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Old 07-22-2013, 10:33 AM   #113
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Lucy, you have some 'splaining to do!

Assasinator asserts that Chev is failing by only building a few Z/28s. Just like Ford only built a few BOSS LS/yr. 1500 total. Tat for tit. Pot calling kettle "black".

IF (capitalized) Chev wanted to marginalize the Z/28 name (again?), they could have used it (appropriately) on the 1LE, and called it the "Base" Z/28. Just as Ford did with the "Base" BOSS, which btw was NOT the actual car used in all the magazine comparos. 8500 Base BOSSes allowed Ford to lower the price of the BOSS LS by spreading the engine development costs over a far greater number of cars. Even though those greater number of cars do NOT share performance capabilities equally, as produced by Ford.

1LE meets/exceeds the BOSS LS in cornering capabilities, let alone the Base BOSS, as per Lightning Lap with independent drivers, non-aligned with any specific Manufacturer.

Z/28 will exceed the capabilities of anything Ford attaches a VIN to, today, and will likely exceed the Ford GT as well. A car built by Ford, who was making cars the average person cannot obtain = fail. And the Z/28 will cost well less than HALF of the "birthday present to itself" Ford GT.

So who's really failing, here?

Understand now, Ricky?
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Old 07-22-2013, 12:40 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by SEVEN-OH JOE View Post
Assasinator asserts that Chev is failing by only building a few Z/28s. Just like Ford only built a few BOSS LS/yr. 1500 total. Tat for tit. Pot calling kettle "black".

IF (capitalized) Chev wanted to marginalize the Z/28 name (again?), they could have used it (appropriately) on the 1LE, and called it the "Base" Z/28. Just as Ford did with the "Base" BOSS, which btw was NOT the actual car used in all the magazine comparos. 8500 Base BOSSes allowed Ford to lower the price of the BOSS LS by spreading the engine development costs over a far greater number of cars. Even though those greater number of cars do NOT share performance capabilities equally, as produced by Ford.

1LE meets/exceeds the BOSS LS in cornering capabilities, let alone the Base BOSS, as per Lightning Lap with independent drivers, non-aligned with any specific Manufacturer.

Z/28 will exceed the capabilities of anything Ford attaches a VIN to, today, and will likely exceed the Ford GT as well. A car built by Ford, who was making cars the average person cannot obtain = fail. And the Z/28 will cost well less than HALF of the "birthday present to itself" Ford GT.

So who's really failing, here?

Understand now, Ricky?
You're basing this all on one comparison that wasn't same day same driver. The Boss LS time was from a year earlier
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Old 07-22-2013, 05:25 PM   #115
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You're basing this all on one comparison that wasn't same day same driver. The Boss LS time was from a year earlier
Are you familiar with the test methodology, and published results, of Lightning Lap? Several drivers test each vehicle, and the BEST LAP TIME is what's credited to the car.

All tests on the same course at VIR. This year, last year, next year. 5 years ago. A "fast time" at VIR is a pretty valid time, over the same course. And the $37,000 1LE beat the BOSS LS, which is without doubt quicker than a Base BOSS, the Ford Fans' favorite when quoting that $42,000 price. And, of course, the ZL1 beat the 500, which beat the LS. None of which stand a chance against the Z/28.

Even if, for argument's sake, we say the 1LE is only a MATCH for the LS, you're still $12,500 in pocket with the purchase of the 1LE. Speaking of who failed.
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Old 07-22-2013, 09:00 PM   #116
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hmmm
please check some facts:
I understand 750 Boss LS and 3500 Boss 302 per year was built
so a total of 8500 Boss over 2 years
....epic failure???

I have yet seen a Camaro 1LE at the track I go to
...I run about once a month

I'd love to see a 1LE at the track
I run at Eagles Canyon Raceway just north of Dallas

yes the Z28 so far sounds impressive, now lets see the price?
I know MSRP on Bosses were in the low to mid 40's
We get it. You have no skin in the Camaro game, CTS driver. It's cool about your observations. Maybe other manufacturers have more track drivers, it does not mean the Camaro product lacks any credibility. It might just lack drivers. But the sales to the manufacturer make all the difference, in the end, everyone enjoy's their car to their own liking.
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Old 07-22-2013, 09:43 PM   #117
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Are you familiar with the test methodology, and published results, of Lightning Lap? Several drivers test each vehicle, and the BEST LAP TIME is what's credited to the car.

All tests on the same course at VIR. This year, last year, next year. 5 years ago. A "fast time" at VIR is a pretty valid time, over the same course. And the $37,000 1LE beat the BOSS LS, which is without doubt quicker than a Base BOSS, the Ford Fans' favorite when quoting that $42,000 price. And, of course, the ZL1 beat the 500, which beat the LS. None of which stand a chance against the Z/28.

Even if, for argument's sake, we say the 1LE is only a MATCH for the LS, you're still $12,500 in pocket with the purchase of the 1LE. Speaking of who failed.
lol there is no helping you. You do realize they ran the 13 GT500 on a damp track this year, right? So much for the testing consistency. And the base Boss and the LS are the same car, just with an X brace on the LS, different tires, and a larger rear sway bar. A lot less differences then between the 1LE and the Z28, which has a different engine, transmission, suspension pick up points, etc. Like it has been mentioned, an LS hasn't been tested against a 1LE, and the only test of a Boss 302 vs the 1LE that was done at all was by popular mechanics.
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Old 07-23-2013, 03:49 AM   #118
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And that means exactly... Squat.
2 different drivers and that is a very old z06 2005 model.

Put the same driver in both with same year car and that vette will trounce that heavy camaro.

I'm sorry stock for stock you can't compare the 2.
One is a street brawler and the other a sports car made for the higher speeds and better handing.

Sure you shove enough aftermarket crap in anything it can be fast.. but it's going to cost you.

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Exactly....different drivers, track conditions. Sorry...Keep dreaming that the Z28 will outrun the Z06. 3800lbs vs 3100lbs with the same engine and hp? same track same driver. Will not even be close.
http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/laguna_seca.html

if we go by his reasoning then the 2013 GT500 is just as fast as a Corvette ZR1? The Z28 is going to be the best performing Camaro on a road course, it sure will be.
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Old 07-23-2013, 10:30 AM   #119
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lol there is no helping you. You do realize they ran the 13 GT500 on a damp track this year, right? So much for the testing consistency. And the base Boss and the LS are the same car, just with an X brace on the LS, different tires, and a larger rear sway bar. A lot less differences then between the 1LE and the Z28, which has a different engine, transmission, suspension pick up points, etc. Like it has been mentioned, an LS hasn't been tested against a 1LE, and the only test of a Boss 302 vs the 1LE that was done at all was by popular mechanics.
Yes and those tires are "R" compound and they added a racing style front splitter. It also has different shocks, springs, and weren't the bushings a harder compound? What about the Torsen differential, brake and transmission cooling?

I believe the transmissions are the same for the 1LE and Z/28. And it was Ford that didn't want the comparison test between the 1LE & Boss, otherwise it would have been done numerous times. Why didn't Ford want to compare? For review see comments from Popular Mechanics below:

"At GingerMan Raceway we fitted a Boss 302 and a Camaro SS 1LE with VBox testing gear, and after an afternoon of testing, the Camaro emerged victorious. The 1LE was 2.5 seconds faster per lap, with higher cornering grip. Subjectively, the Camaro is easier to drive very fast, with loads of traction and dead-on balance."

Read more: Ford Mustang Boss 302 vs. Chevy Camaro SS 1LE
Follow us: @PopMech on Twitter | popularmechanics on Facebook
Visit us at PopularMechanics.com
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:05 AM   #120
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The Z/28 is NOT a pure track car. I'm a fan of GM and everything they stand for but this is simply not true.
Yes we all understand that your just trying to justify your ZL1 finally satisfied. Once this Z/28 hits the lots you won't be satisfied any more you sorry soul.
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:10 AM   #121
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"I have yet seen a Camaro 1LE at the track I go to
...I run about once a month

I'd love to see a 1LE at the track
I run at Eagles Canyon Raceway just north of Dallas"


Send me some gas money and I will be happy to come down...
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:28 AM   #122
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my though is: a car must be driven everyday... its stupid to buy a 60K+ car and keep it hidden... but... this car doesnt make sense to me... and thats fine because I just go to the drag race 2 or 3 weakends per month... and this kind of car would be a none sense, The z/28 is an awsome car... but it never going to be compared to a GTR or other super car because you can easly use a GTR, AMG SLS, as your DD... because they arent a overpowered striped down version of the standard car ... I prefer 100 times an 1LE, ZL1, or a Hennesey camaro over this...
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Old 07-23-2013, 02:34 PM   #123
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Price Z28

Just talked to a dealership nere me, not telling you who....hahaha but below is what he stated (i had an allocation on a new ZL1 in 2011 with them but didnt go through; VERY stand up group, they quoted the ZL1 right on the nose when i was going to buy one.)

Doug!

My favorite bendonian! So we have two Allocations
For z28s. Should be placing the orders in August . Now we aware these things are pretty
Much race cars.... 1 speaker stereo system. .. Ac is an option
Stripped down pretty good. However it is gonna be one
Bad mother!
Pricing is a bit of a mystery at the moment but we r guessing
It will be much like the zl1 and hang In the 60's

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Old 07-23-2013, 05:14 PM   #124
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And in conclusion,

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
"At GingerMan Raceway we fitted a Boss 302 and a Camaro SS 1LE with VBox testing gear, and after an afternoon of testing, the Camaro emerged victorious. The 1LE was 2.5 seconds faster per lap, with higher cornering grip. Subjectively, the Camaro is easier to drive very fast, with loads of traction and dead-on balance."

Read more: Ford Mustang Boss 302 vs. Chevy Camaro SS 1LE
Follow us: @PopMech on Twitter | popularmechanics on Facebook
Visit us at PopularMechanics.com
Oh, NO!! Don't inject FACT into this discussion, 'cuz the whiny wieners won't have anything to base their argumentative rhetoric on.

The basis of this thread was "Z/28 Price", right? And the hypothesis was raised that the BOSS LS, if only built in a 1,500-total series, would have been very expensive, as well. Another 8,500 versions, festooned with different components and a wealth of available options, did little for the BOSS Brand except lower the Unit Cost/BOSS.

Suffice to say, to those fortunate few who actually secure a Gen-5 Z/28, their investment and results will make them smile a super-ultra-perma-grin. No poseurs need apply.
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Old 07-23-2013, 05:55 PM   #125
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Yes and those tires are "R" compound and they added a racing style front splitter. It also has different shocks, springs, and weren't the bushings a harder compound? What about the Torsen differential, brake and transmission cooling?

I believe the transmissions are the same for the 1LE and Z/28. And it was Ford that didn't want the comparison test between the 1LE & Boss, otherwise it would have been done numerous times. Why didn't Ford want to compare? For review see comments from Popular Mechanics below:

"At GingerMan Raceway we fitted a Boss 302 and a Camaro SS 1LE with VBox testing gear, and after an afternoon of testing, the Camaro emerged victorious. The 1LE was 2.5 seconds faster per lap, with higher cornering grip. Subjectively, the Camaro is easier to drive very fast, with loads of traction and dead-on balance."

Read more: Ford Mustang Boss 302 vs. Chevy Camaro SS 1LE
Follow us: @PopMech on Twitter | popularmechanics on Facebook
Visit us at PopularMechanics.com
Ford didn't want to? But yet they compare it to the ZL1 that was going to be a puppy kick anyways? Ford had nothing to do with it, the magazines could have done it if they wanted to, and Popular Mechanics and Automobile did. None of them compared the LS, and the only place it has been run is VIR for LL 2012.
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Old 07-23-2013, 06:06 PM   #126
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Ford didn't want to? But yet they compare it to the ZL1 that was going to be a puppy kick anyways? Ford had nothing to do with it, the magazines could have done it if they wanted to, and Popular Mechanics and Automobile did. None of them compared the LS, and the only place it has been run is VIR for LL 2012.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...k/viewall.html

"We hear you loud and clear -- you're wondering if maybe the Boss 302 might be a tougher opponent for the SS 1LE. Well, we asked Ford for a Boss and were politely refused."

Going against the ZL1 they had nothing to lose.
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