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Forced Induction - V6 V6 Supercharger, turbo, nitrous discussions

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Old 06-22-2010, 08:10 AM   #1
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We may just have an FI option....

Well since we are looking for FI for our cars I think I may have found something that works. CAPA makes a turbocharger for the Holden VE alloytec 3.6L which is the same engine as our LLT. This is the first kit of any kind for the VE engine in Austraila. The set up looks the same from the pictures of our engine bay to theirs. I think the only problem would be the frame design, I'm not to smart about how much that would take to do. I asked my neighbor who built engines and drag cars (before joining the military); he thinks it is a very workable solution. As far as tuning goes I talked to Vince@Trifecta and he said that I could put it on and then datalog. These logs would provide the nessecary info for the car to be tweaked to run optimally. For the price which is AU I think it is a fair price. Current rate is 1 US dollar = 1.1431 Australian dollars. This is the link: http://www.capa.com.au/kits_holden_ve_v6.htm

Non-Intercooled 4-6psi kit is $4369.62 US
Intercooled 4-9psi kit is $5769.30 US

Opinions?
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:45 AM   #2
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Doc,
Its my understanding that the alloytech is NOT the same as our engine. The SIDI motor is, and you will see that they have the same issue with tuning, with Vince being the only guy they know of that has anything available.
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:52 AM   #3
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Tiny the alloytec is known as many different engine sizes and codes. Like our LY7 is the same as their VZ engine. Our engine LLT is the same as the alloytec VE. If you notice on their website is says tuning isn't available due to the fact they haven't been able to tune the LLT/VE engine. Vince@Trifecta told me last week that someone from AU actually has called to try to the tuning from him. So the question is if I bought this put it on my car and had Vince tune it should work then correct?

LLT
The 3.6 litre (3564 cc) LLT is a direct injected version based on the earlier LY7 engine. It was first unveiled in May 2006, and the DI version was claimed to have 15 percent greater power, 8 percent greater torque, and 3 percent better fuel economy than its port-injected counterpart. The LLT engine has a compression ratio of 11.4:1, and has been certified by the SAE to produce 302 horsepower (225 kW) at 6300 rpm and 272 lb·ft (369 N·m) of torque at 5200 rpm on regular unleaded (87 octane) gasoline. This engine debuted on the 2008 Cadillac STS and CTS.[4][5] GM will use a LLT in all 2009 Lambda-derived crossover SUVs to allow class-leading fuel economy in light of the new Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) standards. In the Lambdas, LLT engine produces 288 horsepower (215 kW) and 270 lb·ft (366 N·m) of torque.[6][7][8]

Applications:

Year(s) Model Power Torque
2008–present Cadillac CTS 304 hp (227 kW) @ 6400 rpm 273 lb·ft (370 N·m) @ 5200 rpm
2008–present Cadillac STS 302 hp (225 kW) @ 6300 rpm 272 lb·ft (369 N·m) @ 5200 rpm
2009–present Buick Enclave 288 hp (215 kW) @ 6300 rpm 270 lb·ft (366 N·m) @ 3400 rpm
2009–present Chevrolet Traverse single exhaust 281 hp (210 kW) @ 6300 rpm 266 lb·ft (361 N·m) @ 3400 rpm
2009–present Chevrolet Traverse dual exhaust 288 hp (215 kW) @ 6300 rpm 270 lb·ft (366 N·m) @ 3400 rpm
2009–present GMC Acadia 288 hp (215 kW) 270 lb·ft (366 N·m)
2009 Saturn Outlook single exhaust 281 hp (210 kW) @ 6300 rpm 266 lb·ft (361 N·m) @ 3400 rpm
2009 Saturn Outlook dual exhaust 288 hp (215 kW) @ 6300 rpm 270 lb·ft (366 N·m) @ 3400 rpm
2009–present Daewoo Veritas
2009–present Holden VE Commodore SV6 281 hp (210 kW) @ 6400 rpm 258 lb·ft (350 N·m) @ 2900 rpm
2009–present Holden WM Statesman 281 hp (210 kW) @ 6400 rpm 258 lb·ft (350 N·m) @ 2900 rpm
2009–present Holden WM Caprice 281 hp (210 kW) @ 6400 rpm 258 lb·ft (350 N·m) @ 2900 rpm
2010 Buick LaCrosse CXS 280 hp (210 kW) @ 6300 rpm 259 lb·ft (351 N·m) @ 4800 rpm
2010 Chevrolet Camaro 304 hp (227 kW) @ 6500 rpm 273 lb·ft (370 N·m) @ 5100 rpm
2011 Chevrolet Camaro 312 hp (233 kW) @ 6500 rpm 278 lb·ft (377 N·m) @ 5100 rpm
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:56 AM   #4
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that info is all well and good...but read the note in your link....
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:59 AM   #5
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What note? If it is about the tuning then so what we have the capabilities from Trifecta.
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:00 AM   #6
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the one that says tuning not available for 08-09 vehicles. i wish it weren't true.
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:05 AM   #7
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It doesn't matter......I corrected the above first statement.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:25 AM   #8
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Well, get er done devil, and let us know! Lol

seriously though, I hope this does work. I'll keep my eyes open on this!
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:26 AM   #9
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Also, of some note, that is a supercharger, not turbo.


That appears to be something that we can work with. They are using a piggyback ECM with it, whereas we can get Vince to optimize it. The price isn't bad either. Their intake manifold is different, I wonder what else has changed? Otherwise, that looks just like our LLT.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:39 AM   #10
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You try it first... Let us know how it works out
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:50 AM   #11
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Thats an expensive 'maybe'. if you're willing to put the money out there and give it a shot, go for it. a little too much for me to invest without hard proof that it will work. good find though.
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:29 PM   #12
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I think people may be confusing what Vince is actually able to do, While he can tune it, he may not be able to access the torque limiter. While he can move shift points and delete torque management, it's the limiter that is the biggest issue
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:41 PM   #13
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interesting
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:47 PM   #14
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worth a shot and the fact that you would have the first and only supercharged v6 2010 camaro on the planet.
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Old 06-22-2010, 01:22 PM   #15
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Okay, now I'm curious. Doc, you may have already contacted them but I just sent CAPA an email asking their opinion.
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Old 06-22-2010, 01:27 PM   #16
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Another possibility??

Well while you guys are exploring options, maybe someone would want to contact Rotrex as well. This is the type of supercharger that LPE was working with.

They do development as well (see the bottom right R & D tab). Maybe if we could show them all the possible applications with this engine they would invest in working on tailoring a kit and working on the tuning issue??? Might be worth a shot. Here's their link:

http://www.rotrex.com/Home.aspx

It makes you a little sick to see that Hyundais, Toyotas, Hondas and Subarus can all be supercharged but not a V6 Camaro, it's sad actually.
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Old 06-22-2010, 04:47 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maurdib View Post
I think people may be confusing what Vince is actually able to do, While he can tune it, he may not be able to access the torque limiter. While he can move shift points and delete torque management, it's the limiter that is the biggest issue
The AAC /STS car runs. Torque limiter or not, so Vince can get it close. Not saying he's got the complete box unlocked, but he can make adjustments.

As far as limiter goes, I'm near 250lb-ft, every mod showed an improvement. bmwdon, I think will be over 250lb-ft with his set up before heads/tune. I think the guy spraying got well over 250lb-ft as well, I'll look. So in short, I don't think it's just a limiter problem we have. It's making the most out of what we got, mixed in with the limiter problem, if there is one.


That's just my opinion though, lol.


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Old 06-22-2010, 04:52 PM   #18
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Hopefully we are getting closer...

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Old 06-22-2010, 04:57 PM   #19
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worth a shot and the fact that you would have the first and only supercharged v6 2010 camaro on the planet.
Silly question - hoe did Leno do it ?
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Old 06-22-2010, 05:09 PM   #20
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Silly question - hoe did Leno do it ?
He didn't the car doesn't run
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Old 06-22-2010, 05:11 PM   #21
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Silly question - hoe did Leno do it ?
I don't think it's the same V6.
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Old 06-22-2010, 05:12 PM   #22
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I'm curious why this hasn't got much attention.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90314
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Old 06-22-2010, 05:15 PM   #23
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I'm curious why this hasn't got much attention.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90314
That is weird that none of the V6ers that want FI even posted in that thread. Maybe it just got lost. I think the traffic will pick up now.
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:40 PM   #24
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its in the sponsor classifieds. doubt many people even look in there.
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:45 PM   #25
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Quote:
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Silly question - hoe did Leno do it ?
GM built the Leno car
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maurdib View Post
He didn't the car doesn't run
Where did you hear that?
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