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Old 09-11-2009, 03:25 PM   #1
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Unhappy Losing faith, patience and cool.

Have any Florida owners / prospective owners have a good dealer experience? Florida dealers seem to be on the wrong side of things from what Iíve seen on the boards. I live along the gulf coast near the Alabama line and have been underwhelmed by the 10 dealers in my area. Although several offered MSRP at the time I ordered mine, most seem to have decided that several thousand over sticker is a great way to make up for lost sales over the past few months. Considering the bankruptcy and bailout, charging thousands over MSRP while not accepting qualifying discounts (college, supplier, credit union) is hard to swallow as a consumer.

After ordering mine June 10th and being number 5 on the wait list, 3 months have come and gone and I still sit at 1100 with promises of a car, fluffy clouds, chirping birds, golden rays of sunshine and whatever else may appease me for the moment. The last time I spoke with my salesperson he told me the dealership owner was looking at getting some vehicles in for stock since so many Camaros were going for 5K over sticker. I asked how my order was coming along, since I had been assured that I would have an allocation by September 17 Ė the date of their last of their 4 allocations this round (currently Iím number 3 on the list). I had the one and only V6 car on the list when I ordered. Supposedly ďeverything is on trackĒ for a December (unsatisfactory) delivery.

In the time since I placed my order, I now have to pony up for a back-up system and increased shipping cost. By the time the car arrives, even if the dealer keeps their promise and it goes 2000 by the 17th, the USAA discount will expire Ė another $750 discount I wonít have a chance at. This is not the experience I was hoping for when ordering a car to spec for the first time. Itís certainly not what I expected from a car company that wants to remold its image as more customer-focused.

Iím not a manufacturer die-hard, although I do like to buy American when possible. This is the first Camaro produced in 35 years that I have cared enough about to consider, and yes, Iím just getting the V6 2LT. On the flip side of that coin, I do buy new cars often. This car, if it ever materializes (and I have my doubts at this point), will be my fifth new vehicle purchase in 5 years. I donít window shop or kick tires; I bring a checkbook and a desire to drive one off the lot. I have no trade-in to mess with, 6K to put down, and excellent credit Ė now I just need the product.

Iíve been temporarily using another vehicle for daily transportation, but using it for several more months is not a desirable option. I need a different set of wheels within a couple of months. As the Camaroís price tag creeps up and the discounts slide toward oblivion, I am starting to consider a 2010 Mustang GT. A friend has a way to get me X-plan pricing, and although I donít think itís as attractive as the Camaro, I might have to go that route if my Chevy dealer canít deliver. Any GM employees or dealers out here are more than welcome to comment on this Ė because my faith in the heartbeat is fading fast.
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Old 09-11-2009, 03:34 PM   #2
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all i can recommend is to find a new dealer. mine is 3 hours away in austin since just about all in my area tried to bs me because they assume im younger than i really am or cant afford a chevy(like its a bentley or something).
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Old 09-11-2009, 03:39 PM   #3
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A lot of us have waited a lot longer to get our cars, you either have the desire for a camaro or you don't. Hope you can hang in there.
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Old 09-11-2009, 03:50 PM   #4
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I cant tell you how many people kick themselves for not waiting. The 2010 mustangs are super easy to get because they are coming out with the 400/285 hp motors next year so there is very little interest plus a lot of the die hard's hated the new design but loved the new interior but it wasn't enough to make them sell there current ride and get one. The 2010 v6 Camaro is a steal for its price aka the wait plus the camaro has been gone since 2002. I bet if u get your mustang you will want to sell it next year after u start seeing what u missed out on. Just find something to do to pass the time and just forget about it. No i dont have mine yet so i practice what i preach.
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Old 09-11-2009, 04:03 PM   #5
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bhut...

I understand what you're saying and am having the same experience, ordered from Preston Hood in Ft. Walton Beach and the people there are all really great, but they only have so many allocations.......I ordered a 2LT on 07/10/09 and am still at #9 on the waiting list, but I can get the car at MSRP there. In Pensacola I talked to Pete Moore (7K over MSRP) and Sandy Sansing (5K over MSRP). I sympathize and I know it's difficult to be patient. I'm being told that it will "probably" be before the end of the year......so, here I sit with 12K to put down and wondering if I should go somewhere else as well.

It all depends on your situation I guess. I think I'll wait it out a bit longer myself as I like to shop local. Best of luck to you
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Old 09-11-2009, 04:07 PM   #6
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This car is worth waiting ten years for. IF you can't wait. Cancel your order. But you'll always wished you had waited. I guarantee it. Just my two cents.
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Old 09-12-2009, 07:09 PM   #7
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Well, There are alot of pitfalls in the Camaro acquisition process. Thanks to this site, I was able to arm myself with knowledge before heading to the dealer. A friend ordered and took delivery of a Camaro from this dealer and had no complaints. I made certain the dealer had allocation available. He showed me a computer screen that showed 5 Camaro allocations available. I ordered my Camaro LS on 9/10 for MSRP and the dealer called on 9/11 with my "N" number. Status: 1100. This dealer told me they are the 2nd largest volume dealer in the state.
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Old 09-12-2009, 07:22 PM   #8
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i was under the impression the price on the 2lt wouldnt change for the sensors....
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Old 09-12-2009, 07:32 PM   #9
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I ordered a the 2LT/RS on around 7/15 the dealer I am going through can not tell me anything not even a work bench number, all this ordering has been done by phone or internet (I am in Iraq) besides the money taken to them by family back home.. Everytime I email my salesperson she can't tell me anything.. I am getting very frustrated will be home in about 8 weeks and I would like to have a new car waiting!
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Old 09-12-2009, 08:06 PM   #10
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Thousands over MSRP! That's a crime. I live in the northern "burbs" of Detroit and there are about 10-12 dealerships within a 30 minute drive from my house. I don't think any of them are asking over MSRP. In fact, many dealers are selling under MSRP by 1%-1.5%.

As for the long wait that you are experiencing, I ordered my 2SS on Sept 1st and the car is already at 3000 status. I am expecting delivery in the middle of October, the latest.

H*ll, With the over MSRP money that they are asking, you could fly up to Michigan, buy your Camaro for MSRP or 1%-1.5% under. Arrange to have the Camaro shipped home and fly back home.

Find a new dealership. Do not pay over MSRP.

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Old 09-12-2009, 08:32 PM   #11
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It's about the same for all of Florida..... We seem to be in the Reaganomics trickle down theory ..... We have to be the slowest state for getting allocations.... That's why the system is screwed up .... It's not about the customer !!!
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Old 09-12-2009, 08:39 PM   #12
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no luck with several FL dealers - ordered mine from NM !

Went to several dealers - none would custom order without seriously jacking up the price. Was home to visit my parents in May - dad is buddies with the dealer owner there - he had 5 allocations and no takers - was willing to custom order it and i'm getting it below MSRP - the wait is tough - really starting to get annoying now that I know she's built and in the state but not at the dealership yet praying that daddy can convince the dealer owner to bail me out of rail jail sometime this week -

we looked at Brevard County dealers, Daytona Beach and Orlando and couldn't get a good deal anywhere - travelling quite a distance to get her but it's also an excuse to visit my family in NM and stop in Waco TX on the way back and visit with our son -
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Old 09-12-2009, 08:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thrillz View Post
I cant tell you how many people kick themselves for not waiting. The 2010 mustangs are super easy to get because they are coming out with the 400/285 hp motors next year so there is very little interest plus a lot of the die hard's hated the new design but loved the new interior but it wasn't enough to make them sell there current ride and get one. The 2010 v6 Camaro is a steal for its price aka the wait plus the camaro has been gone since 2002. I bet if u get your mustang you will want to sell it next year after u start seeing what u missed out on. Just find something to do to pass the time and just forget about it. No i dont have mine yet so i practice what i preach.
What perfect advice: "pass the time and just forget about it." I just ordered mine a week ago and already I'm antsy with anticipation so I sympathize but others are worse off than you and further away in the process.
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Old 09-14-2009, 02:50 PM   #14
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I live by Daytona Beach, I ordered my car on memorial day and got it 8/3, from Jon Hall, they proceeded to try to charge me 5,000.00 over for my ABM 2SS/RS. Unfortunately I only got them down to 2,000.00 over but they also knew they had me because I did not want to walk awy from what I ordered ,and many of the other surounding dealer's could'nt even order because they did not have allocation and did not even have any to sell on their lots. I have dealt with this dealer every year for a long time because my husband buy's his work vehicle from them and his brother buys several each year for work/personal and I still did not get any special favors other than a discount for tint/ undercoating. They told me "fine if you don't want the car someone else will buy it even before you leave this office, we have a waiting list!" I am a sucker what can I say? But I got what I wanted and at least they compromised down to 2000.00 from 5000.00.
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Old 09-14-2009, 05:05 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by bhut View Post
Have any Florida owners / prospective owners have a good dealer experience? Florida dealers seem to be on the wrong side of things from what Iíve seen on the boards. I live along the gulf coast near the Alabama line and have been underwhelmed by the 10 dealers in my area. Although several offered MSRP at the time I ordered mine, most seem to have decided that several thousand over sticker is a great way to make up for lost sales over the past few months. Considering the bankruptcy and bailout, charging thousands over MSRP while not accepting qualifying discounts (college, supplier, credit union) is hard to swallow as a consumer.

After ordering mine June 10th and being number 5 on the wait list, 3 months have come and gone and I still sit at 1100 with promises of a car, fluffy clouds, chirping birds, golden rays of sunshine and whatever else may appease me for the moment. The last time I spoke with my salesperson he told me the dealership owner was looking at getting some vehicles in for stock since so many Camaros were going for 5K over sticker. I asked how my order was coming along, since I had been assured that I would have an allocation by September 17 Ė the date of their last of their 4 allocations this round (currently Iím number 3 on the list). I had the one and only V6 car on the list when I ordered. Supposedly ďeverything is on trackĒ for a December (unsatisfactory) delivery.

In the time since I placed my order, I now have to pony up for a back-up system and increased shipping cost. By the time the car arrives, even if the dealer keeps their promise and it goes 2000 by the 17th, the USAA discount will expire Ė another $750 discount I wonít have a chance at. This is not the experience I was hoping for when ordering a car to spec for the first time. Itís certainly not what I expected from a car company that wants to remold its image as more customer-focused.

Iím not a manufacturer die-hard, although I do like to buy American when possible. This is the first Camaro produced in 35 years that I have cared enough about to consider, and yes, Iím just getting the V6 2LT. On the flip side of that coin, I do buy new cars often. This car, if it ever materializes (and I have my doubts at this point), will be my fifth new vehicle purchase in 5 years. I donít window shop or kick tires; I bring a checkbook and a desire to drive one off the lot. I have no trade-in to mess with, 6K to put down, and excellent credit Ė now I just need the product.

Iíve been temporarily using another vehicle for daily transportation, but using it for several more months is not a desirable option. I need a different set of wheels within a couple of months. As the Camaroís price tag creeps up and the discounts slide toward oblivion, I am starting to consider a 2010 Mustang GT. A friend has a way to get me X-plan pricing, and although I donít think itís as attractive as the Camaro, I might have to go that route if my Chevy dealer canít deliver. Any GM employees or dealers out here are more than welcome to comment on this Ė because my faith in the heartbeat is fading fast.
ruffle throught this particular forum and look for "marketing"
you will come across a number for GM marketing - you can call that number tell them what you want they will find you one thats sitting in a lot or in transit... all over the states...

i called them and the guy was able to find 3 cars in the states that were close to my build... but i was already at 2000... good luck... sorry i didnt read your entire post...
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1000 - [07-23-2009] Order Made at dealer
1100 - [08-04-2009] Preliminary order accepted
2000 - [08-25-2009] Accepted by GM
3000 - [09-01-2009] Accepted by production control TPW = 10-05-2009
3300 - [09-28-2009] Scheduled for production
3400 - [10-01-2009] Broadcast - Being Built
3800 - [10-13-2009] Produced - Built- VIN 2G1xxx54917
4200 - [10-19-2009] Shipped
5000 - [10-19-2009] Delivered to the dealer
6000 - [10-20-2009] Delivered to the customer

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Old 09-14-2009, 06:30 PM   #16
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Don't know if you want to reach out to a distant dealer for help. If so, try calling Rich Anson (Fleet Sales Mgr of Go Chevrolet in Denver). He has ben great for me to work with. I decided to order mine on Friday, have my order number today.

I have no idea if he can help you with an order and a "drop ship", but if there is a way he would certainly let you know. And you could probably get him to help you with something a little under MSRP if you say please.
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Old 09-14-2009, 07:18 PM   #17
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I live by Daytona Beach, I ordered my car on memorial day and got it 8/3, from Jon Hall, they proceeded to try to charge me 5,000.00 over for my ABM 2SS/RS. Unfortunately I only got them down to 2,000.00 over but they also knew they had me because I did not want to walk awy from what I ordered ,and many of the other surounding dealer's could'nt even order because they did not have allocation and did not even have any to sell on their lots. I have dealt with this dealer every year for a long time because my husband buy's his work vehicle from them and his brother buys several each year for work/personal and I still did not get any special favors other than a discount for tint/ undercoating. They told me "fine if you don't want the car someone else will buy it even before you leave this office, we have a waiting list!" I am a sucker what can I say? But I got what I wanted and at least they compromised down to 2000.00 from 5000.00.
John Hall tried that BS with me & I told them to shove it, & I would never buy a car from them again...
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Old 09-14-2009, 07:27 PM   #18
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Also loosing faith ...
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1100, Preliminary order accepted ??
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Old 09-14-2009, 08:01 PM   #19
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Also loosing faith ...
been there man... still there... but doing p90x to save my sanity... or if you wanna look at it... using p90x to kill me before my sanity runs out
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1LT | RS | M6 | SIM | BA Stereo
1000 - [07-23-2009] Order Made at dealer
1100 - [08-04-2009] Preliminary order accepted
2000 - [08-25-2009] Accepted by GM
3000 - [09-01-2009] Accepted by production control TPW = 10-05-2009
3300 - [09-28-2009] Scheduled for production
3400 - [10-01-2009] Broadcast - Being Built
3800 - [10-13-2009] Produced - Built- VIN 2G1xxx54917
4200 - [10-19-2009] Shipped
5000 - [10-19-2009] Delivered to the dealer
6000 - [10-20-2009] Delivered to the customer

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Old 09-14-2009, 08:38 PM   #20
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Old 09-14-2009, 09:28 PM   #21
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It's not really the wait that is getting me, it is the lack of movement. I totally get that the factory is backlogged, but where I have an issue is that there are many people who have been waiting for quite some time and people who have ordered their cars later are getting build dates faster. Now I understand the concept of allocation, but it really seems ridiculous to me, as a consumer, I shouldn't have to run around to find a dealership that can place my order faster, it should be the same regardless of what dealership I order from. GM should be happy that we want to do business with them and produce our orders in the order that they were placed. If they need to take care of a big corporate client such as Avis first, then so be it, I can wait for that, but I don't want to wait for someone's car to be produced ahead of mine that ordered 2 months after me. It seems like GM is punishing the dealerships that sell more cars and punishing the consumer for being unaware that this is the way that they run their business. I can see why GM is in trouble as a corporation and unless they change their ways, they don't have a hope in hell of making it. I will patiently wait for my Camaro as all of you have because I love the car, but I will seriously think about giving GM any extra business simply because of the way they run their business. Which is really a shame, because the people that work there at the dealership, customer service and factory have all been great and are doing their best. It really not their fault that this system is in place, they are just set up for failure.
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Old 09-14-2009, 09:57 PM   #22
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It's not really the wait that is getting me, it is the lack of movement. I totally get that the factory is backlogged, but where I have an issue is that there are many people who have been waiting for quite some time and people who have ordered their cars later are getting build dates faster. Now I understand the concept of allocation, but it really seems ridiculous to me, as a consumer, I shouldn't have to run around to find a dealership that can place my order faster, it should be the same regardless of what dealership I order from. GM should be happy that we want to do business with them and produce our order in the order it was placed. If they need to take care of a big corporate client such as Avis first, then so be it, I can wait for that, but I don't want to wait for someone's care to be produced ahead of mine that ordered 2 months after me. It seems like GM is punishing the dealerships that sell more cars and punishing the consumer for being unaware that this is the way that they run their business. I can see why GM is in trouble as a corporation and unless they change their ways, they don't have a hope in hell of making it. I will patiently wait for my Camaro as all of you have because I love the car, but I will seriously think about giving GM any extra business simply because of the way they run their business, which is really a shame, because the people that work there at the dealership and customer service have all been great and it really not their fault that this system is in place, they are just set up for failure.
This is the way all companies in the automotive industry operate. Since the dealers are independent businesses, GM has to make deals with each of them based on their sales in order to make GM more profitable. If GM treats rural dealers the same as urban high-volume dealers, there will be the same problem of misappropriated cars that we're experiencing now.

You can't fault a company for making a good product. Blaming them for not getting something to you fast enough ignores the fact that everyone else wants the same thing, and no one can get it fast enough.

If you do Christmas shopping, then you know how the day after Thanksgiving is at Best Buy. Try getting that new TomTom. Do you blame TomTom for not making enough? Do you blame Best Buy for not ordering enough? I'll be you kick the sidewalk and blame yourself for not getting there soon enough to place your order. At the same time you're wishing there were a TomTom in that Best Buy, several miles away a surplus of the same product exists. A bunch of buyers left the TomToms for Magellan units. Their allocation of TomToms turned out to be too high, and your store had too few. Unless you go to that store, you'll never know better. Why should buying a car be any different? You've got to shop for the best place for you. You need to check every dealer for the best price and inventory. You could be the one and only Camaro order at one dealer or the fiftieth order at another. You need to find out which allocation is going to arrive first. GM isn't stupid. They don't give one car to every dealer at the same time. Some dealers get a lot more because they have a history of selling sports cars faster. If you were a gambler, I doubt you'd be betting on the horse in the back every race or the team that's had a losing record every year. GM is the same way. GM has to base its decisions to distribute based upon whether this dealer sells Corvettes or Cobalts faster or where they are located or how many Camaros sold in 2002. There are a lot of possible ways to slice the allocation equation, but the end of it is that it is a carefully evaluated equation based upon 100 years of selling cars to people who desperately want to drive the next GM vessel. They've been doing it forever, and no one is ever happy until it arrives.

Here's another example. Think about the last time you hit the grocery store. Is it fair that the guy in lane 7 who stood in a line of 10 people got out of the store faster than the guy in lane 3 who stood in a line of 5? Is it anyone's fault, other than Microsoft or IBM, that the lane 3 register crashed? Sometimes, the other guy is a faster checkout guy, and you didn't know going into business with some other checkout guy. Sometimes, your bagger is just slow, or the guy in line before you had to use exact change. Sometimes, circumstances out of anyone's control shuffle what should be the simple, straight line that we all wish was the way that everything could work. When we wait for a car, this is amplified because we aren't waiting for 3 minutes for some jackass to count pennies. Instead, we're waiting for weeks in line for any given car; and then, some company we all know and love makes a hit, and those tormenting weeks of waiting for that new car smell to be on our coats as we cruise on the highway in our new method of transportation expand to months as the demand piles up and the line grows in front of us.

It is hard to be patient when that line is so long, but somehow we manage. I like to think back to those lines at Six Flags when I was young and wanting to ride The Ninja. That roller coaster was a hit, and it had all the flips and swirls and sheer velocity every great ride does. It was long, and so was the line, but no line stopped you from loving the ride when you got inside. The Camaro is the ride, and the line is long for it, but was the line ever short for anything this good?

Yes—despite all my long sentences, there is a bottom line. Eventually everyone gets the car they wanted. It's a high-demand product, and you've got to wait for it. If you didn't have to wait, then it might not be a hit, which might mean it wasn't so great, which might mean you might not like it when it comes. It is worth the wait, and you know it is because none of those guys in front of you left the line because they know how big a hit it is because they are behind some other driver who could be on this very forum starting a thread not unlike this one about how allocation sucks and they should have their car by now. We should all have a car by now that we love to drive, but many of us are not so lucky, and those of us who are truly know how lucky they are because they remember the long wait. This wait sucks. We all know, and I won't even tell you that you'll forget when the car arrives. Instead, you'll remember how long and hard it has been for all of us, since 2003, thinking we'll never see one again. It's back, and so many of us have been waiting since then for the day to come that we drive another new Camaro. If you think your wait is tough, think of those guys who wanted it the day before you and someone managed to be behind you in line. It's harder for them.

Keep the faith. It's here, and yours is coming soon.
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Old 09-14-2009, 10:13 PM   #23
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Now I understand the concept of allocation, but it really seems ridiculous to me, as a consumer, I shouldn't have to run around to find a dealership that can place my order faster, it should be the same regardless of what dealership I order from.
No, you don't actually understand the concept of allocation. If you did, then the you wouldn't have said the rest of what you said above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by islandwiz View Post
GM should be happy that we want to do business with them and produce our orders in the order that they were placed.
They can't. They are required by law to do the allocation method.

Quote:
Originally Posted by islandwiz View Post
It seems like GM is punishing the dealerships that sell more cars and punishing the consumer for being unaware that this is the way that they run their business.
This is the exact opposite of the truth. There is a formula used for forecasting and providing allocation. It actually FAVORS dealers that are more successful. High volume dealers usually get more allocation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by islandwiz View Post
I can see why GM is in trouble as a corporation and unless they change their ways, they don't have a hope in hell of making it.
Yes yes, you can see why. And of course no one at GM ever thought of doing it your way. Look, GM knows your opinion. They likely agree. Customers and dealers alike spout this sort of counterproductive crap. " I can see why they are in trouble". Yeah, I've never heard THAT before. The fact remains that this method is in place. This method is currently required. If you don't like it, then walk. General Motors will not lose a sale on a Camaro if you walk. The guy in line behind you will get it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by islandwiz View Post
It really not their fault that this system is in place, they are just set up for failure.

Smartest thing you've said. I couldn't agree more. Many dealers are super (although some are just downright embarrassing to deal with. Some employees - even managers - are quite stupid). Customer Service reps are usually pretty good. The DBC reps are usually pretty good (not that you've ever dealt with them). They ARE set up for failure, but its not GM thats doing the setting up.

Look, I know I sound like a jerk in some parts of this, but the bottom line is this is the way it is. It's not changing unless the federal regulators that instituted allocation change their mind. No amount of people complaining or me explaining is going to change anything. No amount of "this is why GM is failing" is going to prove anything. This is in NO WAY related to why GM was failing as an enterprise. Those reasons are a conversation for another day or another place. GM is not losing money or business on the 2010 Camaro
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Old 09-14-2009, 11:34 PM   #24
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Wow can of beans! If I have insulted anyone, I apologize, that was not my intention. If this allocation system is what is required by law, then I apologize for spouting my rhetoric at General Motors and project it to the body of government that has made it that way. I expressed my dissatisfaction with the process, not the people who attempt to manage the process.
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Old 09-15-2009, 06:08 AM   #25
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Cracks me up when people say it's the law to use allocations ..... LOL..... Then they turn around and say one of the things it's based on it the competitions sales in the area...... Get your story straight .... LOL...... You can't have it both ways.... And it's about the dealer not about the customer, and that's wrong !!! Gm needs to regroup about this whole allocation thing they came up with....
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