Free Tarball (or why you need a catch can)

[wakespeak]

I don't think oil in the intake will hurt the engine for non direct injected engines - but I do believe the oil in the intake charge affects octane. I had lots of pinging on premium before the catch can. The engine pulled timing noticeably. Idle was bumpy also before the catch can.

If you look at the design of the LS3 valley cover, Chevy has built in a trap, similar to a catch can, to help control the issue. It likely works fine for a lot of drivers. Looking at the history, the design followed oil consumption complaints of the LS1/LS2 engines.

The LS3 is not a direct injected engine, so fuel additives can help wash away deposits from oil. For direct injection engines, like the V6, I would be more concerned about the gumming up part. Mercedes and VW/Audi have had issues with intake valve deposits. I read a report that Mercedes did an analysis of intake valve deposits on the DI engines and most of it was due to viscosity improvers (a kind of plastic) that settled on the hot valves. And we all know about the top end "maintenance" needed for the V6.

[Warpaint69]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

take a sample of your used oil and let it sit for 3 years and see what it looks like.

ever buy a car that hasn't run for a long time, go to drain the oil and nothing comes out? sludged up. it happens

Just oil turning back to its natural state.

[PalmerGA]

Originally Posted by gajagfan

I like you are not a young man and with past experiences and the extensive dyno work I was involved with in my past employment, I have never seen any proof of any substantial benefit of parts like this.

Hey! 61 is the new 41!!!!

Seriously though, I've seen enough pictures of blackened caked valves and disgustingly oily heads to make me a believer in the positive effects of a Catch Can. Would my car run just fine (and for just as long) without one? I can't know. What I do know is that having a catch can installed on the PCV return line catches a fair amount of oily gunk which, if you let it sit for a while, turns into a multi-layered combination of cycled oil and condensation. I've seen it in my catch can and let it sit long enough to separate. I don't want that crap in my engine - period! If a quality catch can keeps most of it out, I'm all for it. Less than $200 for a lot of piece of mind.

[gajagfan]

Originally Posted by PalmerGA

Hey! 61 is the new 41!!!!

Seriously though, I've seen enough pictures of blackened caked valves and disgustingly oily heads to make me a believer in the positive effects of a Catch Can. Would my car run just fine (and for just as long) without one? I can't know. What I do know is that having a catch can installed on the PCV return line catches a fair amount of oily gunk which, if you let it sit for a while, turns into a multi-layered combination of cycled oil and condensation. I've seen it in my catch can and let it sit long enough to separate. I don't want that crap in my engine - period! If a quality catch can keeps most of it out, I'm all for it. Less than $200 for a lot of piece of mind.

It obviously is the right choice for you, and I like the whole 61 / 41 deal!

[speedygonzales]

We all know the V6's have direct injection and obviously have no "washing" effect to the valves. But what a lot of people may not know is it also sprays jets of oil onto the bottom side of the pistons to cool them. This will increase the amount of oil vapor in the crankcase which will increase the amount of oil in the PCV system. Making a catch can all that more important.

[PEW-PROFESSIONAL]

I have just over 11,000 on my 14' SS, I have a RX Catch Can on its way. would you recommend a intake cleaning done at the dealership prior or after Catch can install? Whats the cost of a intake cleaning? I'm not too big on the DIY version.

[Scott@Bjorn3D]

That does look funky. I have ran a catch can since getting my LS3 and have a gallon jug with about 1/2 of oil in it collected over the last 41K miles. No sludge in it.

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by gajagfan

We will stay stock through the warranty, and really the daily driver period as well. The point I was trying to make is that you never have been able to, and you never will be able to make a serious performance improvement to a car with simply bolt on things. The only $500ish improvement that makes a big difference is N20, and thats really only applicable to drag racing. I know head and cam packages are expensive ($3000 and up), void the warranty, require a tune and exhaust mods, but its the only way to get real power unless you want to go forced induction (turbos or supercharges.....big money as well). I just hate to see folks spend $700 or so the throttle controllers, CAI, and a catch can, and have done nothing to improve the output (ET's, lap times, HP) of there car. I guess today is my vent day, and I do agree its up to the owner, and what he wants may not be what i want, but facts are facts.

There is more to improving a car than ETs and HP gains. Those are valid goals for someone who tracks their car, but on a DD other things are important too.

CAI - I agree with you completely. For the money they cost, there really are no gains to speak of. People like to argue over which one is the best, but in reality, none of them are. They add a little sound and make you think of the old 4-bbl carb days and that's about it. No one ever discusses the actual filtering capability of these items, and that's probably the most important thing they do.

Vitesse Throttle Controller - It works. It may not add HP, but it sure makes the car a lot more fun to drive. If you've not experienced one, I highly recommend you try it. I cannot think of a better $180 mod for a daily driver. You may not gain any real HP, but it feels like you gained 100hp. If I got a new Camaro tomorrow, a VTC is the first mod I would make. For some reason, those who have never tried one tend to disbelieve... do yourself a favor and try one. They offer a money back guarantee. Can you name any other mod that does?

Catch Can - It doesn't add HP, but it keeps oil out of the intake. How can that be a waste of money? I do not have a CC on my Camaro, but I do ride a modified Harley. Harley Davidson uses a system of venting the crankcase into the intake. I have an aftermarket air filter on my bike (KN), and following a hard ride, there is oil gunk on the right side of my bike. No, it is not a small block chevy, but it is a push rod engine. It is a common problem with Harleys. Before the EPA came along, Harley used to just drain it onto the road. Draining it into the engine was not done for performance - it was done to satisfy the government. Same thing with autos.

And please don't take my post as argumentative. I enjoy your opinions and I value them. I have learned stuff from your posts. This is just a discussion, not a fight.

[JR 1]

Originally Posted by FASTDIESEL

Installed a Mike Norris can 500 miles ago. Just drained one oz. of oil of it, that "WOULD" have gone in my intake.

To each his own...... I like mine.

I never heard of a Mike Norris catch can. I would be interested in a Chuck Norris catch can though. I don't think it's enough to catch the sludge, you need to kick it's ass!

[gajagfan]

Originally Posted by Red2014SS

There is more to improving a car than ETs and HP gains. Those are valid goals for someone who tracks their car, but on a DD other things are important too.

CAI - I agree with you completely. For the money they cost, there really are no gains to speak of. People like to argue over which one is the best, but in reality, none of them are. They add a little sound and make you think of the old 4-bbl carb days and that's about it. No one ever discusses the actual filtering capability of these items, and that's probably the most important thing they do.

Vitesse Throttle Controller - It works. It may not add HP, but it sure makes the car a lot more fun to drive. If you've not experienced one, I highly recommend you try it. I cannot think of a better $180 mod for a daily driver. You may not gain any real HP, but it feels like you gained 100hp. If I got a new Camaro tomorrow, a VTC is the first mod I would make. For some reason, those who have never tried one tend to disbelieve... do yourself a favor and try one. They offer a money back guarantee. Can you name any other mod that does?

Catch Can - It doesn't add HP, but it keeps oil out of the intake. How can that be a waste of money? I do not have a CC on my Camaro, but I do ride a modified Harley. Harley Davidson uses a system of venting the crankcase into the intake. I have an aftermarket air filter on my bike (KN), and following a hard ride, there is oil gunk on the right side of my bike. No, it is not a small block chevy, but it is a push rod engine. It is a common problem with Harleys. Before the EPA came along, Harley used to just drain it onto the road. Draining it into the engine was not done for performance - it was done to satisfy the government. Same thing with autos.

And please don't take my post as argumentative. I enjoy your opinions and I value them. I have learned stuff from your posts. This is just a discussion, not a fight.

Not taken as argumentative,and you bring up good points. You also have a good understanding of what your mods are doing for you. I know that the only mods that are important to me are those that are performance related, but understand that others look at things differently, and that's just fine.
I am against spending money on things that do not offer any advantage, and I am afraid I put the catch cans in that category. Its a big profit item for those that make them, and as I mentioned before, with 200K miles on the last two cars and no issues, I can not bring myself to spend even $200, but if it makes others feel better then I am happy for them. It may be a bigger deal on the direct injected V6 cars, but that does not apply to me.
As far as the throttle controller, you and others feel it improves the drivability of your car, and if that is something you wanted to change, then it is a great investment. I am happy with our car, so I do not see a need for the change. Thanks for the great response!

[gajagfan]

Originally Posted by JR 1

I never heard of a Mike Norris catch can. I would be interested in a Chuck Norris catch can though. I don't think it's enough to catch the sludge, you need to kick it's ass!

Great response!

[Red2014SS]

Originally Posted by gajagfan

I am against spending money on things that do not offer any advantage, and I am afraid I put the catch cans in that category. Its a big profit item for those that make them, and as I mentioned before, with 200K miles on the last two cars and no issues, I can not bring myself to spend even $200, but if it makes others feel better then I am happy for them. It may be a bigger deal on the direct injected V6 cars, but that does not apply to me.

To be honest, I am struggling with the same thing on the catch can. Like I said, I think keeping gunk out of the intake is a good idea. Is it a $150 good idea? I don't know. This is why I don't have one yet. If I could get a good catch can for $50, I would already have one (and I have a feeling they could be sold for that amount and still make a profit).... As it is, there are a lot of other ways to spend $150 on my car, so a catch can will have to wait.

[GMTool]

Catch cans are a very cheap mod compared to what other things cost on cars. CC's are a good peace of mind. Changing engine oil or other fluids too often is peace of mind. Having a real spare tire is peace of mind, etc etc. That tar ball in the first post is bull. Get a cc or don't. It's not that big of a decision.

[el ess A]

Here's a picture of my 12k + mileage 2010 L99 I took when putting on my Bo White ported TB. Sure, low mileage, but it's pretty darn clean. I'm still going to put on a catch can on it eventually. Why? Because I can and you can't stop me. I believe in filtration of any type of oil vapors going back to the intake if it's reasonably possible. While it may not hurt it to not run one, having a little insurance is a good thing as well. Some of you that debunk the catch can also have mods I think are a waste of money as well, so we'll just call it even.



from the thread:
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=388262