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Old 04-18-2013, 09:28 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
What else do you want in it? A stereo? Have a local shop install one. No big deal.
It IMO wont be much more than a ZL1.

LOL...no offense to those that do this. I haven't changed out a head unit on a car since probably the early 90's. Its just not my cup of tea. Don't like the non factory look.
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:30 PM   #114
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LOL...no offense to those that do this. I haven't changed out a head unit on a car since probably the early 90's. Its just not my cup of tea. Don't like the non factory look.
Then have speakers put in with the stereo in it.
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:32 PM   #115
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They apparently only removed the carpet and sound deadener in the trunk. Big deal put it in.

"Removed interior sound deadener and carpeting from the trunk"

Then order the AC. It's been said over and over again by former GM engineers that crank windows would add weight (and HUGE cost) for new cars.
As for the windows part, its a way of making a point to those who say "well its not a Z/28 then".

Same as when they got rid of flip up lights on the Corvette.

You keep saying put on this and add that. Now my 70-80K Camaro is skyrocketing up in price even more. That's my point. Add stereo, add AC, Add carpeting and sound deadening material. As opposed to using lighter rims or smaller rims. Lighter weight body materials, etc etc.
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:33 PM   #116
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Then have speakers put in with the stereo in it.
Maybe Im wrong but didn't I read that the wiring is even deleted.
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:36 PM   #117
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As for the windows part, its a way of making a point to those who say "well its not a Z/28 then".

Same as when they got rid of flip up lights on the Corvette.

You keep saying put on this and add that. Now my 70-80K Camaro is skyrocketing up in price even more. That's my point. Add stereo, add AC, Add carpeting and sound deadening material. As opposed to using lighter rims or smaller rims. Lighter weight body materials, etc etc.
I'd say that ship has already sailed...It is what it is, not gonna be different at this point...
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:41 PM   #118
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Maybe Im wrong but didn't I read that the wiring is even deleted.
Dude c'mon?!
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Old 04-18-2013, 09:44 PM   #119
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As for the windows part, its a way of making a point to those who say "well its not a Z/28 then".

Same as when they got rid of flip up lights on the Corvette.

You keep saying put on this and add that. Now my 70-80K Camaro is skyrocketing up in price even more. That's my point. Add stereo, add AC, Add carpeting and sound deadening material. As opposed to using lighter rims or smaller rims. Lighter weight body materials, etc etc.
Really crank windows make it a Z/28?
It obviously has very light weight and smaller rims. I guess you missed my post stating that only the trunk is missing carpet and sound deadening. Your arguments are not reasonable.
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:17 PM   #120
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Blah blah blah, a bunch of ... Blah blah
The z/28 is meant for the hardcore. THIS, you seem to not understand. Look at everything they did to the car, removed a/c, sound, rear glass, wiring, CCR... Even though some of this makes veeeery little to no difference on the track, it's so that GM could back themselves up when they say that this car is made for the HARDCORE track enthusiast. Sure there are other things they could have done, like using lighter chassis components, suspension, etc.. But then the production costs rocket. They had to work with the platform they have which is heavy.

Like GM has said, this car is meant for the track rat... They don't care that you like a/c. Or sound. If you do, they WILL tell you to get a zl1, and stay away from the z/28. if you REALLY want the z/28, you can still option a/c in.

Besides, who is gonna DD a car with 40 treadware tires?

Edit: 60 tw, not 40... Whoops
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:27 PM   #121
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Like GM has said, this car is meant for the track rat..

Besides, who is gonna DD a car with 40 treadware tires?
Maybe the same guy who would use his blinkers to change lane positions on the race-track?...lol...
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:35 PM   #122
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The discussion I am trying to have is that if this is a track superstar Camaro that is specifically built for racing warriors. Then its silly to only be able to use it in a friendly track day setting. Just for shits and giggles.
OK. It's painfully obvious you don't attend track days. How is building/selling a car for track days silly? Those of us that track as a hobby find a production car aimed for us specifically very appealing and refreshing. Yes, it's for shits and giggles. It's a track TOY. Why would you want to make a TOY practical? NOTHING about the car is practical. That's what a Camry is for.

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Its like we are saying "Hey look, we took out the carpet, left one speaker, put these massive breaks on it so the less than one half of one percent of the worlds population would be ok to race it in a friendly only setting"
1) it's spelled BRAKES not break
2) less than 0.5% of the world's population is a HUGE number of Camaros in general to sell. That's about 35 million cars.

Yes. This car is aimed for a very small segment of buyers. Very small. Very niche. If you are complaining about the car, it wasn't meant for you. It's a tough pill to swallow for some. What is wrong with the ZL1? You just don't like the badge?

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Tell me if you believe they couldn't save 300 lbs elsewhere through materials, or parts that wouldn't compromise it as a daily? If your answer is yes, then they should of gone this route, cut off the ceramics priced it just a hair above the ZL1 and sold a lot more of them to Camaro Enthusiasts.
1) Perhaps to Camaro enthusiasts that want to pretend they are 'hardcore', but not track day enthusiasts, which is who the Z/28 was built for.
2) We don't know what the Z/28 will be priced at. I personally think it will cost more than the ZL1, but not by a lot, which is what you are asking for.
3) You seem fixated on the ceramics. With a car that weighs 3800 pounds, brake fade/overheat is going to be a problem IF YOU TRACK THE CAR, and the ceramics are the solution to that problem.
4) The concept of removing A/C and stereo on a track/enthusiast focused car is not new:
The original Subaru STi: had no speakers or stereo.
Porsche Boxster Spyder and Cayman R: no radio, no A/C
Porsche GT3RS: A/C delete and radio delete available

All the people whining about the Z/28 have no intention of ever tracking the car and want it as a daily driver. You're whining because it's the wrong car for YOU.
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:36 PM   #123
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Maybe the same guy who would use his blinkers to change lane positions on the race-track?...lol...
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Old 04-18-2013, 11:25 PM   #124
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hmmm, nope

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Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
FAIL! Use a 1/4 calculator and you get 11.8.
Keep dreaming. That calculator apparently doesn't work right. The 2012 Z06 with 800 less lbs does a 11.9 (by motortrend) The obese camaro, even on a diet, will still only ne a 12.6 at best.

Keep hoping, and prepare for disappointment. I wouldn't be surprised if the Z/28 is slower at the Ring also. The track that the Z/28 was faster than the ZL1 on had only a 0.3 mile straight and was a heavy brake and traction type track. the Ring with big straights and bumpy surfaces is ZL1 mag ride territory. Sorry.

Hell, slap those tires and wheels on the ZL1 and bye bye Z/28.

I am a fan of the Camaro (have). And a fan of the LS7 (had). But have little faith in the LS7 towing the camaro's big butt around.
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Old 04-18-2013, 11:33 PM   #125
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Have any proof?
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You skipped my question so I will ask again.... Can you show me where the SCCA has stated that the Z/28 will not be allowed to run in any class?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet Zness View Post
The discussion I am trying to have is that if this is a track superstar Camaro that is specifically built for racing warriors. Then its silly to only be able to use it in a friendly track day setting. Just for shits and giggles.
You seem to be conveniently ignoring my question. Where does it say in the SCCA rule book that the Z/28 will not be allowed to run in ANY class?
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Old 04-18-2013, 11:47 PM   #126
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Keep dreaming. That calculator apparently doesn't work right. The 2012 Z06 with 800 less lbs does a 11.9 (by motortrend) The obese camaro, even on a diet, will still only ne a 12.6 at best.

Keep hoping, and prepare for disappointment. I wouldn't be surprised if the Z/28 is slower at the Ring also. The track that the Z/28 was faster than the ZL1 on had only a 0.3 mile straight and was a heavy brake and traction type track. the Ring with big straights and bumpy surfaces is ZL1 mag ride territory. Sorry.

Hell, slap those tires and wheels on the ZL1 and bye bye Z/28.

I am a fan of the Camaro (have). And a fan of the LS7 (had). But have little faith in the LS7 towing the camaro's big butt around.


the ZL1 has a p/w ratio of 7.1lbs/hp. the z/28 (with 500 hp) is at 7.64 at 3820lbs, which is 300 less than zl1 coupe. now if you add 35 hp to the z/28, it will bump the p/w ratio to 7.1lbs/hp, so really, in terms of p/w, the z/28 is only at a 35 hp disadvantage.

with that disadvantage in mind, the addition of CC brakes, upgraded suspension, lighter wheels with 305's on all 4 corners, aero, 60tw tires, etc... makes up for that loss of 35 hp, and surpasses it.


yeeeaaaahhh, theres no way your beloved zl1 will beat it at the ring. just trust me on this one buddy.

to answer the OP, I think the Z.28 will run the quarter in 12.3. two tenths off the motortrend zl1 time.
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