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View Poll Results: Should Big Oil bail out Big 3?
Yes, they made billions off of auto industry 35 53.85%
No, the cost would be passed on to the consumers 5 7.69%
Let the government bail them, the cost will go to taxpayers 9 13.85%
No, let Big 3 bail themselves out, it's their problem 16 24.62%
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-17-2008, 08:59 AM   #1
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Should Big Oil Bail Out Big 3?

I found this interesting article. Read all the way to last paragraph. The oil companies depend on the auto industry. Should they bail out the auto makers? Or would that cost just get passed back to us, the consumer?

http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2...17/244489.html
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:04 AM   #2
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What article????
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:09 AM   #3
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There, should be fixed
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:10 AM   #4
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There ya go>
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:13 AM   #5
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I am not inclined to comment, but cant wait to see what others think
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:26 AM   #6
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Should I make the poll public or private? I will go with the consensus.
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:34 AM   #7
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Personally I don't care who gives them the money as long as they get it. Regardless of if they get the loan from the government or if the oil companies bail them out, we will be paying the cost. It comes down to rather you would like to play in large amounts for increase purchase cost and cost of parts and maintenance or small amounts in increased cost of gas.
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:38 AM   #8
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I voted yes myself. The reason why is that any form of bail out, no matter where it comes from, it's like any other commodity, will have the cost passed on to the consumer. That's the way business is done. I realize gas prices were recently at all time highs. If Big Oil payed for the bail and passes the cost off to consumers, which they would, it would be the fair way. The bulk of the burden would be on the people who drive and use the gas and oil most. If government pays then the burden is on all taxpayers. Would that be fair to people in cities that never drive? I realize they may ride a taxi or bus or subway but if Big Oil bails them out those people would only be affected when they use public transportation.
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:44 AM   #9
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Then the oil companies would essentially own the auto industry...that's a dangerous thing.
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:51 AM   #10
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Then the oil companies would essentially own the auto industry...that's a dangerous thing.
Then all the conspiracy theories would come true.
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Old 11-17-2008, 09:55 AM   #11
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Great point if big oil gets ownership of our auto industry you could kiss cars like the Volt goodbye.....hybrids all that would more than likley be killed off. Unless the Govt steps in and makes them do it. Then they would drag there feet on R&D. When they did come out they would be so expensive no one could affornd them. Just so we keep buying there oil.


Hows that for a conspiracy theory Dragoneye?
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Old 11-17-2008, 10:12 AM   #12
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Big oil should bail out the Big 3. Here's the problem, though: not only is such a move unenforceable, it would be unprecedented and probably wouldn't work. Big oil will continue to make money without the Big 3. There is no urgency from the oil companies to save an automaker. Others will still sell cars, and those already driving cars will continue to pay at the pump. Moreover, the oil companies are designed to make money while national governments are designed to protect and serve citizens. The federal government of the US cannot force oil companies to change their corporate goals from making money to helping people. It would be fundamentally impossible for a democratic government to do this. Furthermore, the money-grabbing oil companies aren't completely at fault. OPEC is more at fault than the companies that sell oil. If anything, countries like Saudi Arabia should be paying the bailout.

There's that word, "should." That word implies that there is a right move. It implies that someone can do the right thing to help someone else or to do something ethically. What about big oil is ethical? It is run by a non-democratic cartel; it violates anti-trust laws in most of the Western world; it is run by greedy individuals and families; it is provably bad—therefore, wrong—for the environment; it rapes the consumer because it is a necessary commodity for societies to function. Is any of this positive?

When we say "should," it suggests a policy change in political science. What policy would you like to change? Should we make those who mess up pay for the mess? I like that idea, but those who mess up lose among the worst. Mortgage giants are in trouble. Should the millionaires who invest in these companies be forced to pay? That would be communism—a massive redistribution of wealth, a dangerous policy because those who have wealth tend to use it better than those who haven't had it before.

The truth is that the Big 3 should be saved from a policy standpoint because the Big 3 secures a lot of tax revenue; should be saved from a labor standpoint because the Big 3 employs millions of Americans both directly and indirectly; should not be saved from a capitalist standpoint because they didn't follow the market adequately; should be saved from an environmental standpoint because they are greener than many of their competitors; should be saved from a realist standpoint because they represent US prominence abroad; should be saved from a constructivist standpoint because they reflect American tradition; should not be saved from an import standpoint because they impede foreign companies' success.

Pick a side. I've said almost all of them, and the vast majority suggest that the Big 3 should get a bailout, loan, or tax reduction. Who should provide that company-saving move? Big oil won't do it. The banks won't offer loans that big. Investment in the Big 3 is terrible right now. In reality, the only place support can originate is the government. I hope it's enough.
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Old 11-17-2008, 10:34 AM   #13
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If you want to pay 6 bucks a gal or more next summer then fine.
How do you think they will sustain exploration and development budgets if they have to bail out the big 3? Especially since these budgets are already being cut back drastically.

The short term thinking in the US with regards to energy policies is really astonishing.
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Old 11-17-2008, 10:40 AM   #14
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If you want to pay 6 bucks a gal or more next summer then fine.
How do you think they will sustain exploration and development budgets if they have to bail out the big 3? Especially since these budgets are already being cut back drastically.

The short term thinking in the US with regards to energy policies is really astonishing.
That's usually how it works here. Our government has tended to be scatterbrained recently.
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Old 11-17-2008, 11:14 AM   #15
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That's usually how it works here. Our government has tended to be scatterbrained recently.
Off thread, but curious Blur. Are your studies in political science or economics? Just curious.
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Old 11-17-2008, 01:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Hows that for a conspiracy theory Dragoneye?
Sounds awfully similar to the ones of yesteryear like the oil companies supposedly buying up and killing the 100mpg carburetor...

I'm defintely against this idea both in theory and in practice.
Don't give ExxonMobile anymore influence in my life, please.
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Old 11-17-2008, 01:55 PM   #17
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Good question, because I don't think we should bail the banks out, however, I don't want to see either of the Big Three (especially GM) to go under so I can't even be biased on this one. I've read and been told we should've been in flying cars by now but I've heard (conspiracy theorists) that big oil had such in influence they didn't want all that fossil fuel to go unused and not make them money. I don't particularly give that theory much credit but it almost makes sense.

All I care about is Detroit making the cars we want and the government NOT telling me what I can drive. I'll be damned if I have to drive a Prius because that is all the government says I can own.

JMVHO.
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Old 11-17-2008, 02:33 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CWIweldace View Post
Off thread, but curious Blur. Are your studies in political science or economics? Just curious.
At KU, there's an economics component that is necessary for graduation in political science. Additionally, I've taken classes regarding the budget and agenda-setting which is a strong hybrid of political and economic theories.

On a side note, my use of "recently" may or may not exclusively reference the current administration.
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