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Forced Induction - V8 V8 Supercharger, turbo, nitrous discussions

View Poll Results: Which is the your supercharger of choice as a bolt on for a 100% bone stock L99 A6 ?
Kenne Bell 52 17.93%
Magnuson TVS2300 122 42.07%
Vortech V-3 Si-Trim Supercharger Kit 25 8.62%
Magnacharger Intercooled Supercharger 18 6.21%
L99 ProCharger High Output Intercooled P1SC Kit 20 6.90%
Edelbrock E-Force Supercharger Street Legal Kit 36 12.41%
My choice is not listed. I will post my choice on the thread. 24 8.28%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 290. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-04-2010, 09:34 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by Darth_Emma View Post
The 362 rwhp is with LT headers, intake, exhaust, and a tune. I'm hoping a Maggie will get my close to 500 rwhp.
I think if your looking to get close to the 500 number, make sure to use the 3.6 pulley. I also did a L99/LS3 conversion plus a GT-11 cam with the 3.6 and pulled 553rwhp running 6.5psi.
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Old 06-04-2010, 04:02 PM   #77
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A turbo system is much more complicated. It has to be plumbed into the engine's oil pan for lubrication and depending on the turbo mfg'er, into the engine's coolant system for cooling. There is a lot more plumbing for the required air-to-air IC. Your under hood heat is gonna be higher as you now have a large metal scroll being super heated by exhaust gases.
And unless you get the scroll size matched perfectly to the engine's capabilities you are gonna have lag (too big) or just not make the numbers you want (too small). And it really is irrelevant as the bottom end of our engine's is not gonna like more than 8-10psi, so I would rather have the instant hit from the SC.

The maggie is 100% self contained. It really is a very nice package.
Let me start by saying I am a huge fan of Magnuson and we work hand and hand on projects. With that said please allow me to address a few of your statements:

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Originally Posted by hypurone View Post
A turbo system is much more complicated.
That is subjective Ė As an example, when installing a turbo, you donít spend extra money on pulley changes, you donít need to drill into or install the crank pulley, you do not need to modify the heater hoses and plumbing, you donít need to plumb hose to and from the heat exchanger (installing the heat exchanger for the Maggie is the same time it takes to install the Intercooler for a turbo.

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It has to be plumbed into the engine's oil pan for lubrication and depending on the turbo mfg'er, into the engine's coolant system for cooling.
Nope. No piping or drilling of oil pan. Oil drains back into the valve cover. And most turbos these days do not require water cooling.

[QUOTE=hypurone;1942580] a lot more plumbing for the required air-to-air IC.QUOTE]
I agree there is more tubing with the turbo than with a Maggie system but no more than a Paxton, Vortech or Procharger set up and in exchange the discharge temps are way lower on the turbo then the Maggie. Air to air intercooling has a lower discharge temp then a Maggie at boost and cruise

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Your under hood heat is gonna be higher as you now have a large metal scroll being super heated by exhaust gases.
Nope. The Maggie sits smack in the center of the engine and compressing air makes heat regardless of the device that compresses it. If you have a top mount turbo I agree the Maggie is most likely cooler but twin turbo like the Hellion and TTi/GMS kit will have lower under hood temps than a Maggie for 2 reasons; 1. They are down stream of the stock exhaust manifolds and 2. They is nothing in the engine compartment to make the temp goes up Ė Naturally at boost the turbos create heat but the air from the turbo is cooled by the huge tubing and heat from the housings is dissipated by the air rush across them at cruise

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Originally Posted by hypurone View Post
And unless you get the scroll size matched perfectly to the engine's capabilities you are gonna have lag (too big) or just not make the numbers you want (too small)
It is pretty tough to run too small of a turbo when there are twins. Even 2 pewny turbos like 50mm each would make 800hp which is a ton of power Ė the Hellion turbos are 58mm and the Granatelli turbos are 62mm I can tell you there is no lag on the Granatelli system and looking at the Hellion numbers they donít lag either. Admittedly the Maggie will make more torque below 2500 rpm

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Originally Posted by hypurone View Post
And it really is irrelevant as the bottom end of our engine's is not gonna like more than 8-10psi, so I would rather have the instant hit from the SC. The maggie is 100% self contained. It really is a very nice package.
Again I agree the Maggie is nice and as easy to install as any other system. But if you talk about stress on the engine the turbos create les stress because they donít drive and create crank shaft load. The number speak for themselves Ė if your goal is 600 rear wheel (100 more than a ZR1) then you can get there for less money with w twin turbo set up and have less stress on the motor because it will take less boost
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Old 06-04-2010, 04:54 PM   #78
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[QUOTE=Granatelli;1946240]Let me start by saying I am a huge fan of Magnuson and we work hand and hand on projects. With that said please allow me to address a few of your statements:


That is subjective Ė As an example, when installing a turbo, you donít spend extra money on pulley changes, you donít need to drill into or install the crank pulley, you do not need to modify the heater hoses and plumbing, you donít need to plumb hose to and from the heat exchanger (installing the heat exchanger for the Maggie is the same time it takes to install the Intercooler for a turbo.the size of which can be challenging to route without modifying the car in some way


Nope. No piping or drilling of oil pan. Oil drains back into the valve cover. And most turbos these days do not require water cooling. Where are you obtaining the oil to lubricate the turbo(s) then? You have to tap in somewhere...and tap in again to route to the valve cover(s)

Quote:
Originally Posted by hypurone View Post
a lot more plumbing for the required air-to-air IC.QUOTE]
I agree there is more tubing with the turbo than with a Maggie system but no more than a Paxton, Vortech or Procharger set up and in exchange the discharge temps are way lower on the turbo then the Maggie. Air to air intercooling has a lower discharge temp then a Maggie at boost and cruisebut as with most front mount IC that are air-to-air and need to be very thick in comparison, car cooling suffers or has to be modified in some way to handle the extra heat shed into the rad by the IC



Nope. The Maggie sits smack in the center of the engine and compressing air makes heat regardless of the device that compresses it. If you have a top mount turbo I agree the Maggie is most likely cooler but twin turbo like the Hellion and TTi/GMS kit will have lower under hood temps than a Maggie for 2 reasons; 1. They are down stream of the stock exhaust manifolds and 2. They is nothing in the engine compartment to make the temp goes up Ė Naturally at boost the turbos create heat but the air from the turbo is cooled by the huge tubing and heat from the housings is dissipated by the air rush across them at cruiseturbos need to be close enough to the manifolds to have sufficient flow to spin them, if they are this close to be efficient, they are gonna add to the under hood temp and now you are talking 2 of them...unless of course you are going rear mount but then you suffer lag

It is pretty tough to run too small of a turbo when there are twins. Even 2 pewny turbos like 50mm each would make 800hp which is a ton of power Ė the Hellion turbos are 58mm and the Granatelli turbos are 62mm I can tell you there is no lag on the Granatelli system and looking at the Hellion numbers they donít lag either. Admittedly the Maggie will make more torque below 2500 rpm a twin system adds complexity and additional points of failure



Again I agree the Maggie is nice and as easy to install as any other system. But if you talk about stress on the engine the turbos create les stress because they donít drive and create crank shaft load. The number speak for themselves Ė if your goal is 600 rear wheel (100 more than a ZR1) then you can get there for less money with w twin turbo set up and have less stress on the motor because it will take less boost
Not arguing here, just pointing out some stuff that I have seen in the past and can make a difference in some folks minds and some kits don't address...
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Old 06-04-2010, 05:17 PM   #79
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Oil comes from sending unit - just a simple T goes in line and oil goes back into the valve cover through the oil fill cap - no drill or tap

No mods to install intercooler either
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Old 06-04-2010, 05:19 PM   #80
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i have a L99 car with Cold Air Inductions CAI and i want to do a whipple 2.9 with LG Motorsports super pro headers and LG's 3" exhaust has anyone done this or are we still waiting I have a year to go before i can pull the trigger just was wondering if it has been done yet
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Old 06-05-2010, 11:15 AM   #81
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i have a L99 car with Cold Air Inductions CAI and i want to do a whipple 2.9 with LG Motorsports super pro headers and LG's 3" exhaust has anyone done this or are we still waiting I have a year to go before i can pull the trigger just was wondering if it has been done yet
Whipple didn't release their blower yet.
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Old 06-05-2010, 12:34 PM   #82
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I'm leaning toward the KB after reading this and other threads, nothing against Maggie it seems the safe way to go.
Question for you guys i also have the CAI intake installed will it work with KB?
If not i have no problem selling it and going with the KB mammoth, the only thing i am wondering is the filter looks pretty low, will it not take on water when driving in rain.
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Old 06-06-2010, 12:04 AM   #83
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I'm leaning toward the KB after reading this and other threads, nothing against Maggie it seems the safe way to go.
Question for you guys i also have the CAI intake installed will it work with KB?
If not i have no problem selling it and going with the KB mammoth, the only thing i am wondering is the filter looks pretty low, will it not take on water when driving in rain.
If you saw the KB setup there is no way you're aftermarket intake that you have on there now will fit a KB. So, you would have to sell it, or keep it, give it away, or whatever else you would like to do with it.
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Old 06-06-2010, 03:37 AM   #84
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Where to buy the supercharger.

Where are the best places/retailers to order a maggie, kenny belly, procharger, or vortec from ? Are the kits any different depending on who you order it from?
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Old 06-06-2010, 12:45 PM   #85
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Where are the best places/retailers to order a maggie, kenny belly, procharger, or vortec from ? Are the kits any different depending on who you order it from?
A SC is a SC no matter who you buy it from. It's the service AFTER the sale, where you need to worry about. There are different kits, so you need to make sure what you're getting before you click the buy button. Some are complete kits and some are tuner kits. If you have a favorite shop that will be tuning the setup, you need to order the tuner kit.
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Old 06-07-2010, 03:26 PM   #86
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I'm leaning toward the KB after reading this and other threads, nothing against Maggie it seems the safe way to go.
Question for you guys i also have the CAI intake installed will it work with KB?
If not i have no problem selling it and going with the KB mammoth, the only thing i am wondering is the filter looks pretty low, will it not take on water when driving in rain.
If you go with the KB you'll be very satisfied with their CAI system. It's an actual cold air kit as it has a giant filter that draws air from a little lower than the engine bay.

I think it's a great deal because CAI kits cost hundreds of dollars and you get one included in your KB kit. Plus, it is solidly constructed and is very big tubing.

Regarding the question about water entering the filter, I have complete faith that KB took that into consideration when they designed their system. Just my opinion.

But, I would estimate that the bottom of the KB filter is at least 9"-10" above the road surface.
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Old 06-07-2010, 06:27 PM   #87
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Where are the best places/retailers to order a maggie, kenny belly, procharger, or vortec from ? Are the kits any different depending on who you order it from?
Granatelli Motor Sports has them all - they are Deep WD with Magnuson, Paxton, Vortech, Procharger, Whipple and KB - They also Sell their own turbo kit and Hellion.

They have great service before and after the sale too - plus they keep stock
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Old 06-07-2010, 07:19 PM   #88
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Old 06-08-2010, 03:58 AM   #89
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If you go with the KB you'll be very satisfied with their CAI system. It's an actual cold air kit as it has a giant filter that draws air from a little lower than the engine bay.

I think it's a great deal because CAI kits cost hundreds of dollars and you get one included in your KB kit. Plus, it is solidly constructed and is very big tubing.

Regarding the question about water entering the filter, I have complete faith that KB took that into consideration when they designed their system. Just my opinion.

But, I would estimate that the bottom of the KB filter is at least 9"-10" above the road surface.
This is an added PLUS !
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Old 06-09-2010, 01:36 PM   #90
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Thanks for the comments and the pictures. It looks like my CAI intake will work fine with the TVS2300. It also looks like the Maggie might add about 120 rwhp? My car currently is making at 362 rwhp (L99 with intake, headers, exhaust, and tune).
On my L99 Just Lt's Cats and exhaust. 3.6 pulley and a tune.

488 RWHP 502 FT lBS of Torque at rear.

Out of fuel at 64oo RPM AFR shoots to 12.0 and climbing at 6200.

For what its worth.... That was with 300 miles on the car.

(see profile / albums for Dyno Pulls on both my LS3 and L99)
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Old 06-09-2010, 04:19 PM   #91
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On my L99 Just Lt's Cats and exhaust. 3.6 pulley and a tune.

488 RWHP 502 FT lBS of Torque at rear.

Out of fuel at 64oo RPM AFR shoots to 12.0 and climbing at 6200.

For what its worth.... That was with 300 miles on the car.

(see profile / albums for Dyno Pulls on both my LS3 and L99)

carguy:
You only have LT headers w/ cats, exhaust, 3.6 pulley, and a tune?

You're getting 488 rwhp?

I also have a CAI intake, but I have no 3.6 pulley, and I'm getting 362 rwhp.

You don't have a blower?
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Old 06-09-2010, 11:24 PM   #92
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carguy:
You only have LT headers w/ cats, exhaust, 3.6 pulley, and a tune?

You're getting 488 rwhp?

I also have a CAI intake, but I have no 3.6 pulley, and I'm getting 362 rwhp.

You don't have a blower?
The 3.6 pulley he is referring to is the blower pulley.
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Old 06-27-2010, 06:10 AM   #93
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The maggie system says it's complete. What do they do with the PCV valve system ?

Oh and where do you get parts and belts when you finally need them ?
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Old 06-28-2010, 07:25 PM   #94
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I got 483 RWHP with the Vortech kit on a stock L99
with pre-programmed tune. fwiw
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Old 06-29-2010, 01:51 AM   #95
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I got 483 RWHP with the Vortech kit on a stock L99
with pre-programmed tune. fwiw
L99 or LS3 ?
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Old 06-29-2010, 12:29 PM   #96
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L99 or LS3 ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by aet08
I got 483 RWHP with the Vortech kit on a stock L99
with pre-programmed tune. fwiw
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Old 06-29-2010, 04:05 PM   #97
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The maggie system says it's complete. What do they do with the PCV valve system ?

Oh and where do you get parts and belts when you finally need them ?
You can get the belts at any good part store,thats typicaly all thats needed for maitnence
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Old 07-04-2010, 02:02 PM   #98
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I have a quote for having a Maggie installed in my Camaro. I have an L99. I completely trust the judgment of the guys who run the shop I'm working with. I'm just interested in the opinions of folks who know more about motors and superchargers than I do (that would be almost everyone!). Let me start by listing what my car has as far as performance mods go:
Pfadt sport suspension+
CAI intake
Kooks 1 7/8" LT coated headers with high flow cats
Borla touring exhaust
tune dynojet, HP tuners
(My car dynod at 362 rwhp after this work was completed).

Here are the parts the shop has recommended for me:
Magnacharger tuner system (I requested the polished version, I like bling in the engine bay)
3.6" pulley
60 lb.hr injectors
Cooling system components: Tech AFX heater hose relocation kit
Tuning on Dynojet

I am building this car to learn about cars and to have fun. I am not planning to race it, but I'm trying to build the coolest and meanest street car I can within reason (don't ask me what I mean by "within reason." I'm not sure what that means either, but I know I'm not there yet.) I'd like to get the car over 500 rwhp. I think that should be enough to scare me a bit! Reliability and driveability on the street are high priorities to me.

What do you think? Am I missing something important? Like I said, I trust the guys at my shop. They are great. I just like to talk things through and make sure I've thought things through properly before investing this much money.

Thanks to all of you for any advice you can give.

I hope this isn't considered a thread jack. I thought it was a question that is on topic.
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Old 07-04-2010, 02:13 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth_Emma View Post
I have a quote for having a Maggie installed in my Camaro. I have an L99. I completely trust the judgment of the guys who run the shop I'm working with. I'm just interested in the opinions of folks who know more about motors and superchargers than I do (that would be almost everyone!). Let me start by listing what my car has as far as performance mods go:
Pfadt sport suspension+
CAI intake
Kooks 1 7/8" LT coated headers with high flow cats
Borla touring exhaust
tune dynojet, HP tuners
(My car dynod at 362 rwhp after this work was completed).

Here are the parts the shop has recommended for me:
Magnacharger tuner system (I requested the polished version, I like bling in the engine bay)
3.6" pulley
60 lb.hr injectors
Cooling system components: Tech AFX heater hose relocation kit
Tuning on Dynojet

I am building this car to learn about cars and to have fun. I am not planning to race it, but I'm trying to build the coolest and meanest street car I can within reason (don't ask me what I mean by "within reason." I'm not sure what that means either, but I know I'm not there yet.) I'd like to get the car over 500 rwhp. I think that should be enough to scare me a bit! Reliability and driveability on the street are high priorities to me.

What do you think? Am I missing something important? Like I said, I trust the guys at my shop. They are great. I just like to talk things through and make sure I've thought things through properly before investing this much money.

Thanks to all of you for any advice you can give.

I hope this isn't considered a thread jack. I thought it was a question that is on topic.
Let me start a new thread with this same question. Please forgive me if quoting your response here in this thread over in the new thread is unacceptable. I want 500rwtq with my build (see sig).
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Old 08-17-2010, 12:52 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth_Emma View Post
I have a quote for having a Maggie installed in my Camaro. I have an L99. I completely trust the judgment of the guys who run the shop I'm working with. I'm just interested in the opinions of folks who know more about motors and superchargers than I do (that would be almost everyone!). Let me start by listing what my car has as far as performance mods go:
Pfadt sport suspension+
CAI intake
Kooks 1 7/8" LT coated headers with high flow cats
Borla touring exhaust
tune dynojet, HP tuners
(My car dynod at 362 rwhp after this work was completed).

Here are the parts the shop has recommended for me:
Magnacharger tuner system (I requested the polished version, I like bling in the engine bay)
3.6" pulley
60 lb.hr injectors
Cooling system components: Tech AFX heater hose relocation kit
Tuning on Dynojet

I am building this car to learn about cars and to have fun. I am not planning to race it, but I'm trying to build the coolest and meanest street car I can within reason (don't ask me what I mean by "within reason." I'm not sure what that means either, but I know I'm not there yet.) I'd like to get the car over 500 rwhp. I think that should be enough to scare me a bit! Reliability and driveability on the street are high priorities to me.

What do you think? Am I missing something important? Like I said, I trust the guys at my shop. They are great. I just like to talk things through and make sure I've thought things through properly before investing this much money.

Thanks to all of you for any advice you can give.

I hope this isn't considered a thread jack. I thought it was a question that is on topic.
I was getting 362rwhp stock parts. This seems strange to me. With LT headers, new exhaust, and CAI I'm getting about 418rwhp at last dyno at 30 deg. heat wave. You might want to get a custom tune. And if you want 500rwhp. I'm no expert but I'm sure that's acheivable without an SC.
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