orange10s.c. AKA Gary's Customz has not fully delivered on product
 

I contacted orange10s.c. "Gary's Customz" via PM about buying a Transformers 2 bumper assembly on 9/28/2010. His post about the bumpers clearly state that the bumpers include the ports and splitter; see quote below. I got the price and do to time restraints I asked how long the process would take. I was quoted a week to a week and a half. This would be fine as I needed the car back together by Thanksgiving. I made the payment on 10/1/2010. Along with my payment information I requested that the bumper be painted just like in his post; ports and splitter are Matte Black.

Im a very patient person and fully expected the week to week and a half to be more like three. Three weeks go by and still not a word from orange10s.c. Gary's Customz. I contacted him via PM again on 10/25/2010 to check the status. He let me know that the bumper was finally on the way and that there were pics in the thread. http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=272 (the IBM one if he keeps the pics up)

Right off the bat I could tell that the paint was not the Matte Black pictured in the thread. No big deal since I am having a hood painted the same time this is being installed I can have this fixed. Received the bumper on 11/1/2010 and contacted orange10s.c. Gary's Customz explaining that I did not receive the splitter. I asked if I would receive that separately.

His Response: "Yes you will be getting it seperate. They are running behind on having them ready and i thought they were going to be ready by now. All my customers are going to be getting some of the first one's when they are available. Thanks Gary" 11/1/2010

No updates so I PM'd again

My Question: "Any ETA on this? or do you know if this splitter can be installed without removing the bumper?"

His Response: "not yet. i'm trying to get a hold of them now since they are back from sema. It can be easily installed with the bumper on." 11/09/2010 7:44am CST


They = ACS

Taking matters into my own hands I PM'd ACS and in less than 4 hours got a reply. ACS is NOT making the splitter for this bumper and has no plans to at this time. I asked Gary again for a status on 11/15/2010 explaining that they dont have plans to make the splitter and he again assured me that the splitter was being made.

I let him know that I was giving this process two more weeks (in good faith) to have the splitter done or I would need to return the bumper. I personally dont like the bumper without the splitter and it will not flow with my car. So on 11/16/2010 I sent the following....



Response:

Today we are at two weeks. I contacted Gary letting him know that I would like to return the bumper for a refund. To put it nicely he refuses to make this right. Gary sold me a bumper that he knew was not complete. I feel that he thought that I simply wouldnt notice that the splitter was missing. This is not a misunderstanding on my part and I had asked to begin with how long this process would take. Gary may have some nice products but to me he has been very dishonest.

If I had known that the splitter was not available I would have simply ordered the T3 bumper assembly and called it a day. Lucky me would have had the car together first week of November. I dont think its right or fair that I be stuck with an incomplete order. The assembly does not look right and does not flow well with my other body mods. I have researched other V6 splitters and none of them work for me. I seriously spent hours.

Gary states that he will refund the $339 for the splitter but that does not solve my problem. I still have an incomplete bumper assembly.

BUYER BEWARE Gary will charge you for parts knowing they aren't being produced. I am stuck with an $1800 V6 bumper with vents.

Still isnt updated:

As you can see I asked him to update his post so that everyone knows that the splitter is not available for the T2 bumper.

Big Difference in looks:

Sorry to hear that. I had ordered ACS splitter in Satin black from Gary, and the finish was perfect.

I later ordered CDC side skirts in the same satin black, they arrived in a matte finish. Unfortunately, I hadn't checked the skirts in the light, so I didn't realize until the body shop had already put them on the car.

I asked Gary what I could do, he basically suggested using a polish on the skirts to make them more shiny. Since it was partially my fault for not checking, I didn't pursue this any further, but as people on the forum will tell you, getting painted parts is really hit or miss.

Yep, If had ordered a SS splitter I would be just fine.

The V6 is the problem. I needed a replacement bumper after my hit and run.

I know your issue is different, mine has been on my mind for a few months just need to vent !

At least you have the best color...IBM rocks!

what a terrible way to handle and treat a customer.

you are not getting what you paid for - did you pay by credit card? I always buy my car parts via credit card because they have awesome protection for stuff like this, I'd open up a dispute immediately.

I already tried that too. He only accepts paypal and its over 45 days. I'll call them in the morning.

yes, but you can enter a credit card through paypal. trust me, I had a similar run in with a body kit for my 350z and had to reverse 2000$ over on my credit card.

I use my credit card even when going through paypal. I don't trust their buyers protection

I',m sorry to hear about your problem. Considering how much business Gary gets from this forum, you would think he would take a hit to keep a customer happy. Especially since he falsely described a product. Hope you get this resolved.

--Eddie

It was an instant transfer :facepalm: from checking.

The money was from the insurance claim and some savings because i was upgrading. Yes i know BIG mistake.




Well I wont be getting the fender vents after this. :iono: Those were next on the list after income tax.

he really should have ate the loss on this one without question. he does get a lot of business here and he has a lot of happy customers, but word gets out fast from bad experiences and people think twice when it happens.

I know I was going to get a painted heritage grill from him for a christmas present, but as is without hearing his side of the story and seeing him make it right, I'll just go elsewhere.

first off i never sold you an "incomplete " bumper on purpose. I told you from day one that ACS has no concrete time frame on when the T2 splitter will be done. Any time lines after that were being relayed from what information i was given from ACS. The bumper was delivered to you EXACTLY how you wanted it painted. I cannot help that the splitter is not ready yet. If i was making it it would be. I cannot take the bumper back just because the splitter is not ready. I have not EVER sold anyone a part that i knew i wouldn't have OR try to steal money from someone on parts i cannot get. I would not still be in business for 22 yrs doing that. Like i have told you before if you want the money back for the splitter i have no prob. giving it to you.

Hundreds of people have purchased from Gary Customs without incident. Are mistakes made, yepper, but I know Gary will make it right!

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/attach...1&d=1291078641

Now, I will tell you, I was at SEMA, and ACS had this bumper on display in thier both and in the NEW PRODUCTS section at SEMA (unpainted) as shown above...............So why they say "NO" have no clue!

They ARE making the splitter i have been told that many times !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is not true. At NO time did you offer the info that the splitter was not available until after I had received the bumper. I then asked where the splitter was and if i was receiving it separately. You told me there was no concrete time after I was STUCK with this incomplete set. The proof is in you own post and trust me I still have every single PM that we exchanged.

PM About the Splitter:

Yet this info was offered upfront? Negative.

Ouch man good luck with getting this all straightened out

Sorry to hear this hope u can get this worked out.I had some problems with gary also with a heritage grill that he painted for me that didnt match that he insisted that it did and had an attitude because i called him on it. I ended up just letting it go because i was crunched for time and didnt have anymore time to deal with this so i just bought another one and had it done correctly.Good luck with this hopefully gary will man up and make it good.I know he will never see anymore business from me and if he rips you off for that much money maybe you should go about it another way.:mad0259:

Interesting......

sorry you're havin problems, but my cgm heritage grill was a perfect match to the car.:thumbsup:

I ORDERED A T2 BUMPER, SPLITTER, L.E.D. STRIPS, AND SLP HOOD FROM GARY NOT TOO LONG AGO. WAS THERE A LITTLE TIME DELAY, YES BUT OVERALL I'M STILL SATISFIED WITH THE OUTCOME. I AM A LITTLE DISSAPOINTED AS WELL FOR STILL NOT HAVING MY FRONT SPLITTER YET, AND WASN'T INFORMED AHEAD OF TIME THAT THEY WERE ON BACK ORDER, AND YES I WANT MY CAR COMPLETE, BUT THERE HAS TO BE AT LEAST A LITTLE LE-WAY. I ALSO CONTACTED ACS, IN GARY'S DEFENSE, AND THE OWNER TOLD ME DIRECTLY THAT "THEY ARE" STILL REVISING THE NEW MOUNTING SOLUTIONS FOR THE T2 SPLITTER, BUT AS OF RIGHT NOW THERE ARE NO DEFINATE ETA'S. AM I STILL FRUSTRATED, ABSOLUTELY, BUT ITS NOT GARY'S FAULT, ACS JUMPED THE GUN WHEN RELEASING THESE BUMPERS AND SPLITTERS AND ARE NOW TRYING TO PLAY CATCH-UP. PERSONALLY, I'D RATHER THEM HAVE A PERFECT MOUNTING SOLUTION FOR THIS SPLITTER BEFORE SENDING IT OUT, BECAUSE IF I PUT THIS ON MY CAR, AND IT FELL OFF, I WOULD BE PISSED.

ON ANOTHER NOTE, WHEN I WENT TO PICK MY CAR UP FROM GARY, ONE OF MY L.E.D. STRIPS BURNT OUT AND WASN'T WORKING, BUT WHEN I GOT THE CAR BACK HOME, I SWAPPED IT OUT WITH ANOTHER SOLUTION AND HAD NO PROBLEM GETTING GARY TO REFUND ME. HE IS UP AND UP, SO CUT HIM A LITTLE SLACK.

Exactly my point. If he was upfront about this I would of gone with a different order.

GARY KNOWS THAT THE SPLITTER IS NOT AVAILABLE.

Yet he charges you for it and tells you to wait. He advertises this as a complete set. Even after I have been very polite and patient I can not wait any longer. And to top it off I told him I wanted to return the bumper for a refund two weeks ago but would wait a little while longer.

I am NOT blaming Gary for the splitter not being available. I am blaming him for selling me something that's not available and not being upfront.

Unacceptable!

IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU NEED TO GET ONTO ACS, NOT GARY

Gary sold this to me not ACS.

You must be kidding... :iono:


This has gone on way too long... full refund should be in order by now..

This didn't just get posted on a whim...

ACS IS CORRECTING THE MOUNTING NOT GARY

have you read any posts about caps?:iono:

Tough crowd...Huh Gary? I'll draw their fire as usual and you take cover...

:yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes:

http://img.timeinc.net/time/daily/sp...tles/cover.jpg

Come on man i never gave you an attitude about the grille you said didnt match. I have painted over 100 of them and NEVER had a prob with ANY not matching. You sent pics. of it installed and it looked perfect. and you said well you cant tell in the pics. I told you to send it back if you were still not happy and you said ok. Well a week or 2 weeks go by then you called again and said there are blemishes in the grille itself from the factory. I again said send it back and i will refund your money and you again said ok i will send it back. This was about a YEAR ago and now for some reason after never hearing from you again it's now an issue. Some people i tell ya !!!:mad0260:

Well with over 500 items sent out to C5 customers there will be a few errors or mistakes i'm sure. and took care of any and all that have come up without any issues at all. :thumbup:

AGAIN i was never told of a deff. date that the splitter would of been ready. It's not that it is NOT AVAILABLE they are making changes to it and are waaaaaaaay behind on getting it finished. It WILL be made but i cannot help that is taking this long.

Gary,

Why not tell me that they are running way behind on making the splitter when I asked how long this would take? I asked you this before placing the order.


Did you ever tell me that the splitter was not available and that it could take this long to receive? No

Did you tell me I would receive my order in a week to week and a half? Yes

Did you ever mention that the splitter would arrive separately before I asked? No

Did you charge me for part of an assembly that you personally knew was not available? Yes

How am I being unreasonable? I told you two weeks ago that I would be asking for a refund and to have this bumper picked up.

You simply are being dishonest at this point.

I DID NOT KNOW AT THE TIME OF YOU PLACING THE ORDER THAT IT WOULD BE THIS LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG FOR THEM TO GET IT DONE.


they were supposed to be shipped out at the same time as the the bumpers were available. They had to go back and change the way they mounted and redo the moulds to re make. this happened between the time you placed the order and the bumper came in and was painted and shipped to you. I was told at that time that it might be 2 weeks for them to be ready. In return that's what i relayed to you. If you want the money back for the spitter i need your paypal info so i can send that money back to you.

Again. I do not want this bumper without being complete. You can send me a full refund and sale the bumper to someone that likes it without the splitter. It is wrapped up and ready to go. It has not been installed and is in the same condition that I received it. You can also exchange it for the T3 bumper WITH splitter unpainted and as long as its instock and complete....the choice is yours. Keeping this bumper does not work for me. Sorry but that i will not accept.

It doesnt look the same.

Gary, I am chiming in as a customer service professional here...
Customer ordered from you for a project he needs both pieces to finish. You have been unable to satisfy him by providing both pieces and an unreasonable amount of time has gone by.
You should have UPS pick it up and refund his money, or supply him with the part that should have been delivered in a timely manner.
IF you have problems with YOUR supplier, you should NOT hold your patient and frustrated customer up any longer. He should not be in this position, and you, as a merchant wishing to come across as professional, should offer to take the product back. I already would not order from you because you come across in an inflammatory manner and your customer is being quite reasonable in his request.
You also state that for the past year you have been offering another upset customer the option to return a product and yet you are digging your heels in on the OP. Where's the line? You return for one but not another? Consistency would be appropriate.
I recently was held up for over 3 months on an order for a pair of working boots for my husband. I will never EVER buy from Chippewa boots again and I suggest y'all follow suit because they come across like a bunch of entitled ingrates. I requested my money back and got it but not without a fight. Instead I am spending $375. more and having custom boots made for him. Someone who is giving me GOOD customer service is getting my business now.
Any road, were this case on my desk I would be refunding the customers money and apologizing for the entire situation profusely. You will make more money in the long run by coming across as a hero instead of a zero. One dissatisfied customer can draw a LOT of attention, as you are finding out here. Just give the poor guy his money back and let him get on with his project.

Agreed the OP is just looking for a refund on a item that he has purchased from you. If YOUR supplier is in the wrong, it is not his problem to make it right. When a customer is in a time restraint he should not be pushed to wait for an item that has no estimated arrival. He can do with his car what he wants to. You are putting this customer through a lot of stress. Just take care of him. He is even still looking to do business with you, which I think is very fair of him.

well said.....

Gary....in the intrest of full disclosure i bought from you and my parts came in OK....but i was uneasey with your lack of Customer service....i don't like spending 500.00 + and having to ask for confirmation, delivery times etc.....

with that said....thank me later for scanning the T3 instructions and emailing them while sending the templates via USPS to one of your customers who's Ports showed up less those critical items......he came on the boards asking for help after he could not get them from his "vendor"....

First of all gary i dont know how you have painted over a 100 of these and never had a problemm when you dont even get the paint code off the car.Im not a painter by trade but everytime i get something painted they get the paint code because every orange camaro isnt the same .If im wrong about this will someone tell me.Second of all you cant tell in the pics like i told you, and if you would of read the post i didnt have the time to deal with this crap.It seems like you have time to take peoples money but no time to make sure things are correct before you send them out ,dont worry your not the only one doing this.Man up and make it right.:mad0260:

What a screwed up situation...

I agree that the OP should not have to deal with this the way he is, he has been very patient and reasonable


Gary I understand its not your fault but it is definitely not your customers fault that YOUR supplier is dropping the ball, you should probably take care of this guy cuz as of now you've lost 1 more customer.....

lol

I came across this post yesterday and read the OP's view and the vendors reply's today. In the end this will not bod well for the vendor. I for one am not to pleased with the defensive "it's their fault" position the vendor has taken. The replies are not good business practices in any books. I am not sure what the return freight costs would be but I believe the cost to the business(s) (both of them) will be much greater if this continues. There have been many times I have ordered items and had to cancel them 30 or more days later when they were suppose to be "in stock". I was able to get my money back because I payed with a credit card. I see this individual did not...."Lesson Learned". my2. :popcorn: