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Old 03-18-2010, 06:01 PM   #51
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Pete, the SS brake calipers are Brembo's, do you know who makes the 6 piston CTS-V calipers? SLP upgraded their car with 6 piston Brembo's and did not see much of a difference in stopping distance. Have you had a chance to test the stopping distance of the SS brakes and the Camaro with CTS-V brakes?
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Old 03-18-2010, 06:39 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Reeko View Post
So,
This is the first time I heard that you need a programmer/scan-tool to do a full brake bleed.

So, if I want to completely flush my brake fluid, I need a programmer?
The only way to cycle the 2010 Camaro ABS pump on the rack is with a Tech II. That means the only way to change out brake fluid is with a TECH II.

If all you are doing is bleeding a caliper you do not need to cycle the ABS pump and would not need a Tech II.
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Old 03-18-2010, 06:42 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by OldJedi View Post
Pete, the SS brake calipers are Brembo's, do you know who makes the 6 piston CTS-V calipers? SLP upgraded their car with 6 piston Brembo's and did not see much of a difference in stopping distance. Have you had a chance to test the stopping distance of the SS brakes and the Camaro with CTS-V brakes?
Yhe CTS-V calipers are made by Brembo. We have not had track time to measure stopping distance. Spring and track time are near. Subjectively there seems be a significant improvement. We'll find out soon enough.

Which Brembo system did SLP use?
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Old 03-18-2010, 07:01 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by OldJedi View Post
...do you know who makes the 6 piston CTS-V calipers? SLP upgraded their car with 6 piston Brembo's and did not see much of a difference in stopping distance. Have you had a chance to test the stopping distance of the SS brakes and the Camaro with CTS-V brakes?
They are also Brembos -- and are LOT better piece than the ones on the front of the SS. The Caddy front units are very similar to the ones on the ZR1, Nissan GT-R, Ferrari Enzo and Mercedes-Benz CL63 and like the better Brembo Gran Turismo aftermarket kits. They will feel better and handle more heat than the lower-level SS units as they are stiffer and have more pad surface area.

Having said that, there is no guarantee of better panic stopping distances. That is controlled by the tires and ABS. To stop quicker, get stickier tires and make slight change to the mechanical brake bias.

Has anyone done the math on the CTS-V system to make sure it is has the correct balance for the V-8 Camaro? If it moves it more toward the front axle, that would be going the wrong way.

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Old 03-18-2010, 07:07 PM   #55
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They are also Brembos -- and are LOT better piece than the ones on the front of the SS. The Caddy front units are very similar to the ones on the ZR1, Nissan GT-R, Ferrari Enzo and Mercedes-Benz CL63 and like the better Brembo Gran Turismo aftermarket kits. They will feel better and handle more heat than the lower-level SS units as they are stiffer and have more pad surface area.

Having said that, there is no guarantee of better panic stopping distances. That is controlled by the tires and ABS. To stop quicker, get stickier tires and make slight change to the mechanical brake bias.

Has anyone done the math on the CTS-V system to make sure it is has the correct balance for the V-8 Camaro? If it moves it more toward the front axle, that would be going the wrong way.

Chris
Yes the math and more has been done by brake engineers with the expertise required to do it correctly. Anyone that doubts this simply does not know me.
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Old 03-18-2010, 07:28 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Chris_B View Post
They are also Brembos -- and are LOT better piece than the ones on the front of the SS. The Caddy front units are very similar to the ones on the ZR1, Nissan GT-R, Ferrari Enzo and Mercedes-Benz CL63 and like the better Brembo Gran Turismo aftermarket kits. They will feel better and handle more heat than the lower-level SS units as they are stiffer and have more pad surface area.

Having said that, there is no guarantee of better panic stopping distances. That is controlled by the tires and ABS. To stop quicker, get stickier tires and make slight change to the mechanical brake bias.

Has anyone done the math on the CTS-V system to make sure it is has the correct balance for the V-8 Camaro? If it moves it more toward the front axle, that would be going the wrong way.

Chris
Probably won't make much difference during the first stop, but the next 20 or 30 brake stabs will likely be much more confidence inspiring considering how this car is driven (and by whom.)
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Old 03-18-2010, 07:46 PM   #57
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Probably won't make much difference during the first stop, but the next 20 or 30 brake stabs will likely be much more confidence inspiring considering how this car is driven (and by whom.)
Agreed. Except that it probably would take quite a few less stops to find the difference! Confidence is key to braking efficiently, and better, stiffer components inspire higher levels of confidence.
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Old 03-18-2010, 07:51 PM   #58
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Yes the math and more has been done by brake engineers with the expertise required to do it correctly. Anyone that doubts this simply does not know me.
No doubts, just a question. It is an important issue, so thanks for clarifying as we may not have met yet. I am interested in knowing what the overall balance shift was, but maybe I'm the only one?
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Old 03-18-2010, 08:45 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JusticePete View Post
Yhe CTS-V calipers are made by Brembo. We have not had track time to measure stopping distance. Spring and track time are near. Subjectively there seems be a significant improvement. We'll find out soon enough.

Which Brembo system did SLP use?
On the SLP Performance web site, there is a Motor Week Video testing of their ZL575. The car had the 'upgraded Brembo GT Brake package' which had a 0-60 stopping distance of 110 Ft. I thought this was pretty close to the stock SS stopping distance.
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Old 03-18-2010, 08:55 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldJedi View Post
On the SLP Performance web site, there is a Motor Week Video testing of their ZL575. The car had the 'upgraded Brembo GT Brake package' which had a 0-60 stopping distance of 110 Ft. I thought this was pretty close to the stock SS stopping distance.
Motor Trend printed 60-0 in 106 ft with automatic

In fact the V6 stops faster than the V8. But no one checks the braking after 5-10 60 to zero stops. This one is more important than just the 1 stop

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Old 03-18-2010, 09:36 PM   #61
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Nice write up !!! I need some of those.
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:47 AM   #62
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I have several emails / PMs asking how much the Cadillac of Brakes for the 2010 Camaro cost me. Here is the reply in public.

You wouldn't want to know what it cost me. Doing the first is usually ugly. It didn't take an hour to do the brake bleed / fluid change. It took a day. Why? There was no information on how to do a fluid change and the new Internet based GM scan tool didn't have a function for this. So you research. You make calls. No one knows so you start guessing at solutions until you find one. We finally stumbled across the 2010 Corvette ABS routine in the Tech II tool. It looks easy in the thread. Witt has done all the hard work and the post makes it easy -- now.

I am treated like family at Witt, which is wonderful. I do get a discounted labor rate because of the volume of work we do with Witt. They offer similar programs to other corporate service accounts. That said, virtually NOTHING we do together goes as planned because we are not at leading edge technology -- we are at the BLEEDING edge of technology. R & D, first fitments, test fitments take more time, blood sweat and tears than we ever allot for. That's OK. It is part of the business we LOVE.

I hope you all enjoy the benefits of what people / companies like Witt Buick Pedders bring to the community. It is a business. They do make money. If they didn't share our enthusiasm for special cars, projects and people they wouldn't let us in the front door.

Long story short, if you need prices or parts numbers that are not in the thread, give Arthur a call at Witt Buick Pedders or call your local Pedders Dealer. Please don't ask me for the information -- I don't have what you really need -- unless you want to pay my bill for the brake work at Witt.
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:59 AM   #63
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:17 AM   #64
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Here is the contact info for Witt Buick and who to contact for these Brakes

Arthur at Witt Buick Pedders (231) 722-3771

Witt Buick
67 W. Western Avenue
Muskegon, MI, 49442-1089

thanks
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Old 03-19-2010, 11:20 AM   #65
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I have to say I really like the way that you folks promote your gear
You never knock the base car and never resort to over the top claims, and your website is really well laid out for each kit. You really do seem to try to stick to your "No Bull" tagline.

I can see a Pedders upgrade in my cars future
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Old 03-20-2010, 03:53 AM   #66
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CTS-V Front Calipers, Rotors, Pads and Lines are $2,075. Witt Buick Pedders will install them including fluid and full ABS bleed for $2,349.99.

Excellent work, and thanks for the front only price.
I wanted to confirm that the stock SS 20's will fit afterwards.

Thanks again!
Speed
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:54 AM   #67
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Has anyone done the math on the CTS-V system to make sure it is has the correct balance for the V-8 Camaro? If it moves it more toward the front axle, that would be going the wrong way.

Chris
Since Pete's car doesn't nose dive, I imagine the rears are having to earn their keep, even tho GM oversized the rear already. I would bet good money we're looking at what the Z/28 brakes were originally going to be.

You did get my curiosity up tho, have you done the math yet?
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Old 03-20-2010, 01:11 PM   #68
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the Pedders Camaro has been corner balance, and is lighter than a CTSV. since they are increasing the brake effectiveness equally, and the proportioning is programmed for the Camaro and not the CTSV, I would have no concerns or worries on brake imbalance. In fact, I would bet the Pedders Camaro will significantly out-brake a CTSV. Out handle it big time as well.

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Old 03-20-2010, 03:24 PM   #69
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Since Pete's car doesn't nose dive, I imagine the rears are having to earn their keep, even tho GM oversized the rear already. I would bet good money we're looking at what the Z/28 brakes were originally going to be.

You did get my curiosity up tho, have you done the math yet?
I will when time allows for my own benefit. Nose diving is more of a function of suspension geometry and spring/damper rates, so I'll look at hard numbers. GM was obviously not concerned too much about weight (perhaps they let too many engineers go?) or they would have done a much more reasonably sized rear system. It's a straight lift from the CTS-V and might be a bit too much iron to run at temperatures that are complementary to the fronts. They will work, but I would estimate they are not at optimum.

I need a little more info on the CTS-V calipers to get it all sorted out. After I get a few of the too many projects off of my plate, I'll chase that stuff down.

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Old 03-20-2010, 04:06 PM   #70
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the Pedders Camaro has been corner balance, and is lighter than a CTSV. since they are increasing the brake effectiveness equally, and the proportioning is programmed for the Camaro and not the CTSV, I would have no concerns or worries on brake imbalance. In fact, I would bet the Pedders Camaro will significantly out-brake a CTSV. Out handle it big time as well.

mike
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I'd like to see some back to back (x10 or till Pete's eyes pop out of socket LOL) 100 - 0 distances along side a stock SS
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Old 03-20-2010, 06:30 PM   #71
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I'd like to see some back to back (x10 or till Pete's eyes pop out of socket LOL) 100 - 0 distances along side a stock SS
On March 29th in New Jersey, we will be putting the Pedders Camaro thru its paces.
I would think Pete would do some kind of brake test.

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Old 03-21-2010, 12:52 AM   #72
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you guys continue to amaze.
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Old 03-21-2010, 11:03 AM   #73
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im assuming these CTS-V brakes are from the newest 2009+ generation of V car correct?
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Old 03-21-2010, 11:08 AM   #74
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im assuming these CTS-V brakes are from the newest 2009+ generation of V car correct?
They are the latest CTS-V brakes

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Old 03-21-2010, 11:36 AM   #75
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It will be pricey. I Managed to find the parts on GMpartsdirect and the front calipers alone were 325/ea.

**Edit**
Interesting finding. Maybe you can explain since you did front and rear swaps from the V. When looking online at prices the right rear caliper is significantly cheaper than the left rear...

I'm seeing a diff of about 3x the cost for the left over the right.

Care to post part numbers for all pieces required?
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