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Old 08-08-2010, 08:25 PM   #1
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Drastically lowering IAT....

Working on the first production of the super chiller for the Gen5 maggie/KB style super charger application. This uses the cars A/C compressor to cool the water-air intercooler fluid. So far seeing 20 degrees and lower (depending on the outside air temp, hotter the better it cools) temps when engaged. Has no effect on the power available when running on the track as at WOT the compressor disengages. No condensation drip when in the intercooler mode so safe for the track.

Machined the adaptor blocks for the Gen5 this weekend, and will post picks of each step. This is on the Disturbed Customs 2010SS shop car and will be available for release in the next 30 days if all goes well.

Will post up pics soon.
Update! We need another donor!!! Will do the install for free & less than 1/2 price on the system!!!!!

Last edited by SC2150; 09-09-2010 at 07:42 AM.
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Old 08-08-2010, 08:56 PM   #2
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Old 08-09-2010, 12:52 AM   #3
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This shows a lot of promise.

Would you mind posting up more details if u can??
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Old 08-09-2010, 08:48 AM   #4
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Interested!!
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Old 08-09-2010, 01:55 PM   #5
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Wow, this could be really big; especially in the summer.

High IAT's mean less timing which means less power. So, cooling things off would be a great idea.

I was also wondering if wrapping the Kenne Bell intake tube with some type of insolation might help reduce IAT's.
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Old 08-09-2010, 02:44 PM   #6
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VERY INTERESTING!!! Wasn't Ford trying to do this too, some time ago?... Anyways, I think a LOT of people are going to be watching your progess. Does this effect the operation of the A/C inside the car at all?
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Old 08-09-2010, 03:51 PM   #7
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VERY INTERESTING!!! Wasn't Ford trying to do this too, some time ago?... Anyways, I think a LOT of people are going to be watching your progess. Does this effect the operation of the A/C inside the car at all?
I agree. I think a lot of people will look into this mod.

Also, you ask a good question. I'm interested to hear how it works and some further details.
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Old 08-09-2010, 04:11 PM   #8
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I agree. I think a lot of people will look into this mod.

Also, you ask a good question. I'm interested to hear how it works and some further details.
I swear I read about something like this when they were first talking about a new generation Lightning or something...

I don't think I'd mind if I had to sacrifice some A/C performance for better engine performance, but not knowing much about A/C, I imagine if there is a bigger draw from cooling the charge, that a larger condensor would require more refrigerant and that would make up for the draw All I know, is this sounds pretty cool
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Old 08-09-2010, 05:08 PM   #9
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wonder if jeff at tpe is looking at this post as he does a lot of kb units in vegas. some serious heat out there...here in florida where not to cool either 100 plus degrees with humidity 4 months of the year...oh, your in bradenton , i guess we both know how brutal heat can be..
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Old 08-09-2010, 06:37 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by radz28 View Post
I swear I read about something like this when they were first talking about a new generation Lightning or something...

I don't think I'd mind if I had to sacrifice some A/C performance for better engine performance, but not knowing much about A/C, I imagine if there is a bigger draw from cooling the charge, that a larger condensor would require more refrigerant and that would make up for the draw All I know, is this sounds pretty cool
Yes it does.
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Old 08-09-2010, 08:01 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radz28 View Post
VERY INTERESTING!!! Wasn't Ford trying to do this too, some time ago?... Anyways, I think a LOT of people are going to be watching your progess. Does this effect the operation of the A/C inside the car at all?
Does NOT effect the inside A/C, but with the inside AC engaged there will be condesation dripping so it would not be what you want at the dragstrip.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikepage0007 View Post
wonder if jeff at tpe is looking at this post as he does a lot of kb units in vegas. some serious heat out there...here in florida where not to cool either 100 plus degrees with humidity 4 months of the year...oh, your in bradenton , i guess we both know how brutal heat can be..
Jeff will NEVER get another product I develop ever again. Caused me a fortune in broken promises and drug me through the mud. Stillen is watching & so is Dustin Whipple.

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Yes it does.
The Fords did a similar setup, but didn't seem to go anywhere. I may be wrong, but I do R&D for the Ford crowd as well and most have heard of Fords setup, but nobody I know has seen one.

Here are some pics & explanation:


The underhood:



(shows some of the billet pulleys).



The main adaptor block that goes between the main manifold near the firewall on the drivers side.



Very simple, single bolt. Kit comes with longer stud and everything needed. All are 6061 T6 billet Alum:


A 3/8" alum line goes from the adaptor block to th mounts near the cooler that mounts near the intercooler behind the front fascia.

The control valves, the larger one diverts the intercooler coolant through the new heat exchanger (made of stainless) when you engage the chiller mode.


The smaller unit allows you to use both the inside air & the chiller, or divert all cooling to the chiller.


Now below 60 degrees outside air temp the unit will lower the temp still, but at 90-100 degree outside temps the unit shines! Cooler air charge allows you to run more timing, less chance of detonation, and more mower due to the denser oxygen rich air charge.

A meth injection kit will also acomplish this, but you never need to keep adding methanol so after the purchase and install, no reacurring costs.

Options include digital temp display(shos both outside abient temp & the cooler temp) for the cabin, LED indicators, etc.

Every few days I willl try to give more updates & pics. Right now, DC is the only authorized installer and Master Distributor, and they will offer training for resellers/dealers.

Models for the GTO are complete, the 2010/11 camaro is what you see, and the C5/6 corvette & CTSV to follow.

Last edited by SC2150; 09-05-2010 at 04:34 PM.
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Old 08-09-2010, 08:20 PM   #12
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SWEET!
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Old 08-09-2010, 11:14 PM   #13
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So, this basically reroutes the coolant in the superchargers system through the AC pump to drastically cool it? Will this give below ambient temps?
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Old 08-10-2010, 05:21 AM   #14
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So, this basically reroutes the coolant in the superchargers system through the AC pump to drastically cool it? Will this give below ambient temps?
Not quite, the AC pump is a sealed system using freon to remove heat from the air. This makes use of the AC system like a van or SUV with rear air, but instead of a second evap in the rear to cool, we tap into the system and run the freon through a dual chamber cooler that allows liqued to be cooled. The liquid in this application is the intercooler coolant.

It can be cooled to near 40 degrees F in ideal conditions. So say the outside ambient temp is 90, the intercooler coolant could be cooled to say 70, 60 or so.
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Old 08-10-2010, 08:10 AM   #15
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Here is a picture of the heat exchanger/cooler that mounts behind the bumper cover:



This is where the heat is removed from the intercooler fluid.

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Old 08-10-2010, 11:42 AM   #16
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So this isn't an auxiliary cooler, it completely replaces the current system's intercooler?
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:49 PM   #17
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So this isn't an auxiliary cooler, it completely replaces the current system's intercooler?
No. It integrates with it and cools the intercooler coolant. On the average intercooler you have the intercooler in the grill, and the coolant in that system circulates to the heat exchanger under the supercharger. This takes that coolant and chills it down drastically from what the ambient air can.

There is no such thing as a stupid question if you don't know the answer. So ask anything you need to understand it all.
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Old 08-10-2010, 02:01 PM   #18
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Neat idea, so you will be able to turn the "super chiller" part on or off right?

Danny
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Old 08-10-2010, 03:17 PM   #19
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Okay - let me see if I can understand this:

You are interrupting the flow of the SC intercooler coolant by running it through this chiller. You are tapping into the A/C line to run refrigerent through the chiller to cool the coolant. So, the individual will use the chiller in addition to the SC intercooler's heat exchanger? A person can also control the chiller circuit independently of the passgenger compartment climate control and either split the refrigerent between the two or solely run all the refrigerent through the chiller? I see three ports of what looks to be about the same size on the chiller and one smaller one. Is the smaller one for the refrigerent line and the two others for the coolant? I don't quite understand what the forth port is for... Also - is there a return line for the refrigerent, too?
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Old 08-10-2010, 05:42 PM   #20
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Okay - let me see if I can understand this:

You are interrupting the flow of the SC intercooler coolant by running it through this chiller. You are tapping into the A/C line to run refrigerent through the chiller to cool the coolant. So, the individual will use the chiller in addition to the SC intercooler's heat exchanger? A person can also control the chiller circuit independently of the passgenger compartment climate control and either split the refrigerent between the two or solely run all the refrigerent through the chiller? I see three ports of what looks to be about the same size on the chiller and one smaller one. Is the smaller one for the refrigerent line and the two others for the coolant? I don't quite understand what the forth port is for... Also - is there a return line for the refrigerent, too?
Wow, great questions.
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Old 08-10-2010, 06:39 PM   #21
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Neat idea, so you will be able to turn the "super chiller" part on or off right?

Danny
Correct. The switches are 2 small micro toggels, like an electric guitar has.

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Okay - let me see if I can understand this:

You are interrupting the flow of the SC intercooler coolant by running it through this chiller. You are tapping into the A/C line to run refrigerent through the chiller to cool the coolant. So, the individual will use the chiller in addition to the SC intercooler's heat exchanger? A person can also control the chiller circuit independently of the passgenger compartment climate control and either split the refrigerent between the two or solely run all the refrigerent through the chiller? I see three ports of what looks to be about the same size on the chiller and one smaller one. Is the smaller one for the refrigerent line and the two others for the coolant? I don't quite understand what the forth port is for... Also - is there a return line for the refrigerent, too?
You got it! Excellent understanding. Yes there is a return line, and an additional orfice tube. Just as a rear AC would be in a van or a SUV, but the chiller has two seperate chambers where the freon & the coolant pass each other providing maximum heat transfer.



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Wow, great questions.
Absolutely. These are the question I want to see in this discussion.

There has been a ton of R&D put into this and the working units are doing great after app 6 months in use on a few test LS powered cars.
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Old 08-10-2010, 07:18 PM   #22
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How long will the cooler temperatures last at WOT after the compressor disengages?
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Old 08-10-2010, 09:13 PM   #23
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I would assume that when you turn it off it wouldn't last very long, just like your a/c does. I bet your wondering if it will last long enough for a run without the drag of the a/c compressor, right?

Danny
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Old 08-10-2010, 09:21 PM   #24
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How long will the cooler temperatures last at WOT after the compressor disengages?
Probably for only a minute or two, but at the dragstrip you will only need it at WOT for 11-12 seconds or less, and for a roll-on race say 30 seconds? After that you have the same cooling as it would w/out the unit.
As for a road-racer, the question would be "will the drag on the engine from the AC compressor wired to be engaged at WOT as well outweigh the benifits of the cooler air charge temps?" Thats an unknown at this time, but the GTO running this for the past 6 months or so is street & dragstrip driven with excellent results.


Good question though!
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:21 PM   #25
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This looks VERY nice.....
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