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Old 08-16-2009, 09:05 AM   #1
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the truth about your LEGAL LONG TUBE headers/cats

every one seems to think just because they buy long tube headers with cats that they are legal, not really

read over,, starting on page 4


http://www.epa.gov/otaq/cert/factshts/catcvrts.pdf
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Old 08-16-2009, 09:23 AM   #2
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Good Find, this should help people make educated decissions about how they will mod they car.

This is why I am a big fan of Supercharging as opposed to headers and exhaust mods.

You can have your cake and eat it too.
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Old 08-16-2009, 10:04 AM   #3
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Thanks for the info
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Old 08-16-2009, 10:06 AM   #4
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Watch out "BIG BROTHERS" gonna get ya for those illegal cats!!!!
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Old 08-16-2009, 10:09 AM   #5
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These regulations need to be revisited and revised. The goal should be the final results, not the components used. The regulations as they are do not allow for any advancements in technology; either in effectiveness or efficiency, weight, size, heat, etc.

When these regs were developed back in the early 80's computers weren't even remotely as common or as powerful as they are today. The design technology and materials we have now are WAY beyond what they had or envisioned back then.
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Old 08-16-2009, 12:45 PM   #6
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As usual, good post doc!
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Old 08-16-2009, 12:46 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camaro1 View Post
every one seems to think just because they buy long tube headers with cats that they are legal, not really

read over,, starting on page 4


http://www.epa.gov/otaq/cert/factshts/catcvrts.pdf
I don't think everyone things this at all .. what gave you that impression? I think many people know the deal on long tubes ..

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Old 08-16-2009, 12:51 PM   #8
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Old 08-16-2009, 03:33 PM   #9
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if you really think that a cop is going to site an EPA regulation if he writes you a citation for illegal long tube headers??

Highly doubt it. While you statement is well founded... and yes, it's been against EPA regulation for years that if you alter a working catalytic converter, it's illegal. But where's the enforcement? It's not like there's EPA agents going door to door looking for aftermarket cats on new cars.

I live in a county in Va that doesnt even do a sniffer test, I could care less about the legalities of long tube headers. But someone in a different state where they have to be visually inspected and sniff tested with CARB numbers, it may be a concern for them.
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Old 08-16-2009, 03:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc View Post
These regulations need to be revisited and revised. The goal should be the final results, not the components used. The regulations as they are do not allow for any advancements in technology; either in effectiveness or efficiency, weight, size, heat, etc.

When these regs were developed back in the early 80's computers weren't even remotely as common or as powerful as they are today. The design technology and materials we have now are WAY beyond what they had or envisioned back then.
Doc, I agree with you 100% that it really should focus on outcomes, not components, but these regs are not entirely from the 80s, they were also developed for OBD-II vehicles. They are in place because of the self-diagnostic capabilities of our cars. The 8yrs/80,000 miles for 1995 and newer was done for the change to OBD-II.

The only time it is enforced is against shops doing "illegal" modifications, or if someone is a real a-hole and they want to make an example out of you. But it is a real problem when you sell a car in some states, you can be held responsible for returning the car to as-delivered condition, or fined, or both.

Sometimes I hate the government, I love this part:

Quote:
What may happen if I don't use the correct converter?

First, it is a violation of Federal law because it is likely to increase the amount of pollution coming out of the vehicle. Penalties for violations by individuals, service or repair shops or fleet operators are up to $2,500 per violation. (Each improper installation is considered a violation.) New car dealers can be penalized up to $25,000 per violation. Any person who causes a violation could be subject to the same penalty as the installer.
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Old 08-16-2009, 04:14 PM   #11
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grow a pair!!!!!!!
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Old 08-16-2009, 08:28 PM   #12
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It really does not matter where you live, if you know someone and/or are willing to pay a little extra, when they test your car it will run like a hybrid. There are and have always been ways to circumvent the system.
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Old 08-16-2009, 08:29 PM   #13
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In California, headers/CAI's that don't have a CARB stamp are a big no-no. If Arnold finds out you're running long tubes he (allegedly) goes to your house and kicks you square in the nuts for polluting. Then he jumps in his private jet and flies back home
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Old 08-16-2009, 10:34 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camaro1 View Post
every one seems to think just because they buy long tube headers with cats that they are legal, not really

read over,, starting on page 4


http://www.epa.gov/otaq/cert/factshts/catcvrts.pdf

Doesn't everyone know this?
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