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Old 09-08-2013, 10:37 PM   #18
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Evaporates yes...
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:41 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by No_Traction_B View Post
Evaporates yes...
The water (evaporates) vapor cools

The methanol (burns) making power.

The mixture comes down to what you want more of.
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:47 PM   #20
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Are you running stock bottom end?
Yes stock bottom end
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:48 PM   #21
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That's incorrect. If you are looking for cooling you want it at least 50/50. It's the water that cools not the methanol.
Well my tuner recommended this as well as Julio from Alky. Is my tuner wrong?
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:52 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Supercharged SS View Post
The water (evaporates) vapor cools

The methanol (burns) making power.

The mixture comes down to what you want more of.
I think that is very will put and most likely the answer to the question ,, the ratio should be determine on what you desire, cooling or more power.
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:52 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by blake-b View Post
http://www.camaroz28.com/forums/forc...ection-491444/
didnt read all of it yet but seems to support Jamie for pure cooling purposes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkCry956 View Post
Well my tuner recommended this as well as Julio from Alky. Is my tuner wrong?
Matt's not wrong. You will get minimal cooling affect with straight meth inject.

You will NOT get max cooling without water being injected as well.

Ask yourself "why do people use a water/meth mix if the water portion is pointless"?

If you read the articles linked above you'll get some great info and be able to decide for yourself what is best for you.
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:53 PM   #24
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The cooling effect of meth is greater than water. People put water in it to stabilize it, to dilute it, or to lower out of control combustion temps. It is much less corrosive when some water is mixed in and that can be a big deal with some pumps and fittings. And it evaporates less with some water mixed in.
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:57 PM   #25
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100% meth is a great saftey net. Yes, it will aid a little in cooling but if you are looking for the full benefit it needs to be near a 50/50 mix.
Aid a little??? My iat's on the dyno went from 90degrees to 47degrees w/ 100% meth alky control kit...
Seems more than a little to me.. JMO
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Old 09-08-2013, 10:59 PM   #26
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Aid a little??? My iat's on the dyno went from 90degrees to 47degrees w/ 100% meth alky control kit...
Seems more than a little to me.. JMO
Just imagine of you had a water/meth mix.
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:01 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Supercharged SS View Post
Matt's not wrong. You will get minimal cooling affect with straight meth inject.

You will NOT get max cooling without water being injected as well.

Ask yourself "why do people use a water/meth mix if the water portion is pointless"?

If you read the articles linked above you'll get some great info and be able to decide for yourself what is best for you.
Well ill let my tuner decide or chime in

I'm hardly spraying meth. When I press the purge I don't see changes in AFR till after 20-30 seconds. If its not for cooling and not for power then idk. I thought people wouldn't run 100% meth because the system wouldn't handle it
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:04 PM   #28
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I'd like to know as well. Meth will be part of my build plans here shortly after I add some more upgrades.

Matt@FSP has a kit I'm going with, not sure what we plan on using.
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:07 PM   #29
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Just imagine of you had a water/meth mix.
I don't like the idea of throwing water on the fire I'm trying to burn! Lol
More fuel, plenty cooling, high octane, more timing... Alky control 100% ftw!!
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:12 PM   #30
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I don't like the idea of throwing water on the fire I'm trying to burn! Lol
More fuel, plenty cooling, high octane, more timing... Alky control 100% ftw!!
Then you do not understand how a meth water system works or a breaking balls! The water evaporates becoming vapor. You aren't putting out any fires.

Water absorbs almost twice as much heat as methanol in the intake and inside the combustion chamber. Water cannot be flash-ignited, so has what is almost an infinite octane number. In the government studies for WWII piston-powered aircraft, 50/50 water-methanol was found to be the best fluid to use for auxiliary fluid injection.

It's a fact that water cools better than pure meth.

Again, everyone has their own opinions on what works and why but science is science.

You guys using it should do a few pulls on the dyno using both methods.

I ditched the meth and run race gas with an ice to water setup to control temps so unless I'm looking to steam clean my engine I have no use for methanol injection.
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:15 PM   #31
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Many water injection systems use a mixture of water and alcohol (often close to 50/50), with trace amounts of water-soluble oil. The water provides the primary cooling effect due to its great density and high heat absorption properties. The alcohol is combustible, and also serves as an antifreeze for the water. The main purpose of the oil is to prevent corrosion of water injection and fuel system components;[2] it may also assist in engine lubrication when running in a high power state.[citation needed] Because the alcohol mixed into the injection solution is often methanol (CH3OH), the system is known as methanol-water injection, or MW50. In high performance automotive applications these methanol-water mixtures are often erroneously referred to simply as "methanol injection". In the United States, the system is also commonly referred to as anti-detonant injection, or ADI.
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:16 PM   #32
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In a piston engine, the initial injection of water cools the fuel-air mixture significantly which increases its density and hence the amount of mixture that enters the cylinder. The water (if in small liquid droplets) may absorb heat (and lower the pressure) as the charge is compressed, thus reducing compression work.[1] An additional effect comes later during combustion when the water absorbs large amounts of heat as it vaporizes, reducing peak temperature and resultant NOx formation, and reducing the amount of heat energy absorbed into the cylinder walls. This also converts part of combustion energy from the form of heat to the form of pressure. As the water droplets vaporize by absorbing heat, they turn to high pressure steam. The alcohol in the mixture burns, but is also much more resistant to detonation than gasoline. The net result is a higher octane charge that will support very high compression ratios or significant forced induction pressures before onset of detonation.
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:26 PM   #33
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So needless to say it seems that for a stock bottom end motor looking for safety and some power 50/50 is the best way to go?
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Old 09-08-2013, 11:30 PM   #34
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So needless to say it seems that for a stock bottom end motor looking for safety and some power 50/50 is the best way to go?
I would say yes.

You ask ten other guys and you'll get 10 different answers.
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