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Old 03-30-2008, 01:08 AM   #1
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LA Times: Design Changes Delay Camaro's Return to the Muscle-Car Race

Saturday, March 29th, 2008
By Martin Zimmerman
Los Angeles Times


"Design Changes Delay Camaro's Return to the Muscle-Car Race"

The new Chevy Camaro would seem to have everything going for it; a genuinely storied tradition, a built-in fan base, even a staring role in a blockbuster movie.

But as they say at the local comedy club, timing is everything. And in that regard, at least, the Camaro can't seem to get its act together.

General Motors Corp. expects to have the new Camaro in dealer showrooms during the first quarter of 2009. That would be three years after the Camaro concept car was unveiled as GM's entry in the current muscle-car revival and well behind such retro rivals as the Ford Mustang and Chrysler's Dodge Challenger.

"I honestly don't understand what they're wating for," said Dick Guldstrand of Burbank, Calif.-based Guldstrand Motor Sports.

Certainly, fans of the original Camaro are eager to get a look at the new version. The last Camaro rolled off the assembly line in 2002, and the versions seen since have all been concepts, including the yellow and black copy that starred as Bumble-bee in last summer's popcorn hit Transformers.

GM knows that more than a few of its customers are toe-tapping with impatience. Designing the car around a new rear-wheel drive platform, rather than using existing automotive architecture as did Ford and Chrysler, is the main reason for the delay, GM spokeswoman Wendy Clark said.

"Maybe we showed the concept a little early," she said. "I know it feels like a long time. But it will be worth the wait."

Or will GM miss the "sweet spot" of the muscle-car rebirth? the trend began a few years back, when Ford fielded a redesigned Mustang that mimicked the lines of the iconic late '60's fire-breather but came with such modern amenities as fuel injection, air bags and four-wheel disc brakes.

The vintage look proved to be a big hit with baby boomer's who recalled the muscle cars of the late '60's and early '70's, including the Challenger, the Pontiac GTO, the Plymouth Barracuda and the Camaro Z28. Those cars, fabled as much for their dreadful handling and braking as for their straight-line speed, are the new stars of the collectible-car circuit, with rare and well-preserved models selling for millions of dollars.

The Camaro concepts seen so far have strong echoes of the 1969 model, considered by many to be the ultimate expression of the car, itself one of the gems of the muscle car era.

"If you're not into it, it's hard to explain," said Los Angeles attorney Barry Freeman, 69, who owns two vintage Camaros.

"It's a seduction that people of my generation have never escaped from, nor do I want to."

The first muscle cars were killed off by high gasoline prices, a weakening economy, new federal regulations, and rising insurance rates. Those same factors are threatening to choke off the cars' comeback before the new Camaro even reaches dealers.

"It's a tough time to be introducing cars like the Challenger and the Camaro," said Karl Brauer, editor and chief of online auto site Edmunds.com, noting that the Mustang sales already began to slide last year.

"The number of muscle cars in the market is a good barometer of how well things are going in the economy, and these cars are late getting to the party."

It doesn't help that the new fuel-economy standards congress passed in December will make it tougher for automakers to justify selling big-engined cars.

GM points out that the new Camaro will be available in a more fuel-efficient six-cylinder version, as well as a V-8
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:51 AM   #2
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Well First off, living right outside of LA, The LA Times isn't really known for its knowledge of anything, much less Muscle Cars. From what I know, There's nothing being delayed, and they have planned to release the Camaro in early 2009 for quite a while.

Secondly, I don't understand how they are still comparing the Camaro to any other "muscle cars" released by Ford or Dodge... What's a Mustang?

Anyway, this article is just filler for Los Angeles Times; as long as they stir a few people they are happy. Let's just wait and see what the Detroit Times has to say.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:28 AM   #3
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The article is nuts, the fact that they are getting a brand new car out like that in 3 years I think is a feat in itself. Glad I don't live in LA to even have an option to subscribe to a paper like this.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:34 AM   #4
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well like it said the Zeta platform is a brand new thing. they want to get the platform fight before building the car because the platform makes or breaks the car. i agree that 3 years is an amazingly quick amount of time to get this kind of vehicle out.
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Old 03-30-2008, 03:15 AM   #5
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"It's a tough time to be introducing cars like the Challenger and the Camaro," said Karl Brauer, editor and chief of online auto site Edmunds.com, noting that the Mustang sales already began to slide last year.
Hmmm...could....it.....be......because some folks are saving thier pennies for the big dogs?!?!?!
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Old 03-30-2008, 03:17 AM   #6
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Possibly, or people are finally coming to their senses.
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Old 03-30-2008, 04:44 AM   #7
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Old 03-30-2008, 04:51 AM   #8
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Sounds like just a filler, and yes I am saving my pennies for the big dog!
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Old 03-30-2008, 06:49 AM   #9
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I Think its just afiller....however there is little truth in it,
The Zeta platform has been ready and used by GM holden to manuefacture
Lumina and Caprice for Asaia and ME market.its also used for the new pontiac G8.
I would expected GM to launch the new Camaro just after they launched the Pontiac G8 in north america.

Again it seem that the camaro will have the same engines options and powertrain on the camaro as the G8 as part of there new universal platform
program.
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:48 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustinZS View Post
Saturday, March 29th, 2008
By Martin Zimmerman
Los Angeles Times


"Design Changes Delay Camaro's Return to the Muscle-Car Race"

The new Chevy Camaro would seem to have everything going for it; a genuinely storied tradition, a built-in fan base, even a staring role in a blockbuster movie.
Link to the article? I'm unable to find it on the LA Times or via google?

What is the delay this beat writer is referring to? We have always been told to expect the car in showrooms during the first quarter 2009.

Regarding the Dick Guldstrand quote - I'd like to see his program get a vehicle of this magnatude on a shared platform get it to market quicker
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Old 03-30-2008, 10:34 AM   #11
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It's a puff piece, a filler.
No news here folks. Move along now please.
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:04 AM   #12
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There are no design changes, at least nothing significant. Secondly, and this is minor, but they mentioned Camaro Z28 then said "fabled as much for their dreadful handling and braking as for their straight-line speed". Sounds like the person who wrote the article doesn't have a big background in muscle cars
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:38 AM   #13
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Wow, this is the worst article I have ever read from the LA Times, and I have read a number of truly awful articles. First, what is the design change or delay? The article mentions nothing of either a design change nor a delay, yet the headline boldly proclaims one. Secondly, among the many factual errors in this article, the one that stands out the most is picking out the Z28 for bad handling. Sigh, I was supposed to do homework today, but I guess I'll be writing a letter to the editor instead.
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:55 AM   #14
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Design change? The thing almost looks exactly like the concept. There is some truth to GM possibly introducing the concept early though. Although I was thrilled to see it, think of how much less "toe tapping" there would be if they had introduced the concept right when Transformers came out.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:23 PM   #15
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...I don't...That title had nothing to do with the article...Wh-?

whatever; NO delays, it's coming 1QT '09. End of story.
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Old 03-30-2008, 07:53 PM   #16
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Well, we know he's off the mark in regards to design right off the bat. However, the author does have a point in regards to the timing of the production cars launch, but I don't think it's that big an issue; GM's not selling a truck, it's a passenger car that will have better gas mileage regardless of engine choice next to any overweight people/utility hauler. And for the next generation the Camaro will definitely get smaller, so any potential concerns for the future of the Camaro as well as it's success in the market place based off of fuel consumption can be put to rest.
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Old 03-30-2008, 09:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustinZS View Post
The vintage look proved to be a big hit with baby boomer's who recalled the muscle cars of the late '60's and early '70's, including the Challenger, the Pontiac GTO, the Plymouth Barracuda and the Camaro Z28. Those cars, fabled as much for their dreadful handling and braking as for their straight-line speed, are the new stars of the collectible-car circuit, with rare and well-preserved models selling for millions of dollars.
Okay, muscle cars of the late '60s and early '70s are highly collectible, but are well-preserved models really selling for "millions of dollars"? I mean, I've heard of near-mint vehicles of that sort selling for like $100K, but not "millions."
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:30 PM   #18
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ANOTHER REASON to hate the LA Times....

(.........as if I needed another reason........)

Complete rubbish.
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Old 03-30-2008, 11:52 PM   #19
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Okay, muscle cars of the late '60s and early '70s are highly collectible, but are well-preserved models really selling for "millions of dollars"? I mean, I've heard of near-mint vehicles of that sort selling for like $100K, but not "millions."
Really good cars will sell for hundreds. They need to be numbers matching, no miles, perfect condition, and rare. Some will sell for millions, but only a select few. Carol Shelbys Cobra sold for 5.5 mil. That is about the most extreme example, you won't see a Z28 be worth nearly as much as that car.
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Old 03-31-2008, 12:03 AM   #20
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ANOTHER REASON to hate the LA Times....

(.........as if I needed another reason........)

Complete rubbish.
Agreed^^^^^

Lived in LA for 10 Years. And the LA Times is not worth the paper its printed on.
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Old 03-31-2008, 01:46 AM   #21
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Link to the article? I'm unable to find it on the LA Times or via google?

What is the delay this beat writer is referring to? We have always been told to expect the car in showrooms during the first quarter 2009.

Regarding the Dick Guldstrand quote - I'd like to see his program get a vehicle of this magnatude on a shared platform get it to market quicker
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/va...,5470712.story
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Old 03-31-2008, 03:57 AM   #22
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This reminds me of when a Swedish "newspaper" Expressen's American car corrospondant did a test drive of the concept in Miami. I found that article the other day and remember reading it before I got really into this car and thinking it was hot but to pricey. First of let me say that this whole article has just got loads of innacurate info, like for example that it was to have an LS2 just because the concept does. But anyway the price they set to 560 000 SEK. Adjusted with todays dollar value that's about 94k USD. Adjusted more properly since the dollar is low it's about 56k. That's Corvette territory even here.

So if anyone from Expressen reads this: leave the serious car reporting to car magazines, you're just making yourself look like idiots. Oh and also if you haven't figured it out, you were about 250 000 SEK to high with that price.
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Old 03-31-2008, 06:00 AM   #23
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:blah: :blah: :blah: I'm a moron who likes to stir up readers :blah: :blah: :blah:


that's all I got out of that article
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Old 03-31-2008, 02:20 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Emher View Post
This reminds me of when a Swedish "newspaper" Expressen's American car corrospondant did a test drive of the concept in Miami. I found that article the other day and remember reading it before I got really into this car and thinking it was hot but to pricey. First of let me say that this whole article has just got loads of innacurate info, like for example that it was to have an LS2 just because the concept does. But anyway the price they set to 560 000 SEK. Adjusted with todays dollar value that's about 94k USD. Adjusted more properly since the dollar is low it's about 56k. That's Corvette territory even here.

So if anyone from Expressen reads this: leave the serious car reporting to car magazines, you're just making yourself look like idiots. Oh and also if you haven't figured it out, you were about 250 000 SEK to high with that price.
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Old 03-31-2008, 02:37 PM   #25
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Really good cars will sell for hundreds. They need to be numbers matching, no miles, perfect condition, and rare. Some will sell for millions, but only a select few. Carol Shelbys Cobra sold for 5.5 mil. That is about the most extreme example, you won't see a Z28 be worth nearly as much as that car.
if you get the SPEED channel watch Barret Jackson's car auction. you normally only see the best of the best cars on there. Hardly any exotics just American classics. The announcers really know what the hell they're talking about too. we're past that time of the year, but it comes on in January and the last one was just this weekend...
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