Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
ModBargains
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > General Camaro Forums > Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics

Camaro Z/28 Forum - Z/28 Specific Topics Discussions related to the 5th gen Camaro Z/28 model

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-23-2013, 09:25 AM   #26
silverds
2013 ZL1 #844
 
silverds's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 CAMARO ZL1 #844
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 528
There's no bible or commandments that say a specific model car or name is restricted by any of its characteristics. The auto makers have the freedom to name their products however they choose, to sell the most of them.

The Chevrolet Malibu, Impala and Dodge Charger are now 4 door sedans and are well accepted as such, though originally they were all 2 Door coupes. 40 Years from now we may see a 4 door Camaro Z/28. Then we can all listen to the live feeds of arguments on Camaro10.com about what the Camaro Z/28 name really meant. I wonder which crowd will be considered confused then.

Our great, great grand children may be very happy to reminisce about out passion for the Z/28 when they buy their first Camaro Z/28 People Mover.

__________________
silverds is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2013, 05:57 PM   #27
Cpanthers85
 
Drives: 2011 Camaro 2SS RS
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 438
Even if you want to argue that the "ZL1" was named improperly, what could they have named it? The IROC? The SS3? They already used 1LE.

The Z/28 is perfect. It's a high revving, high powered, track ready car. Sure, its not a 302, but still...it beats what they did in gens 2-4. My 79 Z28 has a 350 rated at 150hp. barf.

While we're at it, why did GM call it the Chevy SS? Ressurrect the Chevelle or Nova.
__________________
2011 2SS/RS L99
2009 Cobalt SS
1979 Z28

Mods: Kooks Long Tube Headers, RotoFaB EForce CAI, American Thunder Catback Exhaust, PFADT Stage 1 Drag Kit + Front Sway Bar, GM Strut Tower Bar. ZL1 Fuel Pump. Nitto NT05R. RX Catch Can.LS9 Cam and Springs.LS3 Conversion.JRE Fuel Rail Upgrade.Edelbrock Eforce.60# Eforce Injectors.Extreme Racing Tune. 523/495

MY BUILD THREAD
Cpanthers85 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2013, 06:08 PM   #28
sanjosebmx
 
sanjosebmx's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 2SS Synergy Green
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Ripon, CA
Posts: 380
Quote:
Originally Posted by TPAJETSKI View Post
I'm not sure I understand the desire wax nostalgic about the Z28. (regardless of whether you want to play semantics with they hyphen or slash). The Z28 spent most of its history slapped on to the side of cars that were overweight and under powered. I don't care if there are two jet engines strapped to it and creates more g force than an f-16 I refuse to pay corvette money for a camaro. They should have left the track capabilities to the ZL1. Get a 1SS, stuff a 427 in it, add the 1LE suspension bits, and there you have it a Z28.

When I think of the z/28 I think of my friends '69.. 302, solid lift cam..dual 4bbl manifold (as delivered in the trunk)..4 speed..

You had to ride in one to know what I'm talking about..
__________________
sanjosebmx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-2013, 09:57 PM   #29
macalot
 
Drives: 69 Z28 since '73
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh Area, Pa
Posts: 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjosebmx View Post
When I think of the z/28 I think of my friends '69.. 302, solid lift cam..dual 4bbl manifold (as delivered in the trunk)..4 speed..

You had to ride in one to know what I'm talking about..
I still get "the feeling" every so often, however mine is a single 4bbl like most. In fact the original owner of my car put two 4's on it (aftermarket), but couldn't get it tuned just right and pulled them off.
macalot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 10:22 AM   #30
LOWDOWN
Downright Upright
 
LOWDOWN's Avatar
 
Drives: Daily
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Cruisin'...
Posts: 4,005
Cross Rams not streetable? Holy...you mean 2-4s were too much for 302 cu. in.?? Hmmmmm...

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...ved-comparison
__________________
LOWDOWN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 10:46 AM   #31
mlee
H-Town Camaro Club
 
mlee's Avatar
 
Drives: Number Twenty-Three
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Conroe, TX
Posts: 24,187
Al nailed it with this decision. The OP is used seeing the loaded Z28 and we have the Z/28 track car.

The most powerful car was always the ZL1 which we now have again. Two cars to choose from instead of one, and both true to form.
__________________
.
mlee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 07:35 PM   #32
OldScoolCamaro


 
Drives: Camaro's, always have, always will.
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Home of the brave
Posts: 4,859
Quote:
Originally Posted by f5journal View Post
Agree...however GM is partly to blame with their treatment of the Z-28 in later years. They sortof confused the younger crowd here.
...I concur. It is confusing for someone coming into the market at a late stage to fully grasp and understand the lineage.
__________________
In Scott We Trust...all others must show proof.
OldScoolCamaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 07:57 PM   #33
batman53201
Account not blocked
 
batman53201's Avatar
 
Drives: The Batmobile
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 2,527
i wish i could afford one
__________________
batman53201 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 10:51 PM   #34
OldScoolCamaro


 
Drives: Camaro's, always have, always will.
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Home of the brave
Posts: 4,859
...maybe we can? Speculation only exists so far....word is north of 56K.....
__________________
In Scott We Trust...all others must show proof.
OldScoolCamaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-2013, 11:12 PM   #35
Fraxum


 
Fraxum's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 TT IOM 1LE
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: South NJ
Posts: 2,709
Send a message via AIM to Fraxum
Camaro historians correct me if I step on the truth. The original ZL1 as all COPOs, and the Z/28 could be ordered with any Camaro option except A/C. But most COPOs at least were strippers.

The current naming makes great sense. The Z/28 is the car with road racing as a major influence to its genetics in both cases. The ZL1 is a heavier car (as were the big block COPOs, but maybe not the original ZL1) that with good drag racing prep, could smash the Z/28 in the quarter mile. This will be true with the current cars too. The current ZL1 is no too hard to get into the 10s to follow the parallels.

The original COPOs were mostly used as race cars, so that name makes sense too.

The one big difference in the current ZL1 is that it is a good road track car as well a fast car in the 1/4 mile. But on a road track it will have to take a back seat to the Z/28 as this is what the was Z/28 bred for.

I think the Z/28 name was sullied in Gen 3 + 4 Camaros. GM is trying to re-establish the Z/28 image in the best way possible, with results at the track. We shall see.
__________________

The 1LE Inferno build thread
More Seat Time. Thinking the 1LE is a keeper.
Fraxum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 12:13 AM   #36
brt3
Runs with scissors...
 
brt3's Avatar
 
Drives: '14 Z/28s SIM/SW
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,004
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlee View Post
Al nailed it with this decision. The OP is used seeing the loaded Z28 and we have the Z/28 track car.

The most powerful car was always the ZL1 which we now have again. Two cars to choose from instead of one, and both true to form.
+1 -- I'm sticking with Al on this one. As far as I'm concerned, he's one of the True Keepers Of The Flame...
__________________
brt3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 10:26 AM   #37
DrkPhx

 
DrkPhx's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 Triple Black ZL1 / 2006 TB SS
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: St Michael, MN
Posts: 906
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraxum View Post
Camaro historians correct me if I step on the truth. The original ZL1 as all COPOs, and the Z/28 could be ordered with any Camaro option except A/C. But most COPOs at least were strippers.

The current naming makes great sense. The Z/28 is the car with road racing as a major influence to its genetics in both cases. The ZL1 is a heavier car (as were the big block COPOs, but maybe not the original ZL1) that with good drag racing prep, could smash the Z/28 in the quarter mile. This will be true with the current cars too. The current ZL1 is no too hard to get into the 10s to follow the parallels.

The original COPOs were mostly used as race cars, so that name makes sense too.

The one big difference in the current ZL1 is that it is a good road track car as well a fast car in the 1/4 mile. But on a road track it will have to take a back seat to the Z/28 as this is what the was Z/28 bred for.

I think the Z/28 name was sullied in Gen 3 + 4 Camaros. GM is trying to re-establish the Z/28 image in the best way possible, with results at the track. We shall see.
- The original ZL1 was a true stripper car; in essence just the ZL1 427 motor dropped in a V6 Camaro including hub caps and all. Not much to look at either. The option itself was just as much as the base price of the car. As for performance it was not good as it should have been because the motor was set up more for Can Am racing than drag racing (much like the Boss 429). However, there was some early road tests of a ZL1 Vette with a TH400 that ran high 10's.

- The original production Z/28 was not a road race car; plain and simple. It was only made so GM could enter certain SCCA classes to race against Ford. The cars that won were true race cars that shared very little with the production version. Same goes for the original Boss 302.

Fast forward to now and both GM and Ford have decided to bring the modern version of the Boss 302 and Z/28 closer to the racing heritage of the original cars (and not the production version) which is fine; but one wonders why they didn't offer a more streetable version as well for the masses without watering down the performance. Either way, I'm glad GM brought back the Z/28.
DrkPhx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 12:21 PM   #38
2cnd chance
It Will Be Mine
 
2cnd chance's Avatar
 
Drives: A Z51 or a 2014 1LE?
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: The Road
Posts: 6,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrkPhx View Post
- The original ZL1 was a true stripper car; in essence just the ZL1 427 motor dropped in a V6 Camaro including hub caps and all. Not much to look at either. The option itself was just as much as the base price of the car. As for performance it was not good as it should have been because the motor was set up more for Can Am racing than drag racing (much like the Boss 429). However, there was some early road tests of a ZL1 Vette with a TH400 that ran high 10's.

- The original production Z/28 was not a road race car; plain and simple. It was only made so GM could enter certain SCCA classes to race against Ford. The cars that won were true race cars that shared very little with the production version. Same goes for the original Boss 302.

Fast forward to now and both GM and Ford have decided to bring the modern version of the Boss 302 and Z/28 closer to the racing heritage of the original cars (and not the production version) which is fine; but one wonders why they didn't offer a more streetable version as well for the masses without watering down the performance. Either way, I'm glad GM brought back the Z/28.
You need to go back and check some of the "facts".
The ZL1 was mostly ordered as a stripper, but didn't have to be and some weren't.
The SCCA required the production models have what the race cars had, hence the cross-ram, headers (in the trunk), 4wheel disc brakes, etc. The modifications for the racecars from there were roll-bars, engine tweaking,...and the "illegal" hidden changes they made.
__________________
2cnd chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-2013, 01:40 PM   #39
Evotion
Warehouse 13 Survivor!!!!
 
Drives: '13 ZL1 - 69' Camaro
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 802
Everyone's points are valid, but to say they got it backwards or even wrong is just, wrong.

Automakers have proved time and time again that a badge is just a badge. There are way too many examples to list. I am happy with the fact that our Camaro's didn't suffer the same fate as so many other re-badged cars (Nova, GTO, Charger to name only a few). They were always 2 door, 4 seat cars. During the late 70's and 80's they suffered the same fate as so many other models, but at least they were never turned into something they weren't.

When I took ownership of of my 69 Camaro from my father some 28 years ago, I had always dreamed that I would someday own a Yenko, COPO, Zl-1, Z/28... Knowing that it would most likely never happen. Now I own something that I've always wanted (just 40+years newer). At least it's not a 4cyl. Compact Nova.
__________________
1969 Camaro
2010 2SS/RS CGM traded for...
2013 ZL1 Triple Black
Evotion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 06:22 PM   #40
MikeSVX
The magic smoke genie....
 
MikeSVX's Avatar
 
Drives: Jewels (2010 RJT 1SS)
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Escondido, CA
Posts: 2,314
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverds View Post
There's no bible or commandments that say a specific model car or name is restricted by any of its characteristics. The auto makers have the freedom to name their products however they choose, to sell the most of them.

The Chevrolet Malibu, Impala and Dodge Charger are now 4 door sedans and are well accepted as such, though originally they were all 2 Door coupes. 40 Years from now we may see a 4 door Camaro Z/28. Then we can all listen to the live feeds of arguments on Camaro10.com about what the Camaro Z/28 name really meant. I wonder which crowd will be considered confused then.

Our great, great grand children may be very happy to reminisce about out passion for the Z/28 when they buy their first Camaro Z/28 People Mover.


You do realize that all those examples you gave were also available in four door models and not just coupes? At least the Chevys. I'm not 100% positive on the Dodge, but I think it was too.


Also, I don't know what that thing is, but it's kinda cool.
__________________
Support Search & Rescue.
Get Lost.
MikeSVX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 06:43 PM   #41
LOWDOWN
Downright Upright
 
LOWDOWN's Avatar
 
Drives: Daily
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Cruisin'...
Posts: 4,005
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2cnd chance View Post
You need to go back and check some of the "facts".
The ZL1 was mostly ordered as a stripper, but didn't have to be and some weren't.
The SCCA required the production models have what the race cars had, hence the cross-ram, headers (in the trunk), 4wheel disc brakes, etc. The modifications for the racecars from there were roll-bars, engine tweaking,...and the "illegal" hidden changes they made.
You have learned well, Grasshopper...

Actually, 2 of the 69 COPO 9560s (ZL1-engined, #2 and #69) were DOUBLE COPO and included the 9737 Sports Car Conversion Package, which essentially included the Z/28 suspension/wheels/tires. With roughly-equal Curb Weight, you can imagine their overall capabilities...

http://www.camaros.org/9560list.shtml

COPOs, both 9560 and iron-blocked 9561, were essentially built from non-badged SS 395-375 hp Camaros, NOT 6-cylinder-spec chassis.

BTW, Ford tried to compete carb-for-carb in '68, advertised Tunnel Ram 302s in their brochures, built ONE for C&D to test, but NEVER factory-assembled 'em. See post #30, above...
__________________

Last edited by LOWDOWN; 08-26-2013 at 06:54 PM.
LOWDOWN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 07:47 PM   #42
67 GTO
13.453 @ 101.90
 
67 GTO's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 Camaro 2LT Rally Yellow
Join Date: May 2009
Location: SE Pa.
Posts: 1,890
I liked this 69 DOUBLE COPO displayed at an all Camaro show hosted by the Delaware Valley Camaro Club a year back.
Attached Images
   
__________________


GMPP exhaust/JBA shorties/Vararam CAI/VMax TB/SLP Pulley/VMax IM isolator/MACE Ported IM +Plenum Spacer/IPF Tuned
67 GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 08:41 PM   #43
2cnd chance
It Will Be Mine
 
2cnd chance's Avatar
 
Drives: A Z51 or a 2014 1LE?
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: The Road
Posts: 6,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by LOWDOWN View Post
You have learned well, Grasshopper...

Actually, 2 of the 69 COPO 9560s (ZL1-engined, #2 and #69) were DOUBLE COPO and included the 9737 Sports Car Conversion Package, which essentially included the Z/28 suspension/wheels/tires. With roughly-equal Curb Weight, you can imagine their overall capabilities...

http://www.camaros.org/9560list.shtml

COPOs, both 9560 and iron-blocked 9561, were essentially built from non-badged SS 395-375 hp Camaros, NOT 6-cylinder-spec chassis.

BTW, Ford tried to compete carb-for-carb in '68, advertised Tunnel Ram 302s in their brochures, built ONE for C&D to test, but NEVER factory-assembled 'em. See post #30, above...
__________________
2cnd chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 08:42 PM   #44
2cnd chance
It Will Be Mine
 
2cnd chance's Avatar
 
Drives: A Z51 or a 2014 1LE?
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: The Road
Posts: 6,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by 67 GTO View Post
I liked this 69 DOUBLE COPO displayed at an all Camaro show hosted by the Delaware Valley Camaro Club a year back.
I love it! It's only missing the RS package Z22.
__________________
2cnd chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 09:19 PM   #45
LOWDOWN
Downright Upright
 
LOWDOWN's Avatar
 
Drives: Daily
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Cruisin'...
Posts: 4,005
...and it's apparently the LAST ONE built...number 69 of 69 in 69...
__________________
LOWDOWN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2013, 11:08 PM   #46
OldScoolCamaro


 
Drives: Camaro's, always have, always will.
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Home of the brave
Posts: 4,859
...crazy aluminum high compressions HP motors, or any block and head combination for that matter back when with high compression.....time bombs...hand grenades.....fussy....just awesome...those were the days....I digress.
__________________
In Scott We Trust...all others must show proof.
OldScoolCamaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2013, 09:59 AM   #47
2cnd chance
It Will Be Mine
 
2cnd chance's Avatar
 
Drives: A Z51 or a 2014 1LE?
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: The Road
Posts: 6,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by LOWDOWN View Post
...and it's apparently the LAST ONE built...number 69 of 69 in 69...
Probably worth a pretty penny or two.
__________________
2cnd chance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2013, 09:27 PM   #48
OldScoolCamaro


 
Drives: Camaro's, always have, always will.
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Home of the brave
Posts: 4,859
....bring back the protecto plate!
__________________
In Scott We Trust...all others must show proof.
OldScoolCamaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2013, 09:09 PM   #49
Fenderaddict2

 
Fenderaddict2's Avatar
 
Drives: '12 Boss, '65 Mustang FB, '64 Strat
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Oakville
Posts: 1,715
Eh, I'm still waiting for the 302 CID Z/28 to run against my car.
__________________





What's next?
Fenderaddict2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-28-2013, 09:09 PM   #50
Fenderaddict2

 
Fenderaddict2's Avatar
 
Drives: '12 Boss, '65 Mustang FB, '64 Strat
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Oakville
Posts: 1,715
Quote:
Originally Posted by 67 GTO View Post
I liked this 69 DOUBLE COPO displayed at an all Camaro show hosted by the Delaware Valley Camaro Club a year back.
Love it. Especially the colour.
__________________





What's next?
Fenderaddict2 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.