the right blower

[cc-rider]

Originally Posted by blake-b

I'll probably never have a time slip for my turbo setup because there are no tracks around here. The closest one is an hour away and rumor is it is closing. Yes, I could travel to a track but then what about follow up runs to get seat time?

Timeslips are great if you can get them but some of us don't really have that opportunity. The top three turbo cars I can think of are DarthEmma's car, Mylftft, and SSMagna. They were all in the 9s or faster.

Let's also face it, a lot of people with fast cars aren't on the internet.

As stated, this has become a procharger vs vortech debate or a Ford vs Chevy debate.

This has become similar to a squat stance width debate. Narrow or wide? Who cares? Records have been set both ways. Run what you like.

Amen brother. All systems can be made to run fast. And not all fast cars are on the internet. Had the turbo boys not come on here and tried to claim all out victory and superiority I don't think this thread would have had quite the attention it got.

Lots of great choices...and there is no all out superior system. They all have their trade offs...and they are all bad ass!

[Naptime]

Originally Posted by Ret Fuzz

Here's what I have yet to see... A Turbo set up with Longevity. There are plenty of PDS with 50 or even 100k miles and still running strong , How many turbos can say that? Lines ,,,fittings scavenger pumps all I see is leaks.... Say its not true....

Spot on. Short and long term reliability are completely underemphasized when making a decision on a form of FI. It seems in most cases that people get a hard on for a number without thinking about the long term cost and experience of ownership.

That being said, there are probably 200 keyboard warriors that would post up that they have 200,000 miles on their twin turbo Corvette or F body and have had zero problems.

There are two problems with this: 1. They'd be lying 2. They don't really exist. The decision on a "best blower" argument is subject to the individual user. For me, a self contained Centrifugal blower makes the most sense from an abuse and upkeep standpoint. Typically installs with little or no hard modification and is easy to remove in the event of failure. Also, given the fact that your centri market offering is silo'd into a handful of major companies they user experience is improved through user feedback and number of users. It seems like in the turbo world, you have a few major players but you also have BOB's Turbos putting out a new kit everytime a car is introduced. These companies are erratic, spread too thin and typically poorly run from a business perspective. This is another main reason why doing business with Vortech or Procharger is preferred when making this investment.

Stop looking at overall horsepower and torque and consider the user experience for a moment. The decision becomes pretty clear at that point.


John

[Unreal]

Originally Posted by Ret Fuzz

Here's what I have yet to see... A Turbo set up with Longevity. There are plenty of PDS with 50 or even 100k miles and still running strong , How many turbos can say that? Lines ,,,fittings scavenger pumps all I see is leaks.... Say its not true....

Exactly why I like the AGP kit. There are several kits that make numbers and perform well. AGP is the only one I've seen with long term testing, and tons into long term reliability. All the parts are made to bolt on and go 100k+ miles. That is why they use OEM pump, high end lines/fittings, cast adapters, etc.

As for the fast list, a lot of people worked with what was out at the time, and the big money early adopters used what was out at the time. I know several of the fast people said if other options were out or if they could go back they would have done something else, but they worked with what they had available. AGP did 2+ years of R&D, tweaks, and testing before releasing the kit. If they just threw a kit out in a month, just whatever fit, there would probably be some more out there, but they spent time tweaking, revising, and updating molds for OEM quality fit/finish/reliability.

And there are plenty of PD blowers failing, bearing issues, rotors going out, etc. They are good systems, but they aren't bullet proof. I would put them on the same level of reliability as the AGP system. Other turbos systems, no idea, and I agree long term is an issue. That is why I don't like the welded together ones. I've never seen one of those last 100k.

[hammdo]

I would say that @ least the ADM LSA blower kit is a Factory GM kit designed to go 100K (especially the new blowers with the solid isolator). So all have tradeoffs, I chose the factory LSA for one big reason -- it was designed to go 100K with the ability to get the parts from my nearest GM Chevy dealer -- was not into the HP wars so I looked for a factory fit/finish -- I, for my personal reasons, decided on factory. If turbos -- can't argue with AGP -- top notch setup. If going SC, hard to beat the ADM LSA kit for price, install, fit, and finish...

-Don

[AGP Turbo]

This seems like a good time to point out that AGP has been building turbo kits for 15yrs and have built thousands and thousands of kits. Countless numbers of our kits have gone 100+k miles trouble free. I would wager we have more of our turbo kits trouble free with 100k+ than GM has trouble free ZL1's with 100k. This is why we cast all our components pre-turbo just like the OEMs. The heat cycles and stress relieving on welded together manifolds is what causes them to crack and warp. None of those problems exist with our cast components. So if you are looking for daily driven, proven reliability, we've got it here.

[CyberPredator]

Originally Posted by Ret Fuzz

Here's what I have yet to see... A Turbo set up with Longevity. There are plenty of PDS with 50 or even 100k miles and still running strong , How many turbos can say that? Lines ,,,fittings scavenger pumps all I see is leaks.... Say its not true....

My car was one of the first turbo camaros with the IPS kit. I have 40000 miles on my kit and 4 years of time without issue. Same turbos that made 589 at 6 psi when I first put on the kit now make 1145whp. Turbo kits, just like anything else, are often plagued with people taking the cheap route. I quite literally have 0 regrets with my kit. Towards the topic at hand their are plenty of great forms of FI and none are wrong. It's personal preference. People hate screw types and call them heat pumps and people hate turbos and call them laggy. Mostly it's conjecture because most people have only had the one they like. I'm surprised this thread is still going....

[Unreal]

6th gen Camaro available with a turbo, so GM must not be too worried about turbo setups. Plus long distance trucking industry is almost all turbo trucks that see more miles than just about anything.

[hammdo]

Won't argue on the AGP -- I would say though GMs research budget does help. Yes, the older ZL1s may have had issues, but lets not forget the LSA was also on the Caddies prior to the ZL1 and I'm pretty sure if you add those in, you'd find a few more 100k entries. True, Isolator issues, but those are correctable (as they have done now on the new SC). If you get the new ADM KIT, it has the updated SC with the Solid Isolator -- which the spring Isolator was the primary problem in the past.

As I stated, if turbo -- yep AGP, if SC -- can't go wrong with the ADM LSA for price and factory fit/finish...

-Don

[Ret Fuzz]

No Im stating Aftermarket Turbo longevity. They are like unicorns , Can't say they dont exist .... Just havent seen one.

[Unreal]

Originally Posted by hammdo

Won't argue on the AGP -- I would say though GMs research budget does help. Yes, the older ZL1s may have had issues, but lets not forget the LSA was also on the Caddies prior to the ZL1 and I'm pretty sure if you add those in, you'd find a few more 100k entries. True, Isolator issues, but those are correctable (as they have done now on the new SC). If you get the new ADM KIT, it has the updated SC with the Solid Isolator -- which the spring Isolator was the primary problem in the past.

As I stated, if turbo -- yep AGP, if SC -- can't go wrong with the ADM LSA for price and factory fit/finish...

-Don

100% agree
PD ADM
Centri ECS
Turbo AGp

You will like any of them, they all have plus and minuses.

[amerimuscle]

I'm surprised how long this went on also, I think I may start charging for ads on here lol

[10aSSee D]

Gotta love it!!

[bct10985]

I have had issues with my ecs kit so has my cousin with his agp kit. It happens to them all

[amerimuscle]

What problems did you have with the ecs kit? They're usually pretty top notch