New throttle body spacer from Vararam - my thoughts...

[Jason@JacFab]

Originally Posted by axis

Even if it did help a little, I don't see 10whp worth of air being free'd up. It's going to have to be independently tested for me to believe it.

I completely agree... It's all smoke and mirrors until I see the results on MY car, or perhaps very similar results on a large ground of other people's cars... I almost never believe dyno sheets or power claims that come directly from the manufacturer...

[axis]

Originally Posted by IndeedSS1

If this works like I think, you should be able to remove your intake tube at the throttle body, turn the key on without starting, and have someone push the pedal all of the way down and have a look through into the intake manifold.

Sure you can have half of the $20.

Oh and you've missed out on the one intake better than the Halltech w/scoop by holding on to that VR grudge thing.

I understand the tilting it to be straighter, but I don't see how that translates into more air, especially on a NA car. I could almost see it on a FI car. Kinda like the plate they put under the GN intake manifold to keep the rear cylinders from running lean.

Somethings are just hard to let go. haha.

Originally Posted by BFASTNOTLAST

I'm following the compensation of tilting the TB but why not add to the area of the throat like the fast intake. Is there anything to be gained here with the old school thinking of added spacer to under the carb. Although Fuel injection may have no effect as to where the TB is or how far from the runners it is. Anyone have insight on this?

We can say it all day long. If you research it, you'll better understand the theory.

In short, the spacer on carbs was suppose to do two things. One, thermal barrier between the intake manifold and carb. Second, increase the distance to allow better atomization of fuel. Ask yourself if either of those pertain to a modern car using a intake plenum and injecting fuel right at the valves.

[14pilot]

Ok, based on what I'm reading here, this drawing is my interpretation of how this works. On the Left is a Black circle representing the OEM setup with the Throttle Blade (Red) at WOT. On the Right is the Throttle Blade at WOT after the Wedge is installed. The Throttle Blade being tilted to unmask the large Red area. Anyone else?

[BFASTNOTLAST]

Originally Posted by axis

I understand the tilting it to be straighter, but I don't see how that translates into more air, especially on a NA car. I could almost see it on a FI car. Kinda like the plate they put under the GN intake manifold to keep the rear cylinders from running lean.

Somethings are just hard to let go. haha.



We can say it all day long. If you research it, you'll better understand the theory.

In short, the spacer on carbs was suppose to do two things. One, thermal barrier between the intake manifold and carb. Second, increase the distance to allow better atomization of fuel. Ask yourself if either of those pertain to a modern car using a intake plenum and injecting fuel right at the valves.

So, your saying basically the FAST design was a waste?????? I guess it's in who you ask.

[IndeedSS1]

Originally Posted by 14pilot

Ok, based on what I'm reading here, this drawing is my interpretation of how this works. On the Left is a Black circle representing the OEM setup with the Throttle Blade (Red) at WOT. On the Right is the Throttle Blade at WOT after the Wedge is installed. The Throttle Blade being tilted to unmask the large Red area. Anyone else?

Your repesentation is what I'm gathering too. I can't wait to see the cutaways when available.

It seems if the blade doesn't fully open at WOT, then there will still be some restriction from the intake duct side.

[2010SLVRBULIT]

Is it even 1/4" thick?..I just don't see it making a world of difference...

[2SSRS@Gen5diy]

Originally Posted by BFASTNOTLAST

So, if the fast intake has 1 inch added to the neck to improve flow why not make this spacer much thicker than it is? What am I missing?

Here is what your missing, Have you seen a Vararam? if you did you we see that there is no room for a 1" spacer, so there is no need for it to be that long, You may not believe it, so hold on for the data to come out soon.

I will have it for sale soon.

Originally Posted by BFASTNOTLAST

I'm following the compensation of tilting the TB but why not add to the area of the throat like the fast intake. Is there anything to be gained here with the old school thinking of added spacer to under the carb. Although Fuel injection may have no effect as to where the TB is or how far from the runners it is. Anyone have insight on this?

^

Originally Posted by 2010SLVRBULIT

Is it even 1/4" thick?..I just don't see it making a world of difference...

Its lees the 1/4" thick..

[grocerygetter]

ok...I understand its straightening the throttle blade...but you guys did remember its turning the tb, right? that means the original angle is still there in relation to the TB. All you are doing is giving a place for air to turn right after the TB. So really you are bouncing more air than originally intended off the bottom of the intake manifold...which shouldn't be a big deal really but may make it tumble different at the back of the intake manifold.

[Jason@JacFab]

*EDIT* Disregard this post as it was accidentally posted too early, see my post below.

[14pilot]

Originally Posted by RacnJsn95

If someone can clarify the angle of the blade at WOT, I can draw this in AutoCAD and get some "perfect world" measurements of what's actually going on... The way I perceive the HPtuners thread is that the TPS doesn't necessarily show no throttle vs. WOT , but the angle of the blade, in this case, 88% of a 90° window of travel, which in theory would mean at WOT the throttle body blade is at a 10.8° pitch... If this is correct, I can draw this and take a linear measurement of how much blade actually moves out of the way with straightened. If I can figure the actual numbers I can test this on our SuperFlow flowbench, and see what, if any difference this would really make flow wise.

And for the guys running their Throttle Body flipped over for a NO2 plate, can you draw that too?

[2SSRS@Gen5diy]

Here is a pic before and after.

[Jason@JacFab]

Upon doing a little investigating, it looks to me like the throttle body blade is indeed rotated 90° in the throttle body at WOT. The way I perceived the HP tuners thread posted above what that the TPS doesn't necessarily read the range from Zero throttle to WOT, but the angle of the throttle body blade, in this case 88% of a 90° rotation, which would leave the blade at a 10.8° pitch off of 90°, which from the naked eye appears to be right there with the claimed 10° tilt of the GM intake at the TB mount. This is THEORY, I do not know if I am correct here, if someone can confirm I can draw this up in AutoCAD and get the actual measurement "in a perfect world" of the blockage by the TB blade not being perfectly straight.

However if you compare the stock intake tube incoming angle to the throttle body, it matches that angle, so in theory, the incoming air is not hindered by the angle of the throttle body blade without the spacer... It does however direct the incoming intake air toward the floor of the intake manifold... Is this a problem? I don't know...

Do aftermarket intake systems follow the same angles as the stock system? I don't know. This could potentially help most aftermarket systems if it corrects the blade angle to the angle of the tube... However, this may make no effect, or ever hurt the performance of the stock air intake system as it now makes the air blockage effect of the blade worse than it may have been in the beginning...

Again, this is THEORY, but it looks like a pretty good one to me according to the pictures below. I

*The picture of the throttle blade straight on, is an attempt at what would be 90° dead straight on (as if with most aftermarket intakes I have seen in pictures) , not tilted to see straight in.

[litle88]

Lmao!!!
Why only Dyno numbers?!
Take all of these different damn CAI's and "polished TB's" and now the almighty "super wedge" to the damn track! That's where the REAL numbers are, not the mustang or the dyno jet dyno's. Those are TUNING tools. PERIOD

[VADER SS L99]

If a non biased non affiliated 3rd party person shows a true 10RWHP I'll buy it. I am very skeptical at this point however and like many others I'll have to see it to believe it.