Camaro Still winning - Mustang sales not enough to sustain Flat Rock plant
 

http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dl...306169874/1492

DETROIT (Bloomberg) -- Ford Motor Co.'s Mustang is falling farther behind the Chevrolet Camaro as the top-selling U.S. sports car, jeopardizing a Michigan factory as designers work to win back the hearts of pony car fans.

Ford narrowly lost the crown in 2010 after a 24-year run, and the gap widened this year, with General Motors Co.'s revived Camaro outselling Mustang by 33 percent through May.

The 1,700- person plant in Flat Rock, Mich., has just one shift of workers, and its Japanese partner decided last week to pull out.

"The Mustang on its current sales pace isn't enough to sustain Flat Rock," said Jeff Schuster, an automotive analyst with researcher J.D. Power & Associates. "The Camaro has a more modern feel and seems to draw more attention from a younger age group."

The second-largest U.S. automaker is working to increase production of V-6 engines while its designers prepare for a new version in 2014 to restore its cachet. GM started selling a convertible version of the Camaro this year and says the Mustang is one of the top trade-ins for the Chevy sports car.

"They have a huge, loyal base with the Mustang," John Fitzpatrick, the Camaro's marketing manager, said in an interview. "We are starting to chip away at that."

Adding to Mustang's misery, Mazda Motor Corp. said last week that it plans to pull its Mazda6 model out of the Michigan assembly plant where Ford also makes the sports car. Ford, which owns half of the factory, said it is working with Mazda and the UAW to explore options for the "critical" site.

Manufacturing 'options'

Not sharing the assembly line with Mazda will allow Ford to build more Mustang variations, said Steve Ling, the car's marketing manager.

"The flexibility that that provides is a good thing," Ling said in a June 14 interview, declining to give specifics on how Mustang production might change after Mazda leaves. "It's good to have options and that's what that scenario provides."

Even if Mustang manages to overtake Camaro, Ford will never sell enough of its muscle car to fill up Flat Rock, Schuster said. The factory has the capacity to build 240,000 vehicles a year, Mazda has said. Last year, Ford sold 73,716 Mustangs.

"Even with a boost from a redesign, because of what Camaro has achieved, you're still looking at sales volume for the Mustang below 100,000 a year," Schuster said. "The bottom line is something at Flat Rock will have to change."

Ford is to introduce a redesigned Mustang in 2014, said Brian Johnson, an analyst with Barclays Capital in Chicago.

Popular V-6

This year, Mustang sales have suffered because of a short supply of a new V-6 engine that gets 31 miles per gallon on the highway while generating 305 horsepower, Ling said. The Mustang shares that engine with the F-150 pickup, the centerpiece of Ford's top-selling truck line.

As rising fuel prices have driven up demand for the V-6 engine, Ling said Ford has chosen to apportion more supply to the F-150, among its most profitable models. The V-6 Mustang starts at a list price of $22,310, according to Ford.com.

"The V-6 powertrain that's shared with all of our hot products is really very popular right now," Jim Farley, Ford's global marketing chief, said in a June 9 interview. "We have a lower days' supply on Mustang, but we think that's the right way to run that business."

The V-6 engine shortage has left Ford with less than 30 days' supply of Mustangs, half the inventory it had a year ago, Ling said. Ford is now looking for ways to boost production of the V-6, which accounts for 51 percent of Mustang sales, up from 40 percent a year ago, Ling said.

"We're making sure that the truck has enough engines and obviously there is an impact to Mustang," Ling said. "The dealers feel we could sell more" if Ford had more V-6 engines.

Camaro rolling

GM is stepping up the pressure by updating the Camaro next month with a more powerful V-6 engine that gets 30 mpg on the highway, Fitzpatrick said. It also is updating the car's interior with new features like a smaller steering wheel, he said.

Rising gasoline prices and a stalling U.S. economy can't seem to slow down the Camaro, which went on sale in April 2009 after a seven-year hiatus. Camaro sales are up 4 percent this year, while Mustang is down 3 percent, according to researcher Autodata Corp.

"The Camaro is highly unusual in a segment that tends to be very fickle," said Jeremy Anwyl, chief executive officer of auto researcher Edmunds.com. "Normally a sports car that's really hot fades fast."

Maintaining interest

To keep interest stoked, GM will advertise around the movie sequel "Transformers: Dark of the Moon," debuting June 29 and again featuring a yellow-and-black Camaro as a crime-fighting robot, Ling said. The Camaro known as "Bumblebee" has been the ride of actor Shia LaBeouf in all three Transformer movies.

"The linkage to Transformers has really helped create and build the brand Camaro," Schuster said, "especially with young people."

Early next year, GM plans to roll out a ZL1 Camaro with a 550-horsepower engine, matching Ford's Shelby GT500 version of the Mustang that starts at $48,810, according to Edmunds.

"It looks like they clearly targeted the GT500," Ling said. Much is riding on Ford's 2014 redesign of the Mustang, which Ling declined to describe. By then, Camaro will be five years old and more than a year away from its own restyling in late 2015, Schuster said.

"As the Camaro starts to age and the Mustang is redesigned, that will heat up the battle," Schuster said. "We see the Mustang regaining its No. 1 position when it's redesigned, but it will be close."

Hm, this is bittersweet.

I hope there aren't too many more jobs put in jeopardy in the auto industry. However, I think Ford need to take a hard look at their ancient rear axle setup. As a former owner of a 2005, and 2008 Mustang GT, I can say with some authority, that even my V6 Camaro is a much much more refined car, and is as quick point to point, because I have more faith in the car staying on the road at high speed.

"The Camaro has a more modern feel and seems to draw more attention from a younger age group"

Interesting comment... Most of the people I know with Camaros - myself included - wouldn't consider themselves "younger". Who exactly is buying Mustangs? Octegenarians???
Maybe the workers in Flat Rock should move to Oshawa...

Worrysome... but sounds familiar
 

Ford will be fine. The sales of the current generation Mustang may be slumping because of its body design, but it has several very well designed engines and a lineup of cars that in my opinion is the best looking lineup of any of the detroit 3. Ford can pull off a successful redesign. You can see it in their lineup. They just need to get it right for the next Mustang.

The Camaro is hot right now, but if GM doesn't offer as many options as Ford does in regards to accessories, options such as gears, navigation and even models (v6, gt, boss, gt500), the Camaro's sales will eventually slump. We are just lucky that most people consider the Camaro a better looking car today. Ford has been refining the Mustang since its inception. The Camaro is now a totally new design, it kicks butt, but don't be fooled. Ford isn't happy with being number #2, especially when the Mustang was the ONLY pony car to enjoy uninterrupted production.

When I went car hunting..I went to check out the mustang. I checked several dealerships. One had a beat up demo and a base v6. Thats it. They were selling so fast that they had no inventory to sell me..lol. They cant be doing that bad.

Hmm, that's certainly the exception to the rule then. The Mustang currently has one of the longest inventory days in the industry. In fact, last month it was the 6th worst in all models:

2011 Vehicles: Longest Days in Inventory

Rank Model/Year Days in Inventory
1 BMW Z4 161 Days
2 Volkswagen CC 143 Days
3 Hyundai Azera 133 Days
4 Mazda MAZDA2 120 Days
5 Mitsubishi Eclipse 119 Days
6 Ford Mustang 105 Days
7 Toyota Camry Hybrid 102 Days
8 Mazda MAZDA3 100 Days
9 Mazda MX-5 Miata 99 Days
10 Ford Focus 98 Days

source: http://blog.truecar.com/2011/05/17/m...n-inventory-2/

BTW, that article says that Flat Rock (mustangs only plant that I'm aware of) is down to a single shift. So they can't get any lower without going part time and they still have one of the longest selling days of inventory. That means ford can't even sell the few that a single shift can build right now.

As much as I'd love to say "Suck it Mustang" -- I honestly can't.. Putting the smack down on a rival car is one thing, but I'm not going to cheer on the possibility of American workers being put in to unemployment just to brag on my own platform's success...

I'd rather they stay open and share the spot light with Mustang, than have even a single worker laid off..

i really hope people start buying the mustang. come on its faster ! lol

:word:
I have friends that work at the Mustang plant too and I agree. ^

I agree HumanWiki

yay for beating the mustang, not so much for the ppl whos jobs are in jeapardy... i want the camaro to be beating the mustang in sales, not thrashing it so badly that they stop making it. we need competition!!

Maybe GM could help Ford out by building Camaro's side by side with the Mustangs to keep the plant open.:)

i'd like to get next weeks lotto numbers as well please.:rolleyes:

Sounds like the Bloomberg article was written by a Ford fanboy.

Honestly, I'd love to see Ford and GM build along side each other like that. Camaros off one side and Mustangs off the other..

Yes, we're enemies on the track -- but, without each other we're both doomed to boredom and stagnation..

Hell, even Wile E. Coyote realized that he needed the Road Runner.

The current body style of the Mustang has been played out. Its time for them to refresh the look and feel of it. The styling of the Camaro more then off sets the areas that the Mustang is slightly better.

The Mustang is a great car, with a rich and legendary history and in its current configuration is a very worthy competitor for the Camaro V6 or SS. I can't imagine it ever stopping production, but either way it deserves to live on. Things like this are cyclical - Ford WILL regain the upper hand in time, then lose it again, and so on.

At the risk of making us Camaro guys be the Joker, I'm reminded of his line to Batman from The Dark Knight: "Kill you? I don't want to kill you! What would I do without you?" ;)

This Camaro is obviously taken the nation by a storm. Coupled with the Transformers marketing, it is the premier sports car in America at the moment. In actuality, I think the Camaro's 8 year layoff actually helped because its return brought such an uproar of enthusiasts anticipating its return that it launched with a bang. The Mustang has always been around, yes it has been updated, but the Camaro of 2010 revolutionized the sports car.

Everybody sees Mustangs out there, but I still have people staring at my car, and even taking pictures of it. Nobody does that with a Mustang. Why? Because they see the Camaro as "that car in that cool Transformers movie." And that's a good thing. It's got such an aura that whenever I tell people I have a Camaro, they automatically have a connection with it. The Mustang is ingrained into our culture so it will always be there, but the Camaro has taken a leap in its status as not just Chevy's pony car, but America's pony car.

I also think the link to Transformers is a bit over stated. For me it was just a show case for one sweet looking car. It is a great advertising tool but only because people love the design of the vehicle so much.

My point is that people saw that car in the movie, so for some not really into cars or the car scene, it was a movie prop right in front of their faces. How I know, because that's what most people tell me on the streets. "Hey that's the Camaro from the movie isn't it??"

the camaro is the hottest car in the market right now. With the transformer's movie makes it even hotter :thumbup:

The Mustang is not going anywhere guys. If anything you'll see a new Lincoln Mark after the 2014 redesign to fill the high end market and some of that plants volume.

As for the axle talk just drop it already. It's been proven time after time stock for stock the Mustang handles better than the mediocre setup in the Camaro. I hope the Camaro and Challenger stick around to keep Ford honest and I would hope you all feel the same so GM keeps pushing the Camaro further.

If it wasn't for the success of the 05+ Mustang you all wouldn't even be driving a Camaro.

Im with you, I was actually tying my comment as you were typing yours and was referring to part of the article.

:drinking:

I agree, the mustang aint going anywhere. the article didn't say that mustang was going away, just that the plant needs more volume to stay open...

Even if they close the Flatrock plant they will probably just move production to another plant that is underutilized. maybe adding another shift, or they could move production of another vehicle to the Flatrock plant to keep it open, either way the Mustang is not going anywhere, it is Ford's image car, they need it in their lineup.

It is faster, when u drive a camaro. Damn, im sure mustang gt even faster when zl1 is in ur hands.:thumbdown:

The Mustang isn't going anywhere, but it is being crushed in sales by it's counterpart. Ford doesn't have what it takes to compete with the Camaro revolution. It's an icon. The 2005 Mustang was just a new model with a retro look, the 2010 Camaro was branded as a modern day sports car with 1st Gen inspired looks. The power, styling, and branding have made the Camaro a success. The Mustang, as always, is just a Mustang.

I sense dissent and distaste with your last statement in your post. Claiming that the success of the 2005 Mustang brought out the new Camaro. Couldn't be further from the truth. If anything, the retro styling was started by the PT Cruiser.

I still believe that Transformers was BY FAR the best thing that GM did with the marketing of the Camaro. 95% of America is so brainwashed by Hollywood into believing that everything on the big screen is the greatest thing ever. It just so happens that the new Camaro happens to be that great!

Most of us car guys/gals see past this as marketing but truly look at the car for what it is, one of the best muscle cars ever produced in styling and performance. Some of us are loyal to GM products or the Camaro brand and another group was swayed over from the Mustang. The thing that puts the Camaro over the top of average sales to me is all of the new buyers coming in because of Transformers and it being the "hip" car that Hollywood has portrayed to us.

I would think most car manufactures would be doing high fives to sell 70,xxx cars from a model that came out in 2005. Don't feel sorry for the Mustang, they sold 325,xxx alone in the first two model years of this generation.

They can afford to loss a little money on the Mustang until the 2014 model comes out. GM needs to be agile enough to be ready with the Gen6 model for 2015 and make last minute adjustments.

You might want to go back and look at interviews from GM and Chrysler personnel since 05. The Pony Car segment was just about on its deathbed prior to the 05 Mustang. The success of that car gave the green light in GM and Chrysler to build their own. Forget about the retro aspect because the Camaro certainly isn’t that. Plus don’t read too much into my post because your looking for dissent and distaste that’s not there. However, if things keep going this way the Camaro will just be a Camaro because you'll see them everywhere. ;)

I'm with a few others here,i still love my maro after two years of ownership,hell i even had a guy ask me the other day if i wanted to sell it,i told him not really but $$$ talks,if he will give me what it would take for me to sell it then yeah,i'll sell to him,that way i would have a good down payment for the "ZL1"...he could buy a new 2011 camaro for what it would take to get mine but i have done alot of mods to mine,..anyway back to topic,i would hate to see people lose jobs,and i do believe that the mustang is gonna be redefined in a way that people are gonna look at it the way they look at the camaro today,and after the "ZL1" beast hits the streets and out does the shelby then ford will have to do something to beef-up the motor to meet or beat the zl1......then guess what...? CHEVY will come out with the "Z28"...and the wars continue on,

funny about the remark about seeing camaro's everywhere,that is exactly what i thought and still think about the mustang,which i think the good sales of the camaro is bittersweet due to the fact of the amount of sales,i'd rather not see a camaro everytime i turn the corner,

This is such awesome news. Just imagine if chevy actually starts playing Camaro commercials on TV, Mustangs will be done. All I saw every two seconds while I watch Fox ch. 5 is that mustang commercial. I never see a Camaro commercial. I don't like to see someone out of a job though. Everything about the Camaro is better, from looks, handle, speed, and its a CHEVY!

:word:

Transformers or not, once i saw the concept, i just had to get one, but for the younger people and children, Transformers blew the camaro out of the water. Great marketing by chevrolet. I used to keep replaying the scenes in TF1 that had the camaro in it. 5th gen camaro will be a WORLD icon, because of transformers. Kinda like Star Wars is to my generation.

yup, redesigning the mustang seems to be Ford's best hope(or drastically dropping prices). Doesn't help w/ the V6 shortage either...

ford will be alright. the mustang to them is like the corvette to us. it wont persish

It looks like more special editions are on the way. That's Ford's answer to competing with the Camaro until 2014. :rolleyes: I look forward to seeing more vinyl-clad Mustangs on the streets. :stang: