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Old 02-20-2008, 07:53 PM   #1
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Smile NEW FIREBIRD

Ok ive got some news. There is a good chance we will be seeing a firebird too. If you go to www.chevynation.com you can go to some places and one of the workers said they were working on the firebird and camaro.And i have investigated and look at this http://www.leftlanenews.com/wp-conte...64&idg=4&idi=1 all these cars have a little different shape on the rear.
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Old 02-20-2008, 07:59 PM   #2
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Still need more evidence ;\
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Old 02-20-2008, 09:42 PM   #3
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Can you link the article, please?
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Old 02-20-2008, 09:45 PM   #4
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mmm...not doin' it for me, unfortunately. The pic you posted really doesn't show any difference. In fact, the closer I look - the more alike they seem to get?!

And what about Chevy Nation? I didn't understand that part...

Suffice it to say that there will be no Firebird anytime soon. Projects with much more potential are being put on hold at GM, and Pontiac is being restructured as we speak, so.......sorry?

It's not that I wouldn't want to see it back. I mean, heck, that would be amazing to have those two out on the roads again - but I'd much rather see GM succeed with one great car instead of pouring money into a a second, low-volume car...
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Old 02-20-2008, 11:14 PM   #5
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We started a thread about Pontiac having/not having new models without me?
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Old 02-20-2008, 11:18 PM   #6
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We started a thread about Pontiac having/not having new models without me?
Yeah, cause we all know how well the last one turned out.
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Old 02-21-2008, 01:31 AM   #7
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Ok ive got some news. There is a good chance we will be seeing a firebird too. If you go to www.chevynation.com you can go to some places and one of the workers said they were working on the firebird and camaro.And i have investigated and look at this http://www.leftlanenews.com/wp-conte...64&idg=4&idi=1 all these cars have a little different shape on the rear.
I'm lost...
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Old 02-21-2008, 07:39 AM   #8
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Not gonna happen.
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Old 02-21-2008, 09:53 AM   #9
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Yay for troll +1...

Firebird is dead, GM doesnt even own the license to use the name anymore..
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Old 02-21-2008, 09:56 AM   #10
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Not a chance that is a firebird in that picture or it is being brought back.
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Old 02-21-2008, 03:41 PM   #11
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ok go to chevy nation go to club house click on camaro and then go to insiders perspective new camaro and 1 of those says it.
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Old 02-21-2008, 03:59 PM   #12
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Dude, put the crack pipe down, Cheryl is talking about when she was on the design team for the 4 gen Camaro/Firebird.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:13 PM   #13
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Firebird is dead, GM doesnt even own the license to use the name anymore..
I'd heard that some video game companies have trouble putting old Firebirds in video games because of the naming rights. Who has the rights to the Firebird name these days?
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:35 PM   #14
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:46 PM   #15
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OK WAIT AND SEE
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:52 PM   #16
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OK WAIT AND SEE
I waited, and this is what I saw.

Quote:
Since Buick, Pontiac and GMC dealers are in the process of consolidating their showrooms, many were likely hoping for a halo product that could draw customers into the showroom. Hey, wouldn't a version of the upcoming Chevy Camaro badged as a Pontiac Trans Am revival do the trick? Maybe, but at the NADA conference this week, GM told these dealers that a Pontiac Trans Am is not going to happen.
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/02/12/g...tiac-trans-am/
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:59 PM   #17
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The only other RWD project for Pontiac that I've heard about is the Alpha based small/midsizer that could be a G6 replacement. Its sounds now like that has been put on ice too. As discussed in the previous Pontiac thread, most of GM's RWD plans are being reconsidered and are on dangerously thin ice if not dead already. Enjoy the Camaro and G8 while you can, because even those would have been canceled if they were not so far along. So I'd expect for the Pontiac lineup to stay pretty much the same for the next few years. My guess is the only major change will be replacing the G8 with a rebadge of some other GM FWD family car at the end of its current life cycle. Also, if the new Matrix doesn't sell too well Toyota may back out of that. I have no idea how that partnership is structured so I don't know how it would really pan out, but I assume there would be some effect on the Vibe.

edit: Speaking of NUMMI, here's this:
http://www.leftlanenews.com/nhtsa-in...d-corolla.html

This in addition to previous complaints of quality problems. Too bad GM allowed themselves to become a part of Toyota's mess.

Last edited by stovt001; 02-21-2008 at 05:10 PM. Reason: More information.
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:04 PM   #18
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Enjoy the Camaro and G8 while you can, because even those would have been canceled if they were not so far along. So I'd expect for the Pontiac lineup to stay pretty much the same for the next few years.
I feel really bad for the Holden folks that build the G8. They're going to lose their asses if the G8 tanks. I just read an article saying that something like half of the Elizabeth plant's output goes to export vehicles. (US/Canadian G8, Middle East Chevy Lumina/Holden Statesman, Chinese cars, etc)
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Old 02-21-2008, 07:07 PM   #19
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I feel really bad for the Holden folks that build the G8. They're going to lose their asses if the G8 tanks. I just read an article saying that something like half of the Elizabeth plant's output goes to export vehicles. (US/Canadian G8, Middle East Chevy Lumina/Holden Statesman, Chinese cars, etc)
60,000 cars isn't a HUGE deal for them, though...the plant is at near if not beyond capacity. GM is making Australia the Performance Capital of the world it seems...

Oh, and keep it civil, folks...*coughcrackpipecommentcough*

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ok go to chevy nation go to club house click on camaro and then go to insiders perspective new camaro and 1 of those says it.
"Moving from the 3rd generation Car to the 4th generation car; first of all, our whole team - we were so excited at the Milford Proving grounds. A bunch of young engineers working on a new Camaro and Firebird...ah, what more could you ask for? It was just a great, great oppurtunity - and we were thrilled."

Is this what you're talking about? It's an excerpt of what Cheryl was saying....
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:15 PM   #20
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The only other RWD project for Pontiac that I've heard about is the Alpha based small/midsizer that could be a G6 replacement. Its sounds now like that has been put on ice too. As discussed in the previous Pontiac thread, most of GM's RWD plans are being reconsidered and are on dangerously thin ice if not dead already. Enjoy the Camaro and G8 while you can, because even those would have been canceled if they were not so far along. So I'd expect for the Pontiac lineup to stay pretty much the same for the next few years. My guess is the only major change will be replacing the G8 with a rebadge of some other GM FWD family car at the end of its current life cycle. Also, if the new Matrix doesn't sell too well Toyota may back out of that. I have no idea how that partnership is structured so I don't know how it would really pan out, but I assume there would be some effect on the Vibe.

edit: Speaking of NUMMI, here's this:
http://www.leftlanenews.com/nhtsa-in...d-corolla.html

This in addition to previous complaints of quality problems. Too bad GM allowed themselves to become a part of Toyota's mess.

Pontiac and GM has some projects on hold, doesn't mean they will kill all of them. Sounds more along the lines of figuring out a new strategy with the RWD projects to make them successful with the regulations, but thats another story that was explained in the previous Pontiac thread.

I agree with everyone else that says there will be no firebird also, if GM finds a way to get the name back then maybe? Quick question for anyone that knows, does the Firebird name include the Trans Am name as well? Or is it just the Firebird name?
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:29 PM   #21
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I believe Trans Am has ALWAYS been licensed by some racing group (I will have to look it up) and GM paid , YES PAID, to use the name for their car. The racing group allowed it because it was good publicity. Give me a day to look up the info, if i recall correctly it was Scott (fbodfather) that gave the details..
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:33 PM   #22
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Interesting, was the Phoenix symbol also a borrowed thing or was that inovated by GM? i just got all kinds of questions >_<
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:51 PM   #23
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Here we go... link to source at the bottom..

Quote:
. Will the Firebird Return?

If you mean as a clone of the Camaro, nope.
A few people from GM have weighed in on this since the concept came out last January. Although the common thread is never say never, the thing that comes through is that IF GM used the Firebird name, it would be on a car very different from the Camaro.


2. Will the Trans Am name ever return?

To paraphrase Chris Tucker, not only no, but H*LL NO!!!
The problem as mentioned is that the Trans Am name is owned by the SCCA (www.SCCA.org). To make a long story short, John Delorean who had a habit of stealing race course names to apply to Pontiacs earned GM a threatened lawsuit when the Trans Am name was used on a Firebird appearence package. GM settled by giving $5 to the SCCA for each Trans Am sold. GM tried to get out of the deal when the 3rd gen Firebirds came out by naming the performance version T/A, which was dropped when the SCCA again threatened legal action, and GM decided using the full name & paying $5 per car was easier and cheaper than tying up their legal department when there was bigger fish to fry.

With the lapse in production, GM would have to renegotiate the useage of the Trans Am name with the SCCA, who will no doubt demand alot more than $5 per car. After 40 years of inflation and an equally long amount of built up fans, not to mention being locked to a $5 royalty that became relatively worthless by the time "Smokey and the Bandit" came out (we had runaway inflation in the 70s), you can't blame them. With all the other names GM owns and can create, GM would probally rather stick forks in their eyes than give away money to use the Trans Am name again.

To top it off, Pontiac no more wants to be associated with the historic Pontiac Trans Ams any more than Buick wants to be associated with Grand Nationals (another revenue negative name that has zero chance of returning).


3. What is the most likely way the Firebird name will return?

As a mid sized, G6 sedan replacement........ relax, I'm just kidding.

In order, first most likely the Firebird will be a sports coupe version spinoff of GM's upcoming small RWD architecture the way Camaro is a spinoff of Kappa. The next most likely candidate is a GTO-like car based on Camaro. Basically a high content, low-to-no option car that would start well into the $30K range. The $32,000 WS6 Trans Am was the most popular Firebird while the cheap Formula LS1 barely sold 1000 cars it's final year. Firebird customers have been far more willing to pay almost ridiculous amounts of money compared to the prices on the same car in Camaro showrooms.


4. Is it possible that if the Camaro is a success, then Pontiac will have a Firebird the following year or 2 later?

Only in the minds of 2nd tier car rags and never-say-die Pontiac enthusiasts..... as if GM would make a Camaro if they didn't expect it to be a success.

If the coupe market Exploded (as in with a capital "E"!), then we have an entirely different set of circumstances. But even then, expecting a Camaro with a Pontiac nose grafted on and new tail lights ala previous Firebirds and marketed to people who want a "Pontiac Camaro", again isn't going to happen. We'd probally see an upmarket coupe with a different personality and different pricing as I mentioned.

Also, it takes at least 18 months from approval to get a car to showrooms. No automaker is going to bring out a new vehicle, sit around and wait for the 1st year figures, then bring out a model the following year. Anything that comes out within a 2 year timeframe was already planned.

In short, whatever Camaro spinoff that comes along 1 to 2 years later didn't come along simply because anyone waited to see how Camaro would sell.
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Old 02-22-2008, 12:54 AM   #24
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60,000 cars isn't a HUGE deal for them, though...the plant is at near if not beyond capacity. GM is making Australia the Performance Capital of the world it seems...
I'm all for GM making Australia its performance car capital. Good things are coming out of there. Hopefully the Holden-designed cars really take off and GM can actually expand their assets and operations there.
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Old 02-22-2008, 02:26 AM   #25
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diarmadhi, thanks for posting up that link and conversation. That's exactly what I was thinking of when this subject came up.

Sorry shank. Even though I'd like to see more musclecars out there (preferably from GM), the Firebird and TA just won't happen. We have been told to keep an eye out for something from Pontiac in the near future. But, not either one of those two mentioned will be it.
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