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Old 08-03-2010, 07:43 PM   #1
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***Updated Fuse Pull info, confirmed***

Ok, I have been digging around and trying to confirm some info with dealers and GM members here on C5, as well as people I know who I trust can provide accurate info.

To make a very brief explanation of the fuse pull, for those who don't know, it's pulling the #5 and #20 fuses out of the cars fuse box and replacing them. The purpose of which is to reset the ECU to factory defaults. This can also be done at the dealer using the TechII or other similar dealer interface device with the car. I recapped my involvement recently in the Fuse Pull Aniversary thread. And there is a Fuse Pull Stickey in the technical forum that will give a ton of original info concerning the issue.

I had reported that the problem was being 'fixed' at the dealer level with a computer flash or ECU update. (So that the car would recognize the re-introduction of high Octane fuel automaticaly) Well this is not acurate information.

It's just been confirmed that there is no computer flash or update for the dealers to do. There is no 'fix', because there is nothing broken. We will need to have our cars taken to the dealer OR pull the fuses ourselves anytime we get bad gas or low Octane gas in them. IF you want the max performance out of your STOCK car.

Battery is not necessary. ONLY the fuses.

Unless they changed the entire computer on these cars during production, (No way that happened) it appears that ANY SS Camaro will need to have the ECU reset (by fuse pull, or at your dealer) after using low Octane gas. Again, if you want the max performance from your car.

I've had a lot of people swear to me lately that they have benefited from the fuse pull. It got me to asking around. I was of the understanding that it was addressed on the assembly line. Apperently it was not. What's to address? So YES even you 2011 guys will be affected should you use or inadvertantly use low grade gas.

This does NOT mean our cars are defective in any way. In fact quite the contrary. Many cars would be damaged if you used low octane fuel in them. Or have to be taken to the dealer to be fixed. Some drive like crap. Some will just shut down so engine damage won't happen. Ours will not only keep runnning, but automatically run at a safe level. We even have the option to run low grade fuel intentionaly if we want to.

We just have to have the dealer reset the defaults back to the factory levels. Not gonna go into the reasons and technical stuff here in the OP. There are too many people here who can speak more acurately than myself, but I just wanted to pass this info along so that everyone knows. I have been telling people wrong.

I just wanted to update to let everyone know.
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:48 PM   #2
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did the fuse pull on my 2011, and it did wake her up....
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:54 PM   #3
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This is so confusing. When you say "any SS" do you mean "any A6 SS"? I have read (in the official 15 thousand post thread) that M6 LS3s require a battery disconnect (for some mysterious reason) and that the fuse pull won't do a thing. Zup?

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Old 08-03-2010, 08:04 PM   #4
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This is so confusing. When you say "any SS" do you mean "any A6 SS"? I have read (in the official 15 thousand post thread) that M6 LS3s require a battery disconnect (for some mysterious reason) and that the fuse pull won't do a thing. Zup?


Yeah, inquiring minds want to know
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:08 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhood View Post
This is so confusing. When you say "any SS" do you mean "any A6 SS"? I have read (in the official 15 thousand post thread) that M6 LS3s require a battery disconnect (for some mysterious reason) and that the fuse pull won't do a thing. Zup?

After taking a look at the schematics of the electrical, I don't see a difference. I don't know where that came from. You'll have to ask Radz.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:24 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Shields View Post
I'd still love to see some hard evidence that shows fuse pulling is really a benefit. Hard evidence being a NUMBER of runs to empty and fills, dynos, and track times as well as MPG results (on a variety of fuel types). I have yet to see anyone take a period of time and really test this.
The only "hard" evidence I can give you is two 1/8 mile slips, one week apart:
the first one is before the fuse pull - car ran a best of 9.20,

and the second is from exactly one week later - after the fuse pull - car ran a best of 8.40.

I didn't need any better proof that 8/10's improvement in the 8th mile.



(Ooops...scanner is down...but as soon as I get it back up, I will post the actual slips.) Scanner is still down, but was able to copy/paste the "better" time slip scanned in as I am still #6 on the official 1/8 mile best list.

BEST Slip from October 10 reads:
Reaction: .215
60Ft: 2.235
330Ft: 6.141
1/8 mi: 9.308 (I was wrong...I got OVER 8/10's in the 1/8th mi!!! b/c I thought it had run a 9.20!!)
MPH: 78.43

Here is the slip from exactly one week later:
The ONLY difference is a few degrees cooler and the FUSE PULL
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Last edited by acatlover13; 08-04-2010 at 05:25 PM. Reason: Added a timeslip
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:45 PM   #7
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My car is a testament to the fuse pull. Went 5 months uselessly putting 93 octane in her! There are no adverse effects of the fuse pull so I don't see why anyone wouldn't at least try it.
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Old 08-03-2010, 09:11 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acatlover13 View Post
The only "hard" evidence I can give you is two 1/8 mile slips, one week apart:
the first one is before the fuse pull - car ran a best of 9.20,

and the second is from exactly one week later - after the fuse pull - car ran a best of 8.40.

I didn't need any better proof that 8/10's improvement in the 8th mile.



(Ooops...scanner is down...but as soon as I get it back up, I will post the actual slips.)
I may put together a little something as far as a single place for fuse pull evidence. I'd LOVE to see your time slips.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:09 PM   #9
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There was another trick, although I don't know if it was ever tried on a camaro - take off both cables (pos & neg) from the battery, and touch them together for 60 seconds.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:16 PM   #10
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Whoa, whoa, whoa.... Now wait a minute! You're telling me that there's some fuses that I can pull out and replace that makes my car faster?!?!







Why has nobody told me about this before?!?
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:30 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by GMtothecore View Post
Whoa, whoa, whoa.... Now wait a minute! You're telling me that there's some fuses that I can pull out and replace that makes my car faster?!?!







Why has nobody told me about this before?!?
It's been on the forum for awhile now....
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:31 PM   #12
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I can tell you that the fuse pull works! My car had 1/2 tank full when I picked it up, I drove it home and it just didn't feel like it was a 426hp engine under the hood. Weeks later, when I went back to dealer to pick up my engine cover, I asked the dealer what grade fuel they normally put in the new cars, was told they always put 87 in them, no matter it is a Corvette, etc.
Well, apparently, the SS' computer does not have the ability to recognize the premium octane and revert to a higher octane table once a low octane has been used. The fix is to do the fuse pull to start over.
I did the fuse pull, it worked! But still wasn't enough...Maggie fixed is all for me.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:34 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by mhood View Post
This is so confusing. When you say "any SS" do you mean "any A6 SS"? I have read (in the official 15 thousand post thread) that M6 LS3s require a battery disconnect (for some mysterious reason) and that the fuse pull won't do a thing. Zup?

NO that is incorrect. The fuse pull works on all of them. The battery disconnect does nothing. LS3 or L99 if you get low octane gas you need to pull the fuses for a couple hours to reset back to high octane fuel.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:53 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acatlover13 View Post
The only "hard" evidence I can give you is two 1/8 mile slips, one week apart:
the first one is before the fuse pull - car ran a best of 9.20,

and the second is from exactly one week later - after the fuse pull - car ran a best of 8.40.

I didn't need any better proof that 8/10's improvement in the 8th mile.



(Ooops...scanner is down...but as soon as I get it back up, I will post the actual slips.)
There are so many variables that come into play at the track it's impossible to narrow it down to one single thing. Honestly, your times the second trip to the track are more in line with what you should be running anyways.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:53 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMtothecore View Post
Whoa, whoa, whoa.... Now wait a minute! You're telling me that there's some fuses that I can pull out and replace that makes my car faster?!?!







Why has nobody told me about this before?!?
Right.

Quote:
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I did the fuse pull, it worked! But still wasn't enough...Maggie fixed is all for me.
..................
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:56 PM   #16
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Honestly, your times the second trip to the track are more in line with what you should be running anyways.
That's kinda the point.

And if you do 150 runs and average a number, and then do 10 runs and beat that number by .8 to 1.0 then I think you can take out the 'variables'. It's pretty easy to find whatever change was made.
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Old 08-03-2010, 11:11 PM   #17
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Thanks to all you guys that are taking so much of their time to make fellow Camaro owners aware of this problem. Due to my work I do not get to drive my car very much so I have never tried any 0-60 times but after reading about this I pulled the fuses anyway because the car was filled with 87 octane from the dealer and I believe it made a difference, but no numbers to prove it, sorry. Thanks again.
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Old 08-03-2010, 11:27 PM   #18
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Good information to know. If it doesn't hurt and you think your car is running a little less HP than it should why not try it and see yourself. I have always ran 91 octane, and seems to run really well for all stock so never really thought about it. I will try it if I accidently ever put a lower grade fuel in it.
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Old 08-03-2010, 11:28 PM   #19
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If you don't beleive it works just run your SS close to empty, put in a 1/4 tank of crap gas and run that gas out. FIll'er up with 93 if your lucky enough to have it available and see if it runs like it used to. (It won't.) Then pull the fuses for a couple of hours, replace them and see if it's back to normal.

Another option is to wait until you pay high $$ for that crap tank of gas and then decide if you want to try a fuse pull or give the dealership a chance to mess your car up.

I just hit 14000 miles yesterday and I've done two fuse pulls. It definitely makes a difference.
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Old 08-04-2010, 02:05 AM   #20
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Would the fuse pulls make a difference on a 2011 2SS LS3 M6 in So. California? We only have 91 octane as the max available here in the greater Los Angeles area.
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Old 08-04-2010, 05:36 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by CamaroScotty View Post
There was another trick, although I don't know if it was ever tried on a camaro - take off both cables (pos & neg) from the battery, and touch them together for 60 seconds.
Scotty,

I don't think that will clear the ECU. There is a battery backup unit in line to the fuse box in the engine bay. The fuse pull is after that battery.
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Old 08-04-2010, 05:42 AM   #22
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Would the fuse pulls make a difference on a 2011 2SS LS3 M6 in So. California? We only have 91 octane as the max available here in the greater Los Angeles area.
Guys here is the thing to remember. Most dealers PDQ the car, they come with little gas so they will go down and put 3 or 4 bucks of 87 in. Guess what they just did to test the car, put you in the low octane table. The car will not come back up on its own.

So when that sales man takes you down and you put 91 or 93 for your free tank of gas it does no good since the car does not relearn.

Also you have to remember that sitting gas will lose its octane levels over time. So allways try to go to name brand stations that are busy most of the time. That means the chance of getting stale high octane is rare.
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Old 08-04-2010, 05:43 AM   #23
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Not to confuse anyone. This is the service bulletin from GM for people who need hard proof of the #5 and #20 fuse pull.



#PIP4728: Higher Than Expected 0-60 MPH (97 KPH) Acceleration Time - (Nov 4, 2009)
Subject:
Higher Than Expected 0-60 MPH (97 KPH) Acceleration Time


Models:
2010 Chevrolet Camaro


with V8 Active Fuel Management Engine (RPO L99)


and 6 Speed Automatic Transmission (RPO MYC)



The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom(s) described in this PI.

Condition/Concern:

Some customers may complain of higher than expected 0-60 MPH (97 KPH) acceleration times when hot ambient temperatures are present. In some cases, they may report 0-60 times around 7 seconds.
This may be the result of the vehicle being filled with regular grade unleaded gasoline at one time. If the vehicle has been filled with regular unleaded gasoline, the ECM may be compensating for the lower octane by retarding the ignition timing during certain driving conditions.

Recommendation/Instructions:



If SI diagnosis does not isolate the cause of this concern, perform the suggestions below if the customer wants the best performance from their Camaro:
  1. In an area where it is legal to do so, take a snapshot of a 0-60 WOT acceleration event and compare the vehicle speed parameter to the snapshot timer to determine the 0-60 MPH time.
  2. Determine what gasoline octane the customer has been filling the vehicle with.

2a. If they have never used anything but premium unleaded with a posted octane of 93 or higher, go to step 3.

2b. If they occasionally use regular or mid-grade gasoline, the gasoline must be removed from the tank and it must be refilled with premium fuel of 93 octane or greater. This can be done by advising the customer to switch to premium fuel of 93 octane or greater and returning after a few tanks of premium fuel have been consumed. Or, if immediate results are necessary, drain the fuel tank, refill it with premium fuel of 93 octane or greater, and drive the vehicle at least 15 miles to purge the old fuel out of the fuel rail and lines.
  1. Reprogram the ECM with the latest TIS2Web calibrations to reset the ECM adapts. Normally this reset can also be accomplished by pulling the 2 main ECM fuses (F13R and F20U) shown in the ECM Power, Ground, MIL, and Serial Data Schematic (SI Document # 2209065).
  2. In an area where it is legal to do so, take another snapshot of a 0-60 WOT acceleration event and compare it to the original snapshot to determine if the 0-60 MPH time has increased. If an increase is noted, advise the customer that they should only use premium unleaded gasoline with a posted octane rating of 93 or higher to continue getting the best performance from their Camaro. This is outlined on page 8-45 of the owner's manual. GM Connect Message G_0000037144 was also sent out on 9/2/2009 about filling stock units with premium gasoline.
Please follow this diagnostic or repair process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed.
GM bulletins are intended for use by professional technicians, NOT a "do-it-yourselfer". They are written to inform these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or to provide information that could assist in the proper service of a vehicle. Properly trained technicians have the equipment, tools, safety instructions, and know-how to do a job properly and safely. If a condition is described, DO NOT assume that the bulletin applies to your vehicle, or that your vehicle will have that condition. See your GM dealer for information on whether your vehicle may benefit from the information.


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Old 08-04-2010, 05:49 AM   #24
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If you don't beleive it works just run your SS close to empty, put in a 1/4 tank of crap gas and run that gas out. FIll'er up with 93 if your lucky enough to have it available and see if it runs like it used to. (It won't.) Then pull the fuses for a couple of hours, replace them and see if it's back to normal.

Another option is to wait until you pay high $$ for that crap tank of gas and then decide if you want to try a fuse pull or give the dealership a chance to mess your car up.

I just hit 14000 miles yesterday and I've done two fuse pulls. It definitely makes a difference.
Why did you have to do two fuse pulls? One was not enough? What happened that required you to do a second pull if it worked the first time?
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Old 08-04-2010, 06:30 AM   #25
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Will doing a fuse pull affect the tune I have already installed? And if you have a tune is the fuse pull still necassary.
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