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Old 08-16-2013, 11:49 AM   #1
1LE Red Dragon
 
Drives: 2013 Camaro 1SS/1LE in VR
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2013 Camaro 1LE with Eforce installed.

Im not sure if I am the first 1LE to have an Eforce installed, but nonetheless here's my results:

My car is a 2013 1LE car with NPP exhaust. Everything 100% stock except for the supercharger.

I instantly blow away the tires in 1st gear at any RPM I hit it. Even with traction control on. It will spin hard and kick sideways when I nail it in second with traction control on. My car made 455 whp and 453 ft lbs on a low reading mustang dyno with high intake temps in the datalog.

I am not sure about 1st gear on a normal SS car, but my car will run about 54 miles an hour in 1st gear at redline. So I thought the 1st gear was a little taller than an normal SS and didnt really expect the traction to be so limited. There is really not enough traction to get any wheel hop.

I have the stock Edelbrock tune on my car currently. The fuel pressure in the datalog would go from 58 to 48.7 psig during the run. That was concerning, but I called the edelbrock Tech guy and he said there test cars had the same fuel pressure drop off. My car pulls extremely hard.

My car was datalogged on EFI live when on the Dyno. It was flowing about 55 lb/min air flow at about 5800 RPM when they let off and my duty cycle calculates to a max of about 80% as well based of 16.3 ms at 5800 RPM.

A concern somewhat: The dynos wideband data shows the car only running 11.4 at the richest and tapering up to 12.4 at 5800 RPM. But we are not sure we believe those numbers, since the wideband was taken from a sniffer run up the tailpipe after the cat. I also had virtually no Knock retard on the pulls, except at first throttle applicaiton. Then it smoothed out. The guy said they see that on the stock LS3 cars for some reason as well.

If I do anything more to the car, I know I will need to get the JRE fuel line upgrade, Fuel pressure controller, and a custom tune. But the car is so traction limited now I am not sure I would want much more. BTW, my car has the stock tires on it, and only 2900 miles.

The torque is a whole lot of FUN. That is for sure.
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Old 08-16-2013, 01:23 PM   #2
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Welcome to the boost club! Enjoy the extra power, when you can get it in to a shop for some dyno/street tunes. The canned tune isn't the greatest. Also when you decide you want more you don't need JRE fuel line upgrades, FPCM ... ZL1 pump is fine, add a BAP you'll be good 700+. Just need to get some injectors to meet your demands.
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Old 08-16-2013, 02:32 PM   #3
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Grab The JRE Fuel line upgrade It will save starvation of fuel to the 5 and 7 cylinders

Also ditch the Canned tune!

Enjoy! and welcome to the Eforce club
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Old 08-18-2013, 02:25 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epstein View Post
Grab The JRE Fuel line upgrade It will save starvation of fuel to the 5 and 7 cylinders

Also ditch the Canned tune!

Enjoy! and welcome to the Eforce club
I agree on the above. After can tune mine was runing very lean. As you can see from my sig, I have the JRE fuel rail upgrade kit, 72# injectors and ZL1 fuel pump. After a dyno tune I got 546/rwhp & 522/rwtq.
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Old 08-18-2013, 03:13 PM   #5
1LE Red Dragon
 
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When you were running the can tune from Edelbrock and running lean did you have a 100% bone stock car otherwise? Any mods at all?
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Old 08-19-2013, 10:40 PM   #6
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You need the ADM FPCM!!! Even though the 1LE has the ZL1 pump, you don't have the correct FPCM for the charger. My fuel pressure was dropping off just like yours until I bought the ADM and then sent Ted a new datalog. He wrote back saying fuel pressure is perfect, no drop off. I also had the MSD BAP from the very beginning, but fuel pressure did not level out until I got the ADM. It will need programmed after install. Good luck!!!
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Old 08-20-2013, 08:43 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1LE Red Dragon View Post
Im not sure if I am the first 1LE to have an Eforce installed, but nonetheless here's my results:

My car is a 2013 1LE car with NPP exhaust. Everything 100% stock except for the supercharger.

I instantly blow away the tires in 1st gear at any RPM I hit it. Even with traction control on. It will spin hard and kick sideways when I nail it in second with traction control on. My car made 455 whp and 453 ft lbs on a low reading mustang dyno with high intake temps in the datalog.

I am not sure about 1st gear on a normal SS car, but my car will run about 54 miles an hour in 1st gear at redline. So I thought the 1st gear was a little taller than an normal SS and didnt really expect the traction to be so limited. There is really not enough traction to get any wheel hop.

I have the stock Edelbrock tune on my car currently. The fuel pressure in the datalog would go from 58 to 48.7 psig during the run. That was concerning, but I called the edelbrock Tech guy and he said there test cars had the same fuel pressure drop off. My car pulls extremely hard.

My car was datalogged on EFI live when on the Dyno. It was flowing about 55 lb/min air flow at about 5800 RPM when they let off and my duty cycle calculates to a max of about 80% as well based of 16.3 ms at 5800 RPM.

A concern somewhat: The dynos wideband data shows the car only running 11.4 at the richest and tapering up to 12.4 at 5800 RPM. But we are not sure we believe those numbers, since the wideband was taken from a sniffer run up the tailpipe after the cat. I also had virtually no Knock retard on the pulls, except at first throttle applicaiton. Then it smoothed out. The guy said they see that on the stock LS3 cars for some reason as well.

If I do anything more to the car, I know I will need to get the JRE fuel line upgrade, Fuel pressure controller, and a custom tune. But the car is so traction limited now I am not sure I would want much more. BTW, my car has the stock tires on it, and only 2900 miles.

The torque is a whole lot of FUN. That is for sure.
We have recorded exactly what you saw fuel pressure dropping off, and AFR going Lean and nearly maxing out the injectors, I have reported this but Edelbrock feels it is fine.

I on the other hand I Respectfully disagree.

I suggest an ADM Fuel Pump Control Module, this will FIX your Fuel Pressure and reduce the duty cycle on the injectors, although it may not correct the lean condition.

I also recommend My fuel line upgrade to feed both rails and all injectors evenly.

I can also Provide a Custom Tune to further improve driveability, fuel economy and AFR at WOT.

Let me know How I can be of assistance.

Ted.
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Old 08-20-2013, 09:10 AM   #8
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My fuel pressure did drop off to 49 psi, however my duty cycle only peaked out at 80% during the pull. The pull was stopped about 5800 rpm because we though the a/f was at 12.4. The Edelbrock calibration tech looked atg the datalog and said the air fuel was reading off because we checked it out the back of the car and after the cats. He said the pull datalog looked comparable to their test cars. I think he compared air flow to injector Pulse width since the fuel pressure dropped off like mine did on their test cars too. There a/f readings upstream of the cats showed 11.1 to 11.2 with virtually the same injector pulse width per air flow numbers. That was how he determined the a/f readings we had were significantly leaner than what was actually happening. That makes since from a mechanical/engineering logic standpoint. And I have seen personally leaner readings out the tailpipe when compared to a wideband logged a/f in different cars. But typically we usually saw .5 to .7 a/f points leaner out the tailpipe.

On other note was that in looking at the log. About 5300 rpm, the cat protection circuit turned on. I'm guessing this is a derived EGT function of the O2 sensor before the cat. The power dropped off right about that rpm. Then came back up towards the end of the pull. Not sure if that's normal or not on a hot dyno with high IAT.
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Old 08-20-2013, 09:28 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1LE Red Dragon View Post
My fuel pressure did drop off to 49 psi, however my duty cycle only peaked out at 80% during the pull. The pull was stopped about 5800 rpm because we though the a/f was at 12.4. The Edelbrock calibration tech looked atg the datalog and said the air fuel was reading off because we checked it out the back of the car and after the cats. He said the pull datalog looked comparable to their test cars. I think he compared air flow to injector Pulse width since the fuel pressure dropped off like mine did on their test cars too. There a/f readings upstream of the cats showed 11.1 to 11.2 with virtually the same injector pulse width per air flow numbers. That was how he determined the a/f readings we had were significantly leaner than what was actually happening. That makes since from a mechanical/engineering logic standpoint. And I have seen personally leaner readings out the tailpipe when compared to a wideband logged a/f in different cars. But typically we usually saw .5 to .7 a/f points leaner out the tailpipe.

On other note was that in looking at the log. About 5300 rpm, the cat protection circuit turned on. I'm guessing this is a derived EGT function of the O2 sensor before the cat. The power dropped off right about that rpm. Then came back up towards the end of the pull. Not sure if that's normal or not on a hot dyno with high IAT.
I am certainly not wanting to argue or point any fingers, Just Trying to Help.

I Rarely ever use a tail pipe sensor so I can not comment on that.

But My Wide band in the front pipe ahead of the cats agrees with what you see.

It is Possible that we are on the East coast and use 93 octane as opposed to the 91 they have available and Maybe that Our Air quality is Better.

Ted.
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Old 08-20-2013, 01:48 PM   #10
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When you were running the can tune from Edelbrock and running lean did you have a 100% bone stock car otherwise? Any mods at all?
I already had Kooks LT headers, hi-flow cats and Roto-Fab CAI.
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:22 PM   #11
1LE Red Dragon
 
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That makes sense. The first thing they ask you when you call Tech dept is if you are ALL 100% stock. The dual mode exhaust they were kind of concerned about at first. Ha ha. I am not sure many people run these things 100% stock, even at the begining. So the tune with the stock car maybe a little on the hairy edge, let alone with other mods that will increase airflow or modify maf readings. I would expect the car to be safe at a minimum. Not optimized for power considering it needs to run from 91 to 93 octane fuel and be 50 state compliant. If the results are not on a 100% stock vehicle then they really cant even be compared to mine. IMO.

BTW, I do appreciate all the advice, input and expertise. I am not trying to argue with anyone, but rather trying to sort things out, and present all the information I know.

I like being in the Eforce club. I might eventually add some more mods. But in my experience the closer you can stay to stock, the more fun the car stays. But I am getting old, and enjoy being able to talk with my wife and kids while we are driving down the road. But the young kid in me still likes to go sideways when possible. Ideally I'd like a 600 whp car that sounds like my car does now. I just need to figure out how to do that.
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:26 PM   #12
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I already had Kooks LT headers, hi-flow cats and Roto-Fab CAI.
Those 2 Items will definitely make it lean and require custom tuning.
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