LFX ENGINE TRANSPLANT INTO LLT

[alice]

I am bringing this thread over from the LLT section because a lot of LFX enthusiasts do not view the LLT section. I am attempting to transplant a LFX engine/auto transmission into my LLT. So far, I have built a new 2014 LFX engine/trans and have it on a roller stand so I am able to roll it beside the LLT and plug the (2) engine harness plugs into the LLT body receptacles, in order to work out communication issues between the new LFX engine and the LLT body control modules, etc.

Everything is mechanically completed and the mechanical issues are resolved and in place, ready for physical transplant, which, by the way, is silly simple. The issues that remain is are purely electrical. The LLT uses the Bosch ECM, the LFX uses the later Delphi which makes tuning so much easier and much more refined. The LFX Engine has many internal improvements that make this transplant a really interesting project.

My LLT is currently a twin turbo vehicle and performs great but I am after more HP and the updated LFX engine. I have postings on this site with my vehicle if you care to explore the forum.

The challenges that remain are all electrical and compatibility issues that need to be identified and resolved, in order to make this transplant a success. I am at a point where I need some help on this part of the first, ever, transplant of an LFX into and LLT and that is why I am here on the forum. There are many knowledgeable people that are here and I am hoping can input some help. I will be adding information as to what I have discovered, so far in my efforts to make this work. Also, you can jump over to the LLT thread and get much more history on the project. I certainly will appreciate any helpful comments as I continue to hopefully conclude this transplant. Thanks to everyone.

[alice]

When I plug the engine harness plugs (2) from the LFX engine into the LLT body, I have communication but I cannot load the 2014 LFX base program into the LFX ECM because the GM server can identify that I am trying to load a 2014 LFX program into a 2010 LLT and a pop-up window defines a security issue and won't allow the program to be loaded. I hit a wall and must work out logistics to move forward. What I need to accomplish is getting a 2014 LFX base program loaded on the new LFX ECM, change the VIN to match my LLT, possibly disable VATS and at that point, I should be able to start the LFX engine outside the LLT vehicle and identify any other issues on the car.

I am still waiting on a couple responses from a couple knowledgeable tuners, concerning next steps in tackling these unknown procedural steps forward. As of today, one possibility is to find a 2014 Camaro LFX and temporarily remove it's factory ECM, install my new 2014 GM, unprogrammed ECM and have my mobile programmer load a base 2014 program into it, along with the 2014 VIN.

Next step would be to have a performance tuner take the 2014 ECM and disable VATS and change the 2014 VIN number to my 2010 LLT VIN number but it needs to be DONE ON THE BENCH AND NOT IN THE CAR. (Still haven't verified that disabling VATS and changing the VIN can be done on the bench, as suggested)

Final step (hopefully) would be to roll the 2014 LFX engine/transmission up, next to my LLT, remove the (2) LLT engine harness plugs and plug in the LFX engine harness and see what happens. Obviously, from the pictures, I have the ability to do this without installing the engine in my LLT and if necessary have provided a way to even start and run the LFX on the stand. Codes and communications can then be verified and then proceed to resolve any issues that might remain. This is my daily driver vehicle and I cannot risk down time to install an engine that we don't know will even work in this LLT. This is why I am doing this project the way I am.

If anyone has any further input on this conversion/transplant project, PLEASE feel free to comment and/or assist. This is a FIRST of this kind in the 5th Gen Camaros. Uncharted territory. Hopefully, I will have more information in the coming days/weeks, as to if this is the correct procedure to follow or if another procedure should be tried first.

Footnote: As far as Global A, GM electrical architecture is concerned, it is generally agreed that this should not be of concern (although not written in stone) on this transplant. Global A began in 2010 to date on all Camaros. Google it to see what GM is up to. You will be totally amazed! This technology throws a monkey wrench into people changing and installing used body control modules in their vehicles in an attempt to repair issue themselves. You are at the mercy of the dealer!!!!! If attempted, the secret ID numbers in all the modules from the factory will default the vehicle useless and will not start until the car is taken to a dealer for proper repair. $$$$

[Shawno72]

Sub'd

[1Coopgt]

There was a guy that swapped a LFX into a Mazda Miata . He was posting his progress here and in a Mazda forum . Car ran great . Try searching for that thread and see if you can contact him. Then you can ask him how he got it to work . He may have used a standalone engine management system though .

[shags]

that's sick man.. i don't know anything about it but im sure there are some on here who do.. can't wait to see it finished

[alice]

Yes, I investigated the Miata project. He didn't have to marry the ECM to the body control modules as I will have to. Stand alone harnesses are available but then the body control modules are not in the loop. Cannot do that on this project but thanks for the comments and suggestions. Keep them coming!

[mender]

Could you keep the LLT ECU to run the stock BCM and such and use the LFX ECU as a standalone? Feed the LLT ECU the engine sensor info that it needs to be happy?

I'm in the middle of an LS swap into a Jeep and it has both the Jeep and LS ECU, it's running and we're down to the final details. Feeding info from the LS to the Jeep ECU so that it can run the dash and AC.

[alice]

Theoretically that's possible but a whole lot of wiring. Good point. Trying to find a more direct approach. Thanks for the suggestion! Possibly would explore that route if all else fails. Thanks again friend!

[mender]

I did the same on a '95 Camaro that I put a twin turbo 4.3 into for a customer. Ran the engine on one ECU and had the stock one thinking it was doing something.

I'll be making up a stand alone harness for an LFX swap in the near future, I like wiring so don't mind.

[alice]

Mender, this is something to definitely consider if an easier way is not discovered. Though I haven't thought about this approach much, I would be a bit concerned of any interactions as they relate to all the BCM's in the vehicle, security and body functions. Would have to assess everything first but a possibility.

[alice]

https://youtu.be/btWy5Y_CfRk
Video of completed 2014 LFX Twin Turbo engine and transmission, ready to transplant when we can figure out the electronic compatibilities.

[alice]

Just received a new ECM from Vince at Trifecta. He loaded a 2014 base program, Vin matched my LLT and disabled VATS. He is the only programmer I know who has been able to successfully do this without ODB2 access, which will not work from the LLT due to VIN/YEAR difference, thus, server locks out the ability to download a different program from the one allowed for that year and model Camaro.

This has been a long journey getting to this point. Vince was the original tuner for my twin turbo LLT way back in 2010. He is one of the most knowledgeable tuners I have talked to. We have been collaborating about this project for some time now and he told me he was able to do what others have not been able to do. He indicated that theoretically, I should be able to roll the LFX engine/transmission along side my LLT and plug it in and it should start the engine. Once we confirm that this step in the process can be accomplished, we can evaluate any other glitches and/or codes/incompatibilities and move on from that point. As Vince pointed out, even if it starts, we may still not be out of the woods until we know that all the BCM's are happy in the vehicle and proper communications are confirmed. Vince's main concern is the ECBM compatibility with this conversion, so we will see.

Vince is working with me on this project and I feel confident that if this transplant is possible, he will be the genius that makes it happen. He has done programming for me in the past and has always succeeded in dialing things in. I believe that he was the first programmer to crack the LLT/Bosch encrypted ECM and successfully manipulate programming. My twin turbo project was one of the first in 2010 and the program he supplied has flawlessly worked since. Driving on it everyday.

Because a holiday is coming up and my business workload is heavy, my plan is to attempt to give this a try in several weeks. It has taken me almost a year to get to this point so I am not going to rush this. Haste makes waste! I plan to video tape the trail attempt and record data to send back to Vince for evaluation. As Vince indicated, this is a first for a LLT/LFX transplant and uncharted territory for sure, so at this point we can only try it and see what happens. I can't thank Vince enough for taking on this project. In my opinion, if he can't make it work, nobody can!

I am so excited to have arrived at this point. I will keep everyone updated.

[KaBoom1701]

[alice]

Make sure you have plenty of popcorn!! This is slow going, for sure. Patience, patience. It takes a bunch of that!