My Camaro went home to Oshawa to die......

[Camarowguy]

Originally Posted by SUX2BU

Where have i heard that before? LOL

The only oil pumps I have see fail have been 100K+ mile pumps and one BRAND NEW ported pump.



The type of problem you are describing would slightly bed a valve or two, not cause all this.

If you say so. Think of it this way. The engine is hot. The valves are even hotter. What does heated metal do? It will get slightly more pliable. (to a small extent) so what happens when it barely touches the piston? It probably bends ever so slightly. Then it slams back on the seat and probably gets tweaked back straight. Do this cycle a bunch if times and see what happens. This is just my theory. Could be right, could be wrong....but it makes sense to me.

[mikeSS]

Originally Posted by Camarowguy

I'm still sticking to my original theory of not having enough piston to valve clearance. The ls3 engines have no valve reliefs. So cam selection is important. And just because the same cam worked in your buddies car doesn't mean it'll be ok in yours. I learned that lesson building a 4 wheeler engine. I'm imagining that your shop, huggerorange, has installed this same cam and had no issues. So valve clearance wasn't actually checked and here you are left holding the bag. Why did it take so long? Well my guess is you had less than the minimum clearance required and when you ran the car hard you had ever so slight contact. Then the springs got some miles on them. Things got worse. And then you know the rest of the story.

I don't own a shop. I've build lots of engines though. From go-kart to lawn mower to atv to stock automobile engines to the pretty powerful engine in my former third gen. I had failures. I've learned from my mistakes. I now know what it takes to build a reliable engine. The most important thing is to check, check and recheck your clearances. I'm anxious to see if you cam pin broke and caused this. If that happened, well I could be wrong or the above I mentioned happened and help push that along. I guess we shall see.

i am FAR from a expert, but from what my shop said about some shops not all but some. i wouldn't be surprised that you are right.

[Huggerorange73]

Originally Posted by SSBUSDRVR

Sorry to hear and see.:( Apologize as having not read every post. How big is the Cam? Are the pistons stock. Could there have been a clearance issue? Remember reading an article in CamaroNow about Cams and heads on the LS3(just found the article again now) The build team went with a .617/.624 231/239 113d Comp Cam. They claim any wilder and there can be clearance issues with the factory flat tops.
Still trying to decide whether to go with a Cam or put the money towards a SC. Brings back memories. The 82PaceCar I had came with a weak 305. Cam had a plastic gear that self destructed while going to work in the early AM (think we only had 12k warranties back then. Whatever it was,no coverage:() Left it by the side of the road in a puddle of oil and hitchhiked. It came back better than ever at the time with a 406. Hope you are back on the road better than ever asap

Cam is .571/590 228/240 on a 113 LSA.....this is a baby cam.

Originally Posted by lawman007

So, you modded it?

Guilty as charged!

Originally Posted by Camarowguy

I'm still sticking to my original theory of not having enough piston to valve clearance. The ls3 engines have no valve reliefs. So cam selection is important. And just because the same cam worked in your buddies car doesn't mean it'll be ok in yours. I learned that lesson building a 4 wheeler engine. I'm imagining that your shop, huggerorange, has installed this same cam and had no issues. So valve clearance wasn't actually checked and here you are left holding the bag. Why did it take so long? Well my guess is you had less than the minimum clearance required and when you ran the car hard you had ever so slight contact. Then the springs got some miles on them. Things got worse. And then you know the rest of the story.

I don't own a shop. I've build lots of engines though. From go-kart to lawn mower to atv to stock automobile engines to the pretty powerful engine in my former third gen. I had failures. I've learned from my mistakes. I now know what it takes to build a reliable engine. The most important thing is to check, check and recheck your clearances. I'm anxious to see if you cam pin broke and caused this. If that happened, well I could be wrong or the above I mentioned happened and help push that along. I guess we shall see.

It wasn't valve clearance...trust me. It's either the pin or the timing chain/tensioner.

[Camarowguy]

Originally Posted by Huggerorange73

Cam is .571/590 228/240 on a 113 LSA.....this is a baby cam.



Guilty as charged!



It wasn't valve clearance...trust me. It's either the pin or the timing chain/tensioner.

Ok...

[Huggerorange73]

I chose this smaller cam to be on the safe side on PTV.

Something went haywire with the mechanical timing of this engine...big time.

[Huggerorange73]

Here's a couple of other little interesting facts to mull over.....

The week before the engine let loose, the output shaft of the transmission let loose on a 3K clutch dump. Is it possible that when the output shaft snapped the free wheeling engine got hurt?

When the trans was replaced, an underdrive pulley went on the car.

Prior to the transmission incident the car ran & performed flawlessly....

[Tantalizer43]

Hugger, the first time I met you was at the banquet. After your engine failure. And you STILL had a smile on your face, and were a blast to share dinner with. I couldn't imagine. You my friend, are a class act.

[GearheadSS]

That sucks but this is the risk you take when you mod the engine.

[SSBUSDRVR]

Here's a couple of other little interesting facts to mull over.....

The week before the engine let loose, the output shaft of the transmission let loose on a 3K clutch dump. Is it possible that when the output shaft snapped the free wheeling engine got hurt?

My brother and I used to race a '68 Camaro in the mid 80's. Put a bunch of $ into the 355 SB,Chassis,Rearend etc. Decided to save a few bucks and have the Turbo400 ManualVB/HiStall built by a local Tranny Shop instead of having the shop that built the motor take of it. They claimed it was "bulletproof" for the HP we were running out of the SB. The car ran mid 11's without hitting the funnygas. Planetary Gears seized Tranny detonated and car caught fire. End of the ropes. We sold the wreckage and the people that bought it claimed the engine was toast as well when it was "perfect" before the tranny blew. Who knows?

[PQ]

Originally Posted by 2010 SS RS

NGK 6 plugs have the tips protruding.. NGK 7 is cooler and the tips are flush.. With your blower you might want to go with the flush tips for added safety..just sayin

I just put TR6 plugs in the car a month ago. They were flush. Split tip but flush.

NGK 4177, TR6

Originally Posted by Huggerorange73

Here's a couple of other little interesting facts to mull over.....

The week before the engine let loose, the output shaft of the transmission let loose on a 3K clutch dump. Is it possible that when the output shaft snapped the free wheeling engine got hurt?

When the trans was replaced, an underdrive pulley went on the car.

Prior to the transmission incident the car ran & performed flawlessly....

Yup. I believe so. No load spinning can be hard on an engine. The sudden torque must be pretty violent.

[2010 SS RS]

Originally Posted by PQ

I just put TR6 plugs in the car a month ago. They were flush. Split tip but flush.

NGK 4177, TR6


Yup. I believe so. No load spinning can be hard on an engine. The sudden torque must be pretty violent.

I just edited my post..sorry for the confusion.. What I really meant was that you moved up one temp range from stock...Original gm part 12621258 or AC Delco 41-110 were range 5 equivelents. Moving up one temp range would be good to about 525 crank hp on ls3 or 500 crank on l99...Obviously its important to check for fouling and run as cool of plug as you can.. No real harm comes from being too cool (other than it will foul quickly) but too hot can cause serious engine damage...Kind of an expensive trial and error process changing out 7 dollar plugs to find the right temp but in the long run well worth it. I am moving to the 8IX to see if they stay clean from the standard NGK part number 3346 plugs BR7EF plugs After only 3000 miles.

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/product...x.asp?mode=nml

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/product...x.asp?mode=nml

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/product...r.asp?mode=nml

Look at the tips..huge difference..about 40 bucks more for a set though.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by 2010 SS RS

I just edited my post..sorry for the confusion.. What I really meant was that you moved up one temp range from stock...Original gm part 12621258 or AC Delco 41-110 were range 5 equivelents. Moving up one temp range would be good to about 525 crank hp on ls3 or 500 crank on l99...Obviously its important to check for fouling and run as cool of plug as you can.. No real harm comes from being too cool but too hot can cause serious engine damage...Kind of an expensive trial and error process changing out 7 dollar plugs to find the right temp but in the long run well worth it. I am moving to the 8IX to see if they stay clean from the standard NGK part number 3346 plugs BR7EF plugs After only 3000 miles.

You have a helluva lot more power than I do. I switched based on Owen at ARD advising me. Gapped them narrower too. He runs a lot of spray. I'll be between 650 and 700 crank horsepower after the cam. Vengeance still recommends the TR6 plugs. But I'll ask again.

[2010 SS RS]

Originally Posted by PQ

You have a helluva lot more power than I do. I switched based on Owen at ARD advising me. Gapped them narrower too. He runs a lot of spray. I'll be between 650 and 700 crank horsepower after the cam. Vengeance still recommends the TR6 plugs. But I'll ask again.

Not a problem PQ.. Just passing along our research...There is a lot out there on the subject of temp and HP gains. Technically you are up or going to be up 250 to 300 cHP so from the rule of thumb you should be somewhere between a 7 and 8. Added timing also plays into the factor and fuel... I am burning cooler fuel E85 which is less prone to detonation. Never hurts to double check something simple like this for sure.

[PQ]

Originally Posted by 2010 SS RS

Not a problem PQ.. Just passing along our research...There is a lot out there on the subject of temp and HP gains. Technically you are up or going to be up 250 to 300 cHP so from the rule of thumb you should be somewhere between a 7 and 8. Added timing also plays into the factor and fuel... I am burning cooler fuel E85 which is less prone to detonation. Never hurts to double check something simple like this for sure.

The TR6 is only one step cooler?