A Long Rant, But Some Things To Consider...

[Warghost]

I've noticed a few people complaining about some very silly "issues" like the thickness of the rear bumper, the color of the turn signals in the front grill, the non-functional scoop (I refuse to call it a "mail slot"), etc. Yeah, it's unfortunate that some things had to change, but that doesn't change the fact that they had to. There is a reason why we can't all drive exact replicas of the Camaro concept, and that reason is because the government has regulations which force automakers to adhere to certain rules. You should all know by now that the bumper was thickened to protect you and your back seat passengers (like children and infants) from rear-end impacts. Get over it. The turn signals have to be amber because that is what the government has deemed best for safety. If you don't like them, change them.

Regarding the front scoop, I can't help but laugh when people complain about it. Some of the same people who are whining because the production model doesn't look identical to the concept are also unhappy that there's a front scoop. Some people are unhappy because the scoop isn't functional. Who cares? It's an aesthetic feature that was never designed to have a real function. The alternative in Mustangs is a hideous plastic box with a cheesy honeycomb grill that's taped on to the center of the hood. If you're standing closer than 15 feet from the Mustang, you can see a line between the scoop and the hood itself. I think the Camaro's scoop looks great, and it does add character to the car. If you don't like it, then have someone bondo it and re-paint it. Compared to the other performance cars available, there's no comparison in quality and options available.

There are some things that you guy should know before you threaten anyone with buying a Mustang or Challenger, like the fact that the Camaro (in SS V8 form) is getting 23MPG. Now, you should all understand that any car made before 2008 does NOT have an accurate MPG rating. It's not uncommon to see a 20-30% overestimation in the MPG of cars. That means that when your vehicle claims to get 25MPG on the highway, you are probably getting closer to 20MPG. When you add in imperfect road conditions, AC usage, drag from open windows, and heavy-footed acceleration, the estimated MPG claims are null and void. Starting this year all cars are much more accurate with this rating than ever before. So, the SS Camaro has 400-420 HP and still manages to get 23MPG, which is more like what older cars get when they claim to have 27-30MPG. Think about that.

Another thing that I see some people unhappy about is the models that GM is offering for the Camaro. We all want a Z28, and to think we'll never see another one is stupid. Scott has said that the Z28 isn't dead. If you like the Camaro, then buy one! Don't worry about missing out on a Z28. If one comes out, you can trade in your SS. You people do understand this concept, right?

Regarding the option packages available for the car, some of you need to lighten up a bit. Yes, the LED lighting isn't something that's most people consider a must-have feature, but I personally think it's a badass option that I really look forward to having. However, I'm a huge fan of Auto Meter's Cobalt series race gauges, and they are the same color. So, I'm biased. Regardless, if you don't like the interior lighting, turn it off. Don't complain about being given another option that you may want to disable. Some of us are capable of affording luxury options. As far as whether or not the lighting option should have been included with the leather upholstery, you should look at any car manufacturers' options packages. They are all the same, and this is a trend that will continue. My best advice is to convince yourself that you're really gonna love the LED lighting.

Sorry if this post comes off as harsh, but look at how much work went into this car, how hard everyone tried to reintroduce a legend, including a few GM folks who take time out of their day to keep us "in the loop" here on this forum. It seems like some people are being asses just because they're not being catered to. To all of you who feel that way, feel free to buy something other than a Camaro. Just keep in mind that this car is being built better than the competition, and offering the most bang for the buck.

[Sierra]

I agree with the above. Instead of looking at the negative look at the positive.

[LadiesMan217]

Fantastic post!

The little things can be fixed on your own. Remember, not everyone can get everything they want.

From concept to reality, they did a damn good job and the minor gripes people have will, most likely, be easily fixed with aftermarket products.

[Iwantmycamaronow]

chevrolet could have come out with a laundry list of different camaros and options to go along with it. there is always someone that isnt going to be happy no matter what.

this goes along with just about anything.

[GOT PSI]

I agree with the o/p as to "details". As a whole package I see the 5th gen as a great automobile and I can't wait to be driving my SS.

[MattG]

It's easy to see something as silly when it's not important to you. I would suggest that you don't assume that just because something isn't important to you, that doesn't mean it isn't important at all.

If someone says the color of the needle on the speedometer is important to them, then it is. You can't tell them they're wrong and it's not important. It may not be important to a majority of people, but that doesn't make them "wrong". It's their opinion. If something is a big issue or even a dealbreaker to one person, then it is. That is their choice -- The best thing we can do is respect their opinion.

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not advocating Chicken Little type 'The Camaro is ruined!' doomsday posts. But I still think folks should be able to post about the things they do or don't like about changes that are being made to the car over the course of its development -- isn't that what a discussion board dedicated to the new Camaro should be encouraging?

[radz28]

Originally Posted by Warghost

I've noticed a few people complaining about some very silly "issues" like the thickness of the rear bumper, the color of the turn signals in the front grill, the non-functional scoop (I refuse to call it a "mail slot"), etc. Yeah, it's unfortunate that some things had to change, but that doesn't change the fact that they had to. There is a reason why we can't all drive exact replicas of the Camaro concept, and that reason is because the government has regulations which force automakers to adhere to certain rules. You should all know by now that the bumper was thickened to protect you and your back seat passengers (like children and infants) from rear-end impacts. Get over it. The turn signals have to be amber because that is what the government has deemed best for safety. If you don't like them, change them.

Regarding the front scoop, I can't help but laugh when people complain about it. Some of the same people who are whining because the production model doesn't look identical to the concept are also unhappy that there's a front scoop. Some people are unhappy because the scoop isn't functional. Who cares? It's an aesthetic feature that was never designed to have a real function. The alternative in Mustangs is a hideous plastic box with a cheesy honeycomb grill that's taped on to the center of the hood. If you're standing closer than 15 feet from the Mustang, you can see a line between the scoop and the hood itself. I think the Camaro's scoop looks great, and it does add character to the car. If you don't like it, then have someone bondo it and re-paint it. Compared to the other performance cars available, there's no comparison in quality and options available.

There are some things that you guy should know before you threaten anyone with buying a Mustang or Challenger, like the fact that the Camaro (in SS V8 form) is getting 23MPG. Now, you should all understand that any car made before 2008 does NOT have an accurate MPG rating. It's not uncommon to see a 20-30% overestimation in the MPG of cars. That means that when your vehicle claims to get 25MPG on the highway, you are probably getting closer to 20MPG. When you add in imperfect road conditions, AC usage, drag from open windows, and heavy-footed acceleration, the estimated MPG claims are null and void. Starting this year all cars are much more accurate with this rating than ever before. So, the SS Camaro has 400-420 HP and still manages to get 23MPG, which is more like what older cars get when they claim to have 27-30MPG. Think about that.

Another thing that I see some people unhappy about is the models that GM is offering for the Camaro. We all want a Z28, and to think we'll never see another one is stupid. Scott has said that the Z28 isn't dead. If you like the Camaro, then buy one! Don't worry about missing out on a Z28. If one comes out, you can trade in your SS. You people do understand this concept, right?

Regarding the option packages available for the car, some of you need to lighten up a bit. Yes, the LED lighting isn't something that's most people consider a must-have feature, but I personally think it's a badass option that I really look forward to having. However, I'm a huge fan of Auto Meter's Cobalt series race gauges, and they are the same color. So, I'm biased. Regardless, if you don't like the interior lighting, turn it off. Don't complain about being given another option that you may want to disable. Some of us are capable of affording luxury options. As far as whether or not the lighting option should have been included with the leather upholstery, you should look at any car manufacturers' options packages. They are all the same, and this is a trend that will continue. My best advice is to convince yourself that you're really gonna love the LED lighting.

Sorry if this post comes off as harsh, but look at how much work went into this car, how hard everyone tried to reintroduce a legend, including a few GM folks who take time out of their day to keep us "in the loop" here on this forum. It seems like some people are being asses just because they're not being catered to. To all of you who feel that way, feel free to buy something other than a Camaro. Just keep in mind that this car is being built better than the competition, and offering the most bang for the buck.

[Chogan2200]

I skimmed through it...anyone have cliff notes?

[boxmonkeyracing]

just dispute one thing since I love doing that. gas mileage depending on brand and model was not inaccurate in the negative always. for example I've had several cars that used the old math and got an avg better then the epa rating. saturn ion got 39 mpg on the interstate as long as I kept it at 70 or below. 98 camaro got 28-29 between 65 and 70. silverado below 70 gets anywhere (depending on hills and if I run into stop lights/signs) gets 23-24. silverado was rated at 22. now depending on my mood that day my driving habit has a lot to do with actual MPG.


point being some people are going to blow this EPA rating out of the water. and others won't see it and be like wtf. it's more driving habits then anything.

[Mr. Wyndham]

those mpg numbers are NOT final, btw...those are NOT EPA numbers........

[Nickdago]

Since were on the topic of changes, can you tell me why they slimmed down the backend of this car from the concept. For me it totally changed the feel of this car and the stance that really made this car so intimidating. With that slimmed down backend it really looks much more plain, no more "Junk Yard Dog Mean"

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

Since were on the topic of changes, can you tell me why they slimmed down the backend of this car from the concept. For me it totally changed the feel of this car and the stance that really made this car so intimidating. With that slimmed down backend it really looks much more plain, no more "Junk Yard Dog Mean"

honestly can't tell the difference between the two like you are stating. but it more then likely has something to do with fitting people in the rear seats.

[Nickdago]

Why would they narrow the production car to get more space in the back? And all of my car buddies agree if you compare the photos of the production car to the concept the backend is noticably slimmer than the concept.

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

Why would they narrow the production car to get more space in the back? And all of my car buddies agree if you compare the photos of the production car to the concept the backend is noticably slimmer on the backend than the concept.

it's an optical illusion if it looks skinnier in back it could be because they widened the middle.

[The_Blur]

The new Camaro is an all-around amazing machine. I can't wait to drive one.

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

it's an optical illusion if it looks skinnier in back it could be because they widened the middle.

Maybe but there is something different about that rear quarter panel It does not jaunt out as much and the rear tire is thinner as well. It is definantly different I just can not put my finger on it yet but it changes the car and it's stance in the back quite a bit.

[96CAMaro]

Originally Posted by Warghost

I've noticed a few people complaining about some very silly "issues" like the thickness of the rear bumper, the color of the turn signals in the front grill, the non-functional scoop (I refuse to call it a "mail slot"), etc. Yeah, it's unfortunate that some things had to change, but that doesn't change the fact that they had to. There is a reason why we can't all drive exact replicas of the Camaro concept, and that reason is because the government has regulations which force automakers to adhere to certain rules. You should all know by now that the bumper was thickened to protect you and your back seat passengers (like children and infants) from rear-end impacts. Get over it. The turn signals have to be amber because that is what the government has deemed best for safety. If you don't like them, change them.

Regarding the front scoop, I can't help but laugh when people complain about it. Some of the same people who are whining because the production model doesn't look identical to the concept are also unhappy that there's a front scoop. Some people are unhappy because the scoop isn't functional. Who cares? It's an aesthetic feature that was never designed to have a real function. The alternative in Mustangs is a hideous plastic box with a cheesy honeycomb grill that's taped on to the center of the hood. If you're standing closer than 15 feet from the Mustang, you can see a line between the scoop and the hood itself. I think the Camaro's scoop looks great, and it does add character to the car. If you don't like it, then have someone bondo it and re-paint it. Compared to the other performance cars available, there's no comparison in quality and options available.

There are some things that you guy should know before you threaten anyone with buying a Mustang or Challenger, like the fact that the Camaro (in SS V8 form) is getting 23MPG. Now, you should all understand that any car made before 2008 does NOT have an accurate MPG rating. It's not uncommon to see a 20-30% overestimation in the MPG of cars. That means that when your vehicle claims to get 25MPG on the highway, you are probably getting closer to 20MPG. When you add in imperfect road conditions, AC usage, drag from open windows, and heavy-footed acceleration, the estimated MPG claims are null and void. Starting this year all cars are much more accurate with this rating than ever before. So, the SS Camaro has 400-420 HP and still manages to get 23MPG, which is more like what older cars get when they claim to have 27-30MPG. Think about that.

Another thing that I see some people unhappy about is the models that GM is offering for the Camaro. We all want a Z28, and to think we'll never see another one is stupid. Scott has said that the Z28 isn't dead. If you like the Camaro, then buy one! Don't worry about missing out on a Z28. If one comes out, you can trade in your SS. You people do understand this concept, right?

Regarding the option packages available for the car, some of you need to lighten up a bit. Yes, the LED lighting isn't something that's most people consider a must-have feature, but I personally think it's a badass option that I really look forward to having. However, I'm a huge fan of Auto Meter's Cobalt series race gauges, and they are the same color. So, I'm biased. Regardless, if you don't like the interior lighting, turn it off. Don't complain about being given another option that you may want to disable. Some of us are capable of affording luxury options. As far as whether or not the lighting option should have been included with the leather upholstery, you should look at any car manufacturers' options packages. They are all the same, and this is a trend that will continue. My best advice is to convince yourself that you're really gonna love the LED lighting.

Sorry if this post comes off as harsh, but look at how much work went into this car, how hard everyone tried to reintroduce a legend, including a few GM folks who take time out of their day to keep us "in the loop" here on this forum. It seems like some people are being asses just because they're not being catered to. To all of you who feel that way, feel free to buy something other than a Camaro. Just keep in mind that this car is being built better than the competition, and offering the most bang for the buck.

What about the weight ( ) of the Camaro, I need to feel better about the weight ( ).

[Warghost]

Originally Posted by MattG

It's easy to see something as silly when it's not important to you. I would suggest that you don't assume that just because something isn't important to you, that doesn't mean it isn't important at all.

The speedometer displaying digits in increments of 5 instead of 20 is important to me, and there's no reason why GM had to leave spaces between the digits, but they did. And it's too late to change it, so why let it bother you?

I also reeeally liked the rear end that was flatter, like the Corvette. However, I understand why it had to change. I also understand that every car ever made has something, at least one thing that I would want to change. And no car will ever be perfect. Kinda like people I guess.

[Warghost]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

Since were on the topic of changes, can you tell me why they slimmed down the backend of this car from the concept.

They didn't slim the car, they made the cockpit wider on the back end, so adults could fit in the back seat.

[jmliptak]

Originally Posted by 96CAMaro

What about the weight ( ) of the Camaro, I need to feel better about the weight ( ).

DO some research on the new side impact standards and you will find the main culprit. For 2009, you only require side airbags, but after that things get more extensive and require substantial improvements in the structure itself. There is a reason there is going to be 2010 Mustang, because the current version was designed BEFORE those standards. The requirements continue to increase through 2012, so the new Camaro was engineered to meet those requirements today.

[Warghost]

Originally Posted by 96CAMaro

What about the weight ( ) of the Camaro, I need to feel better about the weight ( ).

Errr....uhhh....it's still lighter than the Challenger?

I do share your concerns regarding the weight of the car, but I have always been a firm believer that you get a lot of nice options and bells & whistles with added weight. The Mustang GT hasn't impressed me since 2004, and the interior looks very boring. Still, it's pretty light at 3550lbs. The Challenger is 4150lbs and the interior looks boring (imho), so where's the weight? In the engine. The same goes for the Camaro. The SS engine is a lot bigger than the Mustang GT's, and the interior is more....full.

Also, I think the new Camaro has six airbags, right? I think I remember reading about two knee air bags as well as two should/head curtain bags. And of course the two front airbags.

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by Warghost

They didn't slim the car, they made the cockpit wider on the back end, so adults could fit in the back seat.

OK. Well I guess that explains the different look. I knew something was way different just could not quite figure it out but that makes sense, although I still do not like it and I would guess that it would not be a look that would change with the SS or Z28 either.

[jmliptak]

Originally Posted by Warghost

Also, I think the new Camaro has six airbags, right? I think I remember reading about two knee air bags as well as two should/head curtain bags. And of course the two front airbags.

All cars will require the side airbags for head protection in 2009 and the side impact requirements increase every year till 2012. The Camaro is designed to meet those standards. The Mustang is built on an older platform and I do not think it is COINCIDENCE that there will be a new model in 2010 which is the year that the side impact requirements go beyond simply having the additional airbags.....

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by Warghost

The same goes for the Camaro. The SS engine is a lot bigger than the Mustang GT's

bigger in displacement, but the dimensions of the engine as a whole probably aren't that different. And the 4.6 in the GT is also sohc and that will add weight. The LS engines are very lightweight considering their power. But the 6.1L hemi is heavy, still an iron block.

[lordfriday2]

i love this post, you're never going to please everyone.. thanks for this information!