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Cosmetic Maintenance: Washing, Waxing, Detailing, Bodywork, Protection Anything related to keeping your Camaro clean and in good cosmetic condition.

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Old 06-21-2013, 07:30 PM   #1
AmericanMuscleCars
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Flex or Porter Cable?

Just wondering which one is better for a beginner?
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Old 06-21-2013, 07:38 PM   #2
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Flex for sure. If you have me down there, I can show you how to use a buffer and you'll be happy you went with the flex instead of the PC.

PC is seriously underpowered IMO. Not that it doesn't work, just that it doesn't work fast.

Now if it was between the griots and the flex, you could argue either way.
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Old 06-21-2013, 07:44 PM   #3
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Flex for sure. If you have me down there, I can show you how to use a buffer and you'll be happy you went with the flex instead of the PC.

PC is seriously underpowered IMO. Not that it doesn't work, just that it doesn't work fast.

Now if it was between the griots and the flex, you could argue either way.
Now is the flex a random orbit? You don't want to burn a hole in the paint, thats why i thought people wanted to go with the porter cable.
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Old 06-21-2013, 07:46 PM   #4
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Now is the flex a random orbit? You don't want to burn a hole in the paint, thats why i thought people wanted to go with the porter cable.
No the flex is not a random orbital
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Old 06-21-2013, 07:49 PM   #5
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No the flex is not a random orbital
So, it can burn o hole through the paint?
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:00 PM   #6
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So, it can burn o hole through the paint?
not exactly. It's a little weird as it's in a class of its own. It is a forced rotation dual action polisher.

It's pretty hard to do harm with a machine other than a true rotary.

It's possible with the Flex, but it's highly unlikely because in my opinion you'd have to try to burn the paint through to get it to do it.

In other words, you'd have to be really rather stupid to do harm with any machine other than a rotary.
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:18 PM   #7
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Well here Adam says it is a random orbit. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...Uo8DQtY#at=175
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:22 PM   #8
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not exactly. It's a little weird as it's in a class of its own. It is a forced rotation dual action polisher.

It's pretty hard to do harm with a machine other than a true rotary.

It's possible with the Flex, but it's highly unlikely because in my opinion you'd have to try to burn the paint through to get it to do it.

In other words, you'd have to be really rather stupid to do harm with any machine other than a rotary.
Very well said.
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Old 06-21-2013, 08:27 PM   #9
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The Flex is an orbital, it has more power than the PC because it also has forced rotation.
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Old 06-22-2013, 12:49 AM   #10
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Griots garage. I actually got mine for 85 bucks brand new from advanceautoparts with a coupon.

Much much much better than the PC. I have had both.

The PC feels so underpowered compared to the griots.

speed 2 on the griots is like speed 4 on the pc.

the pc also bogs down like crazy when applying any pressure. this is not good for heavy correction.


Now the reason i sold my pc and bought the griots..........Lifteme Warranty no questions asked. o didnt even know about the power difference before. They have one of the best warranties i have ever used and they honor it.

I wouldnt get the flex unless you are proffesional and will be correcting paint daily.

if your gonna correct once or twice a week get the griots.
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Old 06-23-2013, 11:32 PM   #11
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No the flex is not a random orbital
I believe the Griots are if I'm correct- yes?
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Old 06-23-2013, 11:35 PM   #12
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I believe the Griots are if I'm correct- yes?
yes
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Old 06-24-2013, 09:02 AM   #13
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I also have the PC and totally agree with the "feels under powered" statements. I am currently looking to get a Flex or possibly the Griots but I dont know much about those.
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Old 06-24-2013, 01:58 PM   #14
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I own the Griots and love it, havent used the PC.
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Old 06-24-2013, 03:51 PM   #15
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I've had great results with my PC and it is safer than the Flex.
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Old 06-24-2013, 04:56 PM   #16
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I've been using the Porter-Cable Car Buffer from Coastal Tool for almost 10 years, been a great tool in my opinion.....polish/wax and supplies by Chemical Guys.
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Old 06-24-2013, 07:04 PM   #17
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The terms "dual action" and "random orbit" get tossed around pretty interchangeably. Right wrong or otherwise. Our new video series that will be released soon features a chapter that completely goes thru the different machine types out there and what that means to the user.

The Flex is a true DUAL action machine. It combines two (thus the 'dual') movements simultaneously. The head oscillates at up to 9600 times a minute with a gear driven rotation of up to 480 revolutions per minute.

The Porter Cable, Griots, and similar tools are random orbital... meaning they oscillate only, with no driven rotation. The centrifugal force of the oscillation causes the pad to rotate, but there is no driven rotation, so the speed at which the head rotates is purely dictated by the OPM speed and the pressure applied by the operator.

In essence you can put enough pressure down on the PC or GG to stop the rotation. The Flex on the other hand no matter how hard you press it will continue to rotate while it oscillates.

Now - the Flex does have more power than most other tools without the forced rotation, but its not a rotary buffer. The chances of 'burning' or striking thru your paint are still extremely low. So low that it would essentially require you to do something purposely negligent to cause damage.
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Old 06-24-2013, 08:11 PM   #18
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I have both a PC and a Flex.I use the flex to remove swirls with fewer passes and maintain the paint with my pc.
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Old 06-25-2013, 12:22 AM   #19
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The terms "dual action" and "random orbit" get tossed around pretty interchangeably. Right wrong or otherwise. Our new video series that will be released soon features a chapter that completely goes thru the different machine types out there and what that means to the user.

The Flex is a true DUAL action machine. It combines two (thus the 'dual') movements simultaneously. The head oscillates at up to 9600 times a minute with a gear driven rotation of up to 480 revolutions per minute.

The Porter Cable, Griots, and similar tools are random orbital... meaning they oscillate only, with no driven rotation. The centripetal force of the oscillation causes the pad to rotate, but there is no driven rotation, so the speed at which the head rotates is purely dictated by the OPM speed and the pressure applied by the operator.

In essence you can put enough pressure down on the PC or GG to stop the rotation. The Flex on the other hand no matter how hard you press it will continue to rotate while it oscillates.

Now - the Flex does have more power than most other tools without the forced rotation, but its not a rotary buffer. The chances of 'burning' or striking thru your paint are still extremely low. So low that it would essentially require you to do something purposely negligent to cause damage.

Interesting . . . I've been using the PC for years now and have been happy with it but may look into trying something new.

And Dylan since I'm a nerdy physicist I had to fix your language . . . centrifugal force is a fictional force perceived by an object in circular motion (think of the the carnival rides where you spin in a vertical cylinder and the floor drops out - it FEELS like you're being pressed against the wall; however, the only forces acting on you are the CENTRIPETAL force (in this case a normal force that points towards the center of the circle) provided by the wall of the cylinder forcing you to undergo circular motion, the force of static friction and gravity).

Sorry. You can flame me now for being a dork.
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Old 06-25-2013, 01:40 AM   #20
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i heard rupes is also good.
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Old 06-25-2013, 02:06 AM   #21
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i heard rupes is also good.
The rupes is on another level
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Old 06-25-2013, 02:57 AM   #22
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tell me more about rupes, the price gap between flex xc 3401 vrg and rupes (wait im not sure which type) is not much different. like $50 i guess.
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Old 06-25-2013, 08:47 AM   #23
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tell me more about rupes, the price gap between flex xc 3401 vrg and rupes (wait im not sure which type) is not much different. like $50 i guess.
Going to a Rupes such as the 21 after using a Griots , Flex or PC is like the difference between day and night IMO. Having a 21mm stroke compared to a 6 or 8mm stroke it requires very little downward pressure for correction and is extremely smooth. After using other short stroke da's there is a short learning curve to using a long stroke machine . The smaller backing plate off of the 15 will fit the 21 and allow you to use smaller pads you may already have. I have four other assorted da machines that are now sitting on my shop cart while I reach for my Rupes. Next on my wish list is the air operated LHR75 3" machine to replace my Griots 3". I have used another friends LHR75 and it is one sweet machine. So having used various da's and rotaries I have no problem recommending the Rupes machines when you want the best and are going to spend that kind of cash think Rupes.
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Old 06-25-2013, 01:45 PM   #24
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I hate being the newb here , but what is the model number of the "Flex" you guys are talking about comparing the PC 7424xp to? The only flex I've seen is about 100 dollars more than the PC. Which is why I was wondering if it would be worth spending the extra money on the flex and if so, which model?
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Old 06-25-2013, 02:06 PM   #25
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The 3401 is the Flex with forced rotation. The higher price of this unit compared to a PC or Griots is why some are thinking about just moving on up to a Rupes
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