Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com
 
PFYC
Go Back   Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums - Camaro5.com > Technical Camaro Topics > Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Navigation, Radar, Electronics Forum

Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Navigation, Radar, Electronics Forum All audio, video, bluetooth, nav, radar, and electronics discussions.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-19-2010, 03:21 AM   #1
CamaroDreams07


 
CamaroDreams07's Avatar
 
Drives: Slow V6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Lansing, MI
Posts: 9,287
Amp Recommendations?

I'm looking to power one ten inch sub. The models I'm looking at are the IDQ10V3.D4, ID10D4 V3, or the JBL Powerseries P1024.

The current amp I am looking at, recommended by 2010Sin is the JBL GTO7001, which the lowest I can find is around $216.

My question is, are there amps that are just as good for less money that would work for any of those subs? I don't want to get a crappy sound just to save money, but I'm wondering if there are better deals.

I'm looking at the grand total for the sub, amp, subthump enclosures and budgeting $100 for Steve's harness (hopefully won't be that much, just a guess) and it's kinda steep for me, between 750-850 depending on the sub.

Also, for anyone who is experienced with ID subs, how much difference will I notice between the ID10 and the IDQ10? What are the advantages? Is the IDQ worth the extra $80 or would the ID10 do the job? I guess I just don't know enough about these things to know how much I need to spend to get a good sound.

Thanks a lot guys, I really appreciate all your help.
CamaroDreams07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 11:01 AM   #2
LS3SSRS

 
LS3SSRS's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 IBM SS/RS
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Posts: 808
$216 for that amp is a good deal IMO. Base your amp selection on rms power handling of the sub that u buy. That amp is rated at 700wrms@2ohms, which is plenty of power for a 400wrms subwoofer.
__________________
2SS/RS, 6spd manual, IBM w/black leather
Blacked out tail/signal lights, 5% rear tint, 20% sides, Dynomax Bullet exhaust, Barton short throw shifter, Clear Image offroad downpipes

Last edited by LS3SSRS; 05-19-2010 at 11:08 AM. Reason: Typo
LS3SSRS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 11:16 AM   #3
Moriartii

 
Moriartii's Avatar
 
Drives: 11 IOM 2SS/RS M6 w/Hurst
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 1,296
Check out Sound Solutions Audio I think you will be happy and have money left in your pocket.

I could be wrong but I would go the other direction, get an amp that is lower than the rms of the woofer. This way you dont run the risk of overdriving your woofer. Example I have a 1000rms woofer being driven by a 400-500rms amp.
Cheers
K
Moriartii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 11:56 AM   #4
LS3SSRS

 
LS3SSRS's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 IBM SS/RS
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Posts: 808
Yea, ideally u want the amp to match the rms rating of your woofer. I just see having a more powerful amp being benefical in case u wanted to upgrade the sub down the road.
__________________
2SS/RS, 6spd manual, IBM w/black leather
Blacked out tail/signal lights, 5% rear tint, 20% sides, Dynomax Bullet exhaust, Barton short throw shifter, Clear Image offroad downpipes
LS3SSRS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 12:02 PM   #5
Racer-X
Rhymin and Stealin
 
Racer-X's Avatar
 
Drives: The Search is on ABM V6.....
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 680
Send a message via MSN to Racer-X
Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroDreams07 View Post
I'm looking to power one ten inch sub. The models I'm looking at are the IDQ10V3.D4, ID10D4 V3, or the JBL Powerseries P1024.

The current amp I am looking at, recommended by 2010Sin is the JBL GTO7001, which the lowest I can find is around $216.

My question is, are there amps that are just as good for less money that would work for any of those subs? I don't want to get a crappy sound just to save money, but I'm wondering if there are better deals.

I'm looking at the grand total for the sub, amp, subthump enclosures and budgeting $100 for Steve's harness (hopefully won't be that much, just a guess) and it's kinda steep for me, between 750-850 depending on the sub.

Also, for anyone who is experienced with ID subs, how much difference will I notice between the ID10 and the IDQ10? What are the advantages? Is the IDQ worth the extra $80 or would the ID10 do the job? I guess I just don't know enough about these things to know how much I need to spend to get a good sound.

Thanks a lot guys, I really appreciate all your help.
if you buyh a pre built enclosure you will have to use the ID10 not the IDQ... the IDQ is actually an 11" sub. will not fit standard configation prefabs. the IDQ's performance is probably twice that fo the ID10. very transient and acurate. does not have a stamped metal basket to resonate. is "field serviceable" meaning if for any reason the cone/voice coil assembly should go bad it can be replaced with out have to send the sub in. the ID series are good subs, the IDQ is worht every bit of the 80 bucks and more. but again will not fit a traditiolal prefab mounting diameter.

I think for what it sounds like you are trying to accomplish the ID10 will work quite well for you.


Side note... more power from the amp means you will use less of the gain to level match in turn will give you more "headroom" which will equate to better sound quality. (amps does not have to work as hard.)
__________________
Bryan

I Make Cars Sound Good.

Enchantment Editions
Arc Audio Competition Team
Image Dynamics Elite Sound Performance Team
Team Stinger
Racer-X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 12:13 PM   #6
Moriartii

 
Moriartii's Avatar
 
Drives: 11 IOM 2SS/RS M6 w/Hurst
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 1,296
So is it a big deal to go the route I did? A 400-500 rms amp pushing a 1000 rms woofer?

Cheers
K
Moriartii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 12:31 PM   #7
Steve@Subthump
 
Steve@Subthump's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 2SS IOM Vert
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Indiana
Posts: 1,100
Quote:
Originally Posted by CamaroDreams07 View Post
and budgeting $100 for Steve's harness
Geez, no the harness won't be anything near that high.
Steve@Subthump is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 12:37 PM   #8
Steve@Subthump
 
Steve@Subthump's Avatar
 
Drives: 2011 2SS IOM Vert
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Indiana
Posts: 1,100
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAS View Post
if you buyh a pre built enclosure you will have to use the ID10 not the IDQ... the IDQ is actually an 11" sub. will not fit standard configation prefabs.
We can fit an 11" sub in our large driver's side stealth. Give us the hole dimension and we'll do it. I've never considered any of our boxes pre-fab because they can be tweaked and customized upon request. A JL stealthbox is a pre-fab. Each one is identical to the next and they won't modify the design on an individual basis like we can.
Steve@Subthump is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 12:43 PM   #9
Racer-X
Rhymin and Stealin
 
Racer-X's Avatar
 
Drives: The Search is on ABM V6.....
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 680
Send a message via MSN to Racer-X
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve@Subthump View Post
We can fit an 11" sub in our large driver's side stealth. Give us the hole dimension and we'll do it. I've never considered any of our boxes pre-fab because they can be tweaked and customized upon request. A JL stealthbox is a pre-fab. Each one is identical to the next and they won't modify the design on an individual basis like we can.

Steve that is excellent to know. Thanks. I will get you some spec for the IDQ10.v3 to have for future reference.
__________________
Bryan

I Make Cars Sound Good.

Enchantment Editions
Arc Audio Competition Team
Image Dynamics Elite Sound Performance Team
Team Stinger
Racer-X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 02:25 PM   #10
The 2010 Sin
CorkTulsa.com
 
The 2010 Sin's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 2SS BLK, 2013 2SS CRT
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Tulsa, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,847
Cant wait to see what you decide to do! :-)
__________________
The 2010 Sin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 04:53 PM   #11
CamaroDreams07


 
CamaroDreams07's Avatar
 
Drives: Slow V6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Lansing, MI
Posts: 9,287
Sounds like I really owe it to myself to spend the money. Which means waiting a little longer :(. Steve, is there an additional charge to get it made to fit the bigger sub? Oh and good to know on the price, I'd just rather budget too much than not enough, you know?
CamaroDreams07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 04:56 PM   #12
shevyman

 
Drives: 2010 Camaro SS IOM
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: california
Posts: 1,741
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moriartii View Post
Check out Sound Solutions Audio I think you will be happy and have money left in your pocket.

I could be wrong but I would go the other direction, get an amp that is lower than the rms of the woofer. This way you dont run the risk of overdriving your woofer. Example I have a 1000rms woofer being driven by a 400-500rms amp.
Cheers
K
running a low amp to your subs is actually bad for them. you would actually want an amp with more power.
shevyman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 04:56 PM   #13
CamaroDreams07


 
CamaroDreams07's Avatar
 
Drives: Slow V6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Lansing, MI
Posts: 9,287
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moriartii View Post
Check out Sound Solutions Audio I think you will be happy and have money left in your pocket.

I could be wrong but I would go the other direction, get an amp that is lower than the rms of the woofer. This way you dont run the risk of overdriving your woofer. Example I have a 1000rms woofer being driven by a 400-500rms amp.
Cheers
K
Every amp on their site is more than the one I'm looking at- they start at $240...
CamaroDreams07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 05:01 PM   #14
shevyman

 
Drives: 2010 Camaro SS IOM
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: california
Posts: 1,741
in some ways i think the systems other people mention ask for to much.

i have learned to work with arc,focal, and hertz. all work great in large or small enclosures. also give great sound. never have been so impressed with a single sub that is being pushed with 300watts. sounds better then my fosgate with the 800watts i was running it with. also you want a great amp i would go audison. MAN can you tell the difference in clarity.
shevyman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 06:08 PM   #15
Moriartii

 
Moriartii's Avatar
 
Drives: 11 IOM 2SS/RS M6 w/Hurst
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 1,296
Why would a lower amp pushing a higher woofer be bad?
K
Moriartii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 09:54 PM   #16
mrray13


 
mrray13's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1LT RS Rally Yellow
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: southern Illinois
Posts: 3,059
Quote:
Originally Posted by shevyman View Post
running a low amp to your subs is actually bad for them. you would actually want an amp with more power.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moriartii View Post
Why would a lower amp pushing a higher woofer be bad?
K

It's not. Underpowering a speaker isn't going to do anything, save introduce distortion if you crank the gains to try and achieve output.

In the case of the setup you bought Moriartii, the ICON doesn't need rms power to be impressive. You'll love it with almost 500rms on tap.
__________________
PacMan
mrray13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 11:07 PM   #17
Luvpilot
 
Luvpilot's Avatar
 
Drives: GM
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 352
I picked up an Alpine MRP-M500 for my single 10" sub install.
About $145 and I've been really happy with it.

YMMV
Luvpilot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2010, 11:11 PM   #18
Moriartii

 
Moriartii's Avatar
 
Drives: 11 IOM 2SS/RS M6 w/Hurst
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 1,296
Thanks Mrray, I hit SSA up and seems I am just fine. So again your recommendation was spot on.
Cheers
K
Moriartii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2010, 01:17 AM   #19
CamaroDreams07


 
CamaroDreams07's Avatar
 
Drives: Slow V6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Lansing, MI
Posts: 9,287
One other question here. I have the rubber cargo mat installed in my trunk, will the Subthump enclosures fit over that? I think it's about a half inch thick if I remember correctly.
CamaroDreams07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2010, 08:46 AM   #20
Moriartii

 
Moriartii's Avatar
 
Drives: 11 IOM 2SS/RS M6 w/Hurst
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Austin Texas
Posts: 1,296
Which enclosure are you talking about?
If it is the one that goes acrorss the back in the pass through area (which is what I have) yes and no. Yes it fits but it is a dayam tight squeeze as it gets hung up on the little tree points that hang down for the trim pieces in the package deck. Also the 1/2 ridge on the outside of the matt causes it to sit up funny, it needs a brace to run between the inside of the matt and the box. Finally it is a complete pain to roll the matt back and get to the battery compartment. I plan on precisely cutting my matt to fit in front of the box.

Cheers
K
Moriartii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2010, 10:13 AM   #21
2010SLVRBULIT


 
2010SLVRBULIT's Avatar
 
Drives: G5 & C6
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: MARS
Posts: 7,117
better amps(w/ higher signal/noise ratio), even w/ lower power rating will out-shine amps that are rated higher power, but w/ lower s/n, along w/ cheaper, inferior guts..you can't always look at just power rating, look @ s/n ratios...

..look into class 'D'(digital) amps that tend to draw less current and won't tax your car electrical system. Since you're using it for subs, clarity isn't an issue w/ these amps.

VV tell me if you can tell the difference between a digital and a class A/B amp that has been set w/ a slope of 80hz on down. Clarity w/ the subs, definitely, but not so w/ amps..discerning listeners might pick it, but most consumers out there want maximum boom for a buck.

s/n applies to amps, sensitivity rating for subs..higher the sensitity for the sub, the fewer amplifier power needed to drive it. Enclosure type(ported/sealed) plays a signifcant role as well.

Last edited by 2010SLVRBULIT; 05-22-2010 at 01:56 PM.
2010SLVRBULIT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2010, 11:34 AM   #22
Racer-X
Rhymin and Stealin
 
Racer-X's Avatar
 
Drives: The Search is on ABM V6.....
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 680
Send a message via MSN to Racer-X
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010SLVRBULIT View Post
better amps(w/ higher signal/noise ratio), even w/ lower power rating will out-shine amps that are rated higher power, but w/ lower s/n, along w/ cheaper, inferior guts..you can't always look at just power rating, look @ s/n ratios...

..look into class 'D'(digital) amps that tend to draw less current and won't tax your car electrical system. Since you're using it for subs, clarity isn't an issue w/ these amps.
how do you figure clarity is a non issue for subs? I do not want my subs bass to be muddy or unclear when I am listening to my music. Digital amps are more efficient true.... (more power... less current draw) but this does not mean they are the right choice. some digital amps have a very stale or flat sound to them... no life to the music they reproduce. there are class H amps like the mini's from Arc that will do the job nicely with better sound quality. and small fott print class A/B amps from various companies that will sound even better and still not have a huge draw on your system. they dynamics and and "impact" a non digital amps will provide to your subs is very noticable.
__________________
Bryan

I Make Cars Sound Good.

Enchantment Editions
Arc Audio Competition Team
Image Dynamics Elite Sound Performance Team
Team Stinger
Racer-X is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2010, 11:39 AM   #23
mrray13


 
mrray13's Avatar
 
Drives: 2010 1LT RS Rally Yellow
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: southern Illinois
Posts: 3,059
Quote:
Originally Posted by IAS View Post
how do you figure clarity is a non issue for subs? I do not want my subs bass to be muddy or unclear when I am listening to my music. Digital amps are more efficient true.... (more power... less current draw) but this does not mean they are the right choice. some digital amps have a very stale or flat sound to them... no life to the music they reproduce. there are class H amps like the mini's from Arc that will do the job nicely with better sound quality. and small fott print class A/B amps from various companies that will sound even better and still not have a huge draw on your system. they dynamics and and "impact" a non digital amps will provide to your subs is very noticable.


In a daily driving situation, with 99% of ears out there, a s/n ratio around 1% for subs is more then acceptable. Your ears are tuned and will pick out things in music others, like myself, won't. I can hear extreme distortion, but in subs, it's harder to hear then in the high end of things.

I'll also agree that class D is really only more efficient at lower volumes, when you crank things, the D class loses some of it's advantages to the cleaner A/B amps. I've not played with T or H class, so I have no real opinion on those, lol.
__________________
PacMan
mrray13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2010, 03:05 PM   #24
CamaroDreams07


 
CamaroDreams07's Avatar
 
Drives: Slow V6
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Lansing, MI
Posts: 9,287
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moriartii View Post
Which enclosure are you talking about?
If it is the one that goes acrorss the back in the pass through area (which is what I have) yes and no. Yes it fits but it is a dayam tight squeeze as it gets hung up on the little tree points that hang down for the trim pieces in the package deck. Also the 1/2 ridge on the outside of the matt causes it to sit up funny, it needs a brace to run between the inside of the matt and the box. Finally it is a complete pain to roll the matt back and get to the battery compartment. I plan on precisely cutting my matt to fit in front of the box.

Cheers
K
Sorry forgot there was more than one. I'm talking about the passenger side amp rack and the drivers side large sub enclosure.
CamaroDreams07 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2010, 10:07 AM   #25
shevyman

 
Drives: 2010 Camaro SS IOM
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: california
Posts: 1,741
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moriartii View Post
Why would a lower amp pushing a higher woofer be bad?
K
i have also called around talk to techs asking same qustion on how to choose an amp.

i told the tech one day the amp i had and the sub and he mentioned under powering a sub is not good for it. now i am sorry i can not answer this the proper way cause since then i have stuck with maps with more power then my subs. and cause i forgot his reason. but i was told by a few people also.

well here for example. you have a 1000watt amp pushing a 800 watt sub and you have it hooked up to 12guage wire i am talking speaker wire and earth and ground wire. if you can not send the power to the amp you will over heat it cause its trying to hard to pull in the power which will also cause bad sound. so i take it its the same with the sub, it is asking for more power but the amp wont give it so it will struggle and sound like crap and wear out the sub. also could hurt the amp

also another guy posted about the signal to noise ratio. also is another thing i forgot and yes does make a big deal.
shevyman is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Amp install- how to (w/pics) ASTEDA Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Navigation, Radar, Electronics Forum 55 07-14-2014 03:27 AM
Amp install - how to (w/pics) ASTEDA Camaro DIY & HOW-TO instructions & discussions 28 01-27-2013 04:07 PM
Stereo GUIDE ALL READ WildBeast15 Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Navigation, Radar, Electronics Forum 29 09-11-2010 02:14 AM
Adding an Amp to the BA system... ZZcamaro Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Navigation, Radar, Electronics Forum 1 07-09-2009 12:52 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.