Why turn off the "nannies" with normal driving?

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by jd10013

there are about 45k people that die in car accidents a year, and god knows how many hundreds of thousands (maybe millions) accidents a year. so yea, a lot will be the result of not having safety equipment, or not having it turned on. just like anything else in life, you can play the odds and probably win. but somebody, a lot of somebodies will loose, its statistically guaranteed. that's the kind of stuff you realize as you get older and it either happens to you, or people you know.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/car-cr...-statistics-2/

Drunk Driving 32 %
Speeding 31 %
Distraction 16 %
Bad Weather 11 %

90% of fatality crashes are accounted for right there. Those people aren't crashing because they don't have their nannies on. They're crashing because they are irresponsible drivers. So yes, you are correct that most people should leave their nannies on. If you're not going to take it seriously, then you'll be one of those "somebodies" as stated.

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

It only takes ONE TIME for a unexpected event to happen for you to appreciate any safety system on your car. Those that have not yet had that experience no matter how long they have driven cannot appreciate the effectiveness of the safety system. It's better to have them and not need them than need them and not have them or refuse to use them.

I feel this way about airbags, seatbelts, and crumple zones.

On another note, if you could take one pill a day that would reduce the possibility of you getting cancer by 75% would you take it or take a chance of never getting cancer on your own? I wish I could have 3 years ago. I never thought I would get it, yet I did. You may never think you will ever need a safety system but you never know what awaits you around the next corner...

I wish you could have had that pill as well. Your point implies, however, that wrecks just happen and there's nothing you can do about it but improve your chances. I just can't wrap my head around that mentality. I think maybe (my speculation here) people don't appreciate a car for what it is... a 4000lb deadly weapon. I'm sure this point will get thrown back in my face... "Why would you turn safety systems off on a deadly weapon?!?!", but my point is that these wrecks are at their core caused by negligence.

[thahemp]

This whole argument could be summarized as follows.

One is acting irresponsibly when...

Red Corner: He/she disables safety systems designed to compensate for under-skilled drivers.

Blue Corner: He/she fails to approach operating a vehicle with the care and attention that it deserves.

[SGOS252382]

My question is what is "normal" driving?
Unless "normal" driving included burnouts, drag racing, and all out aggressive drivng, I don't see a reason to turn the nannies off.

If "normal driving" is going to the store with your wife sitting next to you and your 3 month old baby in her car seat, I think the nannies should be used (they could possibly save your life/or someone elses).
And believe me, I've seen guys racing down the street with their baby in the car seat next to them.


The only time I turn my nannies off is when I'm racing (or practing launches, etc) I don't see any reason why I need to turn them off when I'm driving "normally." They have saved my axx on occasion.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by SGOS252382

And believe me, I've seen guys racing down the street with their baby in the car seat next to them.

Yikes. Where's a cop when you need one?

[jd10013]

Originally Posted by thahemp

http://www.statisticbrain.com/car-cr...-statistics-2/

Drunk Driving 32 %
Speeding 31 %
Distraction 16 %
Bad Weather 11 %

a bit misleading as all but the drunk driving could possibly be avoided with saftey feature. did you really expect a category for "has safety equipment but turns them off" that's why they say there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

[Mutant Racer]

Originally Posted by jd10013

there are about 45k people that die in car accidents a year, and god knows how many hundreds of thousands (maybe millions) accidents a year. so yea, a lot will be the result of not having safety equipment, or not having it turned on. just like anything else in life, you can play the odds and probably win. but somebody, a lot of somebodies will loose, its statistically guaranteed. that's the kind of stuff you realize as you get older and it either happens to you, or people you know. it's like someone else said with smoking. people have smoked 80, 90 years never to die from smoking related causes. that's how most young people justify it when they start. but as they get older and realize a great many people are dieing from it, far far far more than beating it....................they quit, or at least try to.

I read last week that fatal accidents have declined over the years until recently. The article didn't cite any specific reasons or even speculate as to why but one group hit hardest by it were teens. I think it was a nation wide study.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by jd10013

a bit misleading as all but the drunk driving could possibly be avoided with saftey feature. did you really expect a category for "has safety equipment but turns them off" that's why they say there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.

Haha. I'm not a huge fan of statistics as they are so easy to misrepresent, but they do paint a picture. I'll quote myself here. All including drunk driving could have been avoided by operating a vehicle with the care and attention it deserves.

Originally Posted by thahemp

This whole argument could be summarized as follows.

One is acting irresponsibly when...

Red Corner: He/she disables safety systems designed to compensate for under-skilled drivers.

Blue Corner: He/she fails to approach operating a vehicle with the care and attention that it deserves.

[jd10013]

Originally Posted by SGOS252382

My question is what is "normal" driving?
Unless "normal" driving included burnouts, drag racing, and all out aggressive drivng, I don't see a reason to turn the nannies off.

that's what people don't seem to, or want to understand. ST and TC are no different than ABS in their operation. they remain inactive until a particular set of variable is detected, and then they come on and effect your car. in the case of ABS, once the computer detects that a wheel is not moving, or is about to stop moving while the car is in motion it will kick in to prevent that.

With stabiltrack, it will remain inactive until the computer detects that you have lost control of your vehicle. this is pretty much determined when your computer detects that your car is moving in a different direction than your wheels are pointing, ie, skidding, sliding etc.

with traction control it will not come on till it detects that a wheel has lost traction.

it's really that simple. you can kind of make a case for turning off TC, as there are some situations where spinning a wheel isn't going to result in any ill results. but with ST, there is no reason you would need your car to travel in a direction different than you are steering it. and if your car is moving in a direction other than you are steering it then you are not driving normally.

[jd10013]

Originally Posted by thahemp

Haha. I'm not a huge fan of statistics as they are so easy to misrepresent, but they do paint a picture. I'll quote myself here. All including drunk driving could have been avoided by operating a vehicle with the care and attention it deserves.

from wiki:


Numerous studies around the world confirm that ESC is highly effective in helping the driver maintain control of the car, thereby saving lives and reducing the severity of crashes.[23] In the fall of 2004 in the U.S., the National Highway and Traffic Safety Administration confirmed the international studies, releasing results of a field study in the U.S. of ESC effectiveness. The NHTSA in United States concluded that ESC reduces crashes by 35%. Additionally, Sport utility vehicles (SUVs) with stability control are involved in 67% fewer accidents than SUVs without the system. The United States Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS) issued its own study in June 2006 showing that up to 10,000 fatal US crashes could be avoided annually if all vehicles were equipped with ESC[24] The IIHS study concluded that ESC reduces the likelihood of all fatal crashes by 43%, fatal single-vehicle crashes by 56%, and fatal single-vehicle rollovers by 77–80%.

Look, if you want to turn them off, turn them off. that's your right. But don't try to make it out that they don't work, are unnecessary, and anybody with even the most basic driving skills don't need. that's why people take issue with norm. he constructs these bizarre one in a million scenario's where not having them on might be beneficial, and then tries to use that as justification for not using them.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by jd10013

from wiki:


Numerous studies around the world confirm that ESC is highly effective in helping the driver maintain control of the car, thereby saving lives and reducing the severity of crashes.[23] In the fall of 2004 in the U.S., the National Highway and Traffic Safety Administration confirmed the international studies, releasing results of a field study in the U.S. of ESC effectiveness. The NHTSA in United States concluded that ESC reduces crashes by 35%. Additionally, Sport utility vehicles (SUVs) with stability control are involved in 67% fewer accidents than SUVs without the system. The United States Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS) issued its own study in June 2006 showing that up to 10,000 fatal US crashes could be avoided annually if all vehicles were equipped with ESC[24] The IIHS study concluded that ESC reduces the likelihood of all fatal crashes by 43%, fatal single-vehicle crashes by 56%, and fatal single-vehicle rollovers by 77–80%.

Look, if you want to turn them off, turn them off. that's your right. But don't try to make it out that they don't work, are unnecessary, and anybody with even the most basic driving skills don't need. that's why people take issue with norm. he constructs these bizarre one in a million scenario's where not having them on might be beneficial, and then tries to use that as justification for not using them.

I never said they didn't work, were unnecessary, and people with the most basic driving skills don't need them. As a matter of fact, I said the opposite.

Originally Posted by thahemp

So yes, you are correct that most people should leave their nannies on.

My point only slightly intersects with Norm's points. They DO rob you of the opportunity to experience certain situations. They ARE a band-aid for an irresponsible public. Generally speaking, our society trends toward dumber and less experienced. I suppose the only reason I'm even in this thread is because it irritates me that it is just accepted that people can't drive a car safely. That is complete nonsense. We are such a misguided society.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by thahemp

I wish you could have had that pill as well. Your point implies, however, that wrecks just happen and there's nothing you can do about it but improve your chances. I just can't wrap my head around that mentality. I think maybe (my speculation here) people don't appreciate a car for what it is... a 4000lb deadly weapon. I'm sure this point will get thrown back in my face... "Why would you turn safety systems off on a deadly weapon?!?!", but my point is that these wrecks are at their core caused by negligence.

You didn't get my point. Sometimes its not your negligence, There are wrecks that happen that with the help of stability control, and traction control could be avoided. You just never know when you may need it. Something could fall off a truck in front of you, maybe without stability control you could swerve and miss it without losing control, but stability control will assist you in that task. Not all accidents can be avoided by you. Someone running a redlight and you t-bone them or someone comes around that next curve passing someone and is still in your lane and hits you head on, both happen every day. You'll be glad you had airbags and seat belts. There are just some situations you cannot be prepared for.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

You didn't get my point. Sometimes its not your negligence, There are wrecks that happen that with the help of stability control, and traction control could be avoided. You just never know when you may need it. Something could fall off a truck in front of you, maybe without stability control you could swerve and miss it without losing control, but stability control will assist you in that task. Not all accidents can be avoided by you. Someone running a redlight and you t-bone them or someone comes around that next curve passing someone and is still in your lane and hits you head on, both happen every day. You'll be glad you had airbags and seat belts. There are just some situations you cannot be prepared for.

I mostly agree there Angrybird. Some incidents are much harder to prevent than others. I would not be following said truck so closely. Green light only means that I don't have to stop. Looking both ways has saved my skin more times than I can count. Shave your speed, choose a direction, and don't waiver for that guy that shouldn't have been passing where he was passing.

Watch people's heads on cross streets to decide whether or not they know you're coming. Avoid everything you even think is a dangerous situation. Watch the traffic behind you in your rearview and be ready to get out of the way if someone isn't paying attention and doesn't stop in time. The scariest "unavoidable" situation for me is when someone is waiting to turn left on a 4-lane road, and someone else is trying to turn left going the opposite direction. I just KNOW that other guy is going to pull out in front of me as I pass on the right and he doesn't see me coming. You can bet that I crawl through that intersection every time to make sure nothing bad can happen.

If you aren't prepared for every situation, then you can expect to end up in trouble. It's all about due diligence. I'm trying to teach my oldest daughter this concept currently and she thinks I'm nuts to expect her to think of everything.

BTW. I'm not singling you out.. or anybody else. Speaking generally.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by thahemp

I mostly agree there Angrybird. Some incidents are much harder to prevent than others. I would not be following said truck so closely. Green light only means that I don't have to stop. Looking both ways has saved my skin more times than I can count. Shave your speed, choose a direction, and don't waiver for that guy that shouldn't have been passing where he was passing.

Watch people's heads on cross streets to decide whether or not they know you're coming. Avoid everything you even think is a dangerous situation. Watch the traffic behind you in your rearview and be ready to get out of the way if someone isn't paying attention and doesn't stop in time. The scariest "unavoidable" situation for me is when someone is waiting to turn left on a 4-lane road, and someone else is trying to turn left going the opposite direction. I just KNOW that other guy is going to pull out in front of me as I pass on the right and he doesn't see me coming. You can bet that I crawl through that intersection every time to make sure nothing bad can happen.

If you aren't prepared for every situation, then you can expect to end up in trouble. It's all about due diligence. I'm trying to teach my oldest daughter this concept currently and she thinks I'm nuts to expect her to think of everything.

BTW. I'm not singling you out.. or anybody else. Speaking generally.

I can sum it up with one statement....Nobody is perfect, everyone either has or will make a mistake driving, It's only a matter of time.

[thahemp]

Originally Posted by Angrybird 12

I can sum it up with one statement....Nobody is perfect, everyone either has or will make a mistake driving, It's only a matter of time.

I can't argue with you there. My record isn't perfect... no matter how much I wish it were. All I can say is that I learned extremely valuable lessons from my prior transgressions, and they have made me into what I am today. Thankfully, I have never hit another car.