point.....

If you want creature comforts get the ZL1, If you want a no frills car get the Z/28. There is no need for all of the hate... JMO
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