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Forced Induction - V6 V6 Supercharger, turbo, nitrous discussions

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Old 12-26-2013, 09:08 AM   #1
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supercharger or turbo?

I've been throwing around the idea of putting a supercharger or turbo in my car but everything I find is damn near 6-7k. Anyone have any luck finding anything that's a more reasonable price? At that point I could've just gotten an ss.
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Old 12-26-2013, 09:23 AM   #2
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Nitrous is the cheapest route. If you want a turbo or supercharger then you probably don't want to go cheap.
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Old 12-26-2013, 10:21 AM   #3
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supercharger or turbo?

More options for turbo appearing for the LLT. If going for a kit you get what you pay for. When I was buying my car the difference to an SS was more than 7k. I would not trade my SC LLT for anything less than a 1LE. And even then it would have to be a great deal.
The gas mileage and insurance breaks are pretty good too.
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Old 12-26-2013, 11:24 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by failingpig View Post
I've been throwing around the idea of putting a supercharger or turbo in my car but everything I find is damn near 6-7k. Anyone have any luck finding anything that's a more reasonable price? At that point I could've just gotten an ss.
Unfortunately thats about right. IPF SC is currently the most popular and most reliable forced induction system for the LLT, but that could change as more tuning options become available.....maybe.

Yes you could probably get yourself into a decent used 2010 or 2011 SS for that amount and what your car is worth. No way you will get into a newer lightly used or new SS for that.

You just have to decide what you want to do.
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Old 12-26-2013, 01:15 PM   #5
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When getting into forced induction the last thing you want to do is do it w/ a low budget in mind. To do it right cost a decent amount (like you have been seeing) Now Nitrous can be very affordable and we exclusively use Nitrous outlet products and would love to answer all your questions abut it if you have any.
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Old 12-27-2013, 12:13 AM   #6
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Go Supercharger, a lot easier on the motor.
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Old 12-27-2013, 05:20 AM   #7
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Go Supercharger, a lot easier on the motor.
Compared to what and why?
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Old 12-27-2013, 08:29 AM   #8
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I wanted a boosted 6 not a 8 because I wanted to be different. I know I'm not the only boosted 6 in my area, but I sure as hell stand out in the crowd of Camaros, its harder to do that with an 8. plus at right around 400 at the wheels, I'm good. plus better fuel econ... not by to much though.
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Old 12-27-2013, 12:56 PM   #9
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Compared to what and why?
I would like to hear this answers as well.


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Old 12-27-2013, 10:33 PM   #10
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If you don't know your way around a car stay away from turbos is my rule of thumb.


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Old 12-29-2013, 05:03 PM   #11
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Compared to what and why?
Compared to turbo. A centrifugal supercharger builds boost per RPM speed which results in a linear power curve which makes it a lot easier on the motor.

Turbo is more efficient and will make better power, but I've always preferred SC as they are essentially a bolt on mod, took me two hours to fully unhook my system from the car.
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Old 12-29-2013, 06:58 PM   #12
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Compared to turbo. A centrifugal supercharger builds boost per RPM speed which results in a linear power curve which makes it a lot easier on the motor.

Turbo is more efficient and will make better power, but I've always preferred SC as they are essentially a bolt on mod, took me two hours to fully unhook my system from the car.
Do you have any data to back up your statement that a centrifugal super charger is easier on the motor? No factory boosted vehicles use a centrifugal SC. They are either roots/twin screw type super chargers or turbos.
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Old 12-30-2013, 03:14 AM   #13
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Do you have any data to back up your statement that a centrifugal super charger is easier on the motor? No factory boosted vehicles use a centrifugal SC. They are either roots/twin screw type super chargers or turbos.
TRD have/had factory Centrifugal systems. But that's not the point anyway.

Does it really need much explaining? PSI builds with RPM, doesn't come in a big hit low/midrange like a turbo.

From this very forum.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...37&postcount=8
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Old 12-30-2013, 05:04 AM   #14
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TRD have/had factory Centrifugal systems. But that's not the point anyway.

Does it really need much explaining? PSI builds with RPM, doesn't come in a big hit low/midrange like a turbo.

From this very forum.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...37&postcount=8
I understand what you are saying and it may make sense that it would be easier on a motor... but just because you think something should be true, doesn't actually make it true....

The link is just Jannetty Racing saying centri's are easier but offers no data to back up the claim...

As for the Toyota, do any of there vehicles come from the factory with the centri or are they add-ons from their racing parts catalog? A quick check for TRD superchargers came up with mostly root-style superchargers...
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Old 12-30-2013, 06:37 AM   #15
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You are right that a centri won't make boost at lower RPMs and a turbo can. That may lead one to think that normal driving a centri is rarely in boost while a turbo is. However, the turbo will not make boost at lower RPMs if it doesn't have much exhaust, like when you are driving normally. Even an aggressive setup like mine is not in boost that much when driving around town.

The other thing to think about it that 6 psi is 6 psi whether you get that at 3000 RPM or 6000 RPM. It is the duration you keep it at 6 psi that matters. So, with normal driving I think most of the turbo kits will probably put no more strain on the moter than a centri. At the track there may be a little bit more because you will spool up very quickly at WOT, but after first gear you won't really see RPMs below about 4000 again so both are making quite a bit of boost all the way down the track.

Finally, the centri puts some drag on the motor all the time. This is a lot less than it used to be, but some is still there. That's a drag the turbo doesn't produce. All in all, I wouldn't worry too much about which one puts more stress on the motor. If you are willing to boost a car then small difference between the two are a small compared to the strain you put on it by adding that much power in the first place.
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:46 AM   #16
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I understand what you are saying and it may make sense that it would be easier on a motor... but just because you think something should be true, doesn't actually make it true....

The link is just Jannetty Racing saying centri's are easier but offers no data to back up the claim...

As for the Toyota, do any of there vehicles come from the factory with the centri or are they add-ons from their racing parts catalog? A quick check for TRD superchargers came up with mostly root-style superchargers...
The data is in the Experience of over 27 Years in business building Performance Packages.

10 PSI boost is typically NOT doable with a Positive displacement or Turbo on a N/A Stock engine because they both have Peak boost Well before Peak Torque, Where Detonation is Prominent

10 PSI Is common on the Same N/A stock engine with a Centrifugal because Peak boost occurs After Peak Torque RPM where Detonation is not as likely and Higher Peak Power can be achieved.

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Old 12-30-2013, 02:13 PM   #17
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TRD have/had factory Centrifugal systems. But that's not the point anyway.

Does it really need much explaining? PSI builds with RPM, doesn't come in a big hit low/midrange like a turbo.

From this very forum.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...37&postcount=8
If excessive low end power and excessive low end torque are an issue, which most people think of as a huge positive, you can always setup a boost controller to ramp in boost. You could make a turbo act very similar to a centri if you wanted with a decent boost controller if your complaint is too much midrange.
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Old 12-30-2013, 02:45 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by JANNETTYRACING View Post
The data is in the Experience of over 27 Years in business building Performance Packages.

10 PSI boost is typically NOT doable with a Positive displacement or Turbo on a N/A Stock engine because they both have Peak boost Well before Peak Torque, Where Detonation is Prominent

10 PSI Is common on the Same N/A stock engine with a Centrifugal because Peak boost occurs After Peak Torque RPM where Detonation is not as likely and Higher Peak Power can be achieved.

Ted.
You are talking about the potential for detonation of a turbo/positive displacement vs a centrifugal. And the fact you can easily make more peak boost with a centrifugal... I certainly agree with that... however what I am talking about is a PROPERLY TUNED (NO detonation) setup. Also not talking about which setup makes more power... We were talking about one setup being harder on a motor than the other...

I respect your experience... but where is the hard data showing that a properly tuned turbo/positive displacement is harder on a given motor than a centrifugal... i'm talking hard data, not anecdotal evidence... I've got 30 years of computer experience, but I don't make recommendations based solely on my experience. I run multiple tests, collect and analyze the data and then form my recommendations.... I'm assuming no one here has taken two identical cars, one with say a turbo and one with a centri, strapped them to a dyno, do a controlled set of tests and then tear down the motors to see which motor is showing more wear...

And yes, i would say it may sound reasonable that a centri is easier on a motor, but again, I hate blanket statements without out some kind of concrete evidence to back them up...


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If excessive low end power and excessive low end torque are an issue, which most people think of as a huge positive, you can always setup a boost controller to ramp in boost. You could make a turbo act very similar to a centri if you wanted with a decent boost controller if your complaint is too much midrange.

That's basically how the boost on Ford's EcoBoosts are calibrated from the factory... boost comes on almost linearly like a centri... However a good tune will change that and you see some pretty impressive gains in the low end...
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Old 12-30-2013, 04:40 PM   #19
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One of the biggest advantages of turbos that I see almost no camaro owners using yet is the ease of boost control. Want 500rwhp in 1st gear so it hooks? Want boost to taper in? Want extra power from 5K+ but it mild down low? All of that is really easy to do on a turbo setup.
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Old 12-30-2013, 05:02 PM   #20
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One of the biggest advantages of turbos that I see almost no camaro owners using yet is the ease of boost control. Want 500rwhp in 1st gear so it hooks? Want boost to taper in? Want extra power from 5K+ but it mild down low? All of that is really easy to do on a turbo setup.
Boost Leash set up is a perfect add on for this been looking at adding one to boost thru the gears for hooking.


There some good info in this thread even though the true question is still unanswered.


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Old 12-30-2013, 05:35 PM   #21
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If excessive low end power and excessive low end torque are an issue, which most people think of as a huge positive, you can always setup a boost controller to ramp in boost. You could make a turbo act very similar to a centri if you wanted with a decent boost controller if your complaint is too much midrange.
Defeats the purpose of having a turbo but good to see you agree, a turbo set up the same as a centri is more reliable than having it set up like a traditional turbo.
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Old 01-01-2014, 01:55 PM   #22
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Defeats the purpose of having a turbo but good to see you agree, a turbo set up the same as a centri is more reliable than having it set up like a traditional turbo.
That's not what he said... he basically said you can tailor a tubos power delivery to the way you want it.... if you want it your turbo to act like a centri you can do that... No where did he agree with you that a centri is more reliable. He simply pointed out a turbo is easily customizable in its power delivery...
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Old 01-01-2014, 06:06 PM   #23
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Exactly. I wouldn't want a turbo to come on like a centri, but if you want less mid range, then dial that back.
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