Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
Night Owl LED
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Engine | Drivetrain | Powertrain Technical Discussions > Mechanical Maintenance: Break-in / Oil & Fluids / Servicing

Mechanical Maintenance: Break-in / Oil & Fluids / Servicing Discussions on mechanical maintenance and servicing of your Camaro

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 08-24-2009, 01:28 PM   #1
HaveBlue
 
HaveBlue's Avatar
 
Drives: CTS/CAMARO
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SEMA/PERF INDUSTRY GUY
Posts: 484
Diverging goals for GF-5 oil spec

Thought you guys might be intereted in this. A friend emailed to me and I can't divulge the source. But it seems that the EPA wants cleaner oils and GM wants more robust oils.

Subject: Update on Dexos

Here is an update on the continued development of GM’s Dexos:

*2 additive companies (Lubrizol, Infineum?) presented their “Demonstration Programs” to GM and oil marketers
*This happens during the “Technology Demonstration Period” of a newly proposed spec
*GM approved the program and is moving forward to implementation, announcement coming soon
*The final step is “Commercializing” the specification after presenting to oil marketers
*Technical programs included use of 100% group III syn base stock
*May be able to use a mix of grp II+ & III, but not yet determined
*Lubrizol contracted with Steve Ames (BP base oil) to review group III supply
*Steve felt there was ample grp III supply due to the increase in production in Korea and Europe
NOTE: The U.S. lubricant market will now be reliant on foreign base oil supply
*Dexos is estimated to initially cost 30% more than GF-4
NOTE: Oil marketers will add additional margin, as is usually the case with a new category
*GM anticipates the product to be priced between GF-4 and a “Mobil 1”
*ExMo, Castrol Valvoline pushing back on Dexos: “commoditize” the synthetic market, reduced margins
*GM expressed continued focus and push towards extended drains (hence more robust engine oil)
*They will more than likely recalibrate the algorithm on OLM to further extend service life
*They did this with the intro of GF-4
*Dexos will be backward compatible and recommended for older GM vehicles
*GM wants to keep cars out of dealerships to lower expenses on warranty repairs
*May need Moly in 2011 when fuel economy test goes to Seq VI D (uses GM Cadillac CTS 3.6L)
*They will initially use the GF-4 Seq VI B test
*Moly will add another 20% to Dexos cost in 2011
*Dexos formulation is MORE robust than GF-5
*Tighter limits than GF-4’s Seq VG sludge protection and Seq IIIG weighted piston deposit tests
*Dexos uses ACEA (European) and proprietary Opel (GM) test OP-1 for these parameters
*Dexos is moving towards a “European” oil formulation
NOTE: GM plans to sell 75% of their fleet OUTSIDE the U.S.
*The weighted piston deposit requirements is facilitating the push towards grp III base oil
*GF-5 has tighter fuel economy requirements than Dexos
*GF-5 will use 300-500 ppm of Moly as a friction modifier
*They have gone through the periodic table looking for an alternative to Moly, no solution yet
NOTE: Moly has been known to cause turbo charger deposits when used at high saturation levels
*Both GF-5 and Dexos will use a large amount of organic friction modifiers
*Dexos and GF-5 are moving in opposite directions
*Dexos towards oil robustness, GF-5 towards improved fuel economy
NOTE: GM may be in trouble when CAF╔ standards are reduced
NOTE: It will be a large technological challenge for a product to meet BOTH specs
*How will this affect the installer’s strategy and business model? European Installer model?
*Consumers want extended service intervals, but will they want to pay for it?
*Is there ample Group III base oil supply for both GF-5 and DEXOS demand? Market prices?
*With increased demand and limited supply for Moly, pricing will escalate
__________________
"everyone wants to go to heaven. but nobody wants to die" "you gotta pay to play"

SEMA PICTURES-PARTS & CARS
http://www.pbase.com/haveblue/sema_2009

Last edited by HaveBlue; 08-24-2009 at 01:29 PM. Reason: puncuation
HaveBlue is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
best synthetic oil to use hollywoodjose Mechanical Maintenance: Break-in / Oil & Fluids / Servicing 130 01-26-2014 09:51 AM
synthetic motor oil? bigd1276 Mechanical Maintenance: Break-in / Oil & Fluids / Servicing 71 01-29-2009 01:28 PM
The 3,000 Mile Oil Change Myth KILLER74Z28 General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion 35 07-20-2008 10:02 PM
gas prices. Congoman775 General Automotive + Other Cars Discussion 65 05-28-2008 01:20 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.