What do you want?

[Punk_rider]

Ho, and I want a GT550 KILLER , not fighter

[Angrybird 12]

I think many on here are wanting the Camaro to be what was called back in the day a COPO car...
One you could order direct from the factory with all the racing goodies on them, all you needed to know was the correct order codes when you ordered your new car...

ID chart for the 69 Camaro
http://www.camaros.org/diffs69.shtml

[boxmonkeyracing]

well I'm sure most of you know what I'm going to say...

33k-35k starting price (if ss starts at 26-27k).
base
ls3 + cam 450-480 hp is great
full exhaust
double adjustable shocks all 4 corners
bigger breaks
beefier suspension
race seats
carbon fiber where possible

has same base features as SS

other options would include weight savings
AC delete
power steering delete
radio/nav delete (get rid of that big brother button, onstar)
etc etc etc


Also I know for a fact only a handful of people really care if the Z28 returns. I say this because the ones that do care don't really care if it's 500 hp or not but would like to see it pay homage to it's heritage. The others that just want a GT500 fighter/killer wot not don't care what it's call, but believe it will be the z28 so they are begging for it. Those people would be happy with a ZL1 (so would I) or copo or whatever just as long as GM offers them a 550+hp camaro. . .

[Matster]

IMO what we are looking for is the next generation of Z28 that would represent its next step in evolution. Make a lot of the non-performance things, such a/c an opt in or opt out with the main focus being on light and fast. Start with bare bones light and fast at a reasonable price and make the shopping list of option more about the weight your adding to the car, rather than what your adding to the price.

[Matster]

I know it probably somewhere else here in another thread but I'm too lazy to go and look. If I bought a crated LS7 would it even fit into the SS?

[Supermans]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

well I'm sure most of you know what I'm going to say...

33k-35k starting price (if ss starts at 26-27k).
base
ls3 + cam 450-480 hp is great
full exhaust
double adjustable shocks all 4 corners
bigger breaks
beefier suspension
race seats
carbon fiber where possible

has same base features as SS

other options would include weight savings
AC delete
power steering delete
radio/nav delete (get rid of that big brother button, onstar)
etc etc etc


Also I know for a fact only a handful of people really care if the Z28 returns. I say this because the ones that do care don't really care if it's 500 hp or not but would like to see it be homage to it's heritage. The others that just want a GT500 fighter/killer wot not don't care what it's call, but believe it will be the z28 so they are begging for it. Those people would be happy with a ZL1 (so would I) or copo or whatever just as long as GM offers them a 550+hp camaro. . .

It would be nice to see a Z28 and I agree with you, it doesn't necessarily have to have 500 HP however that would be the number I would shoot for in order to compete with the GT500 (even if it is only numbers since the Camaro will have IRS and be more nimble around a track). With all the technology added to it that you are describing, it would be amazing if the price didn't jump $10,000 over the SS's base price. I do believe the price of the Z28 would still have to be less than a base Corvette by enough of a margin to make it appealing to the hardcore. If the Z28 is able to beat the base Corvette at track times, then it seems reasonable to price it the same, however it wouldn't be smart for GM to do that and take away from Corvette sales..

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by Mindz

I never said we had to rename the poll (who wants a Z28 vs. Who wants a GT500 killer), did I. I was just pointing out that it was a huge majority right off the bat that I feel just wants a powerful engine and say they want a Z28.


If you're alluding to my thought process, then I'll say it so there's no confusion. I'm curious as to:

How many people that are in the Z28 camp actually want a heritage Z?
How many people want a higher hp engine and think the Z's the last nameplate possible so you're routing for the Z even if it goes against the heritage?

I'm not upset or irked at anyone. I just want to know who's on the bandwagon and who truly cares for it. This has been a very touchy subject and there's many people just along for the ride. Pardon if I seemed to come across in any way other than how I have just explained.

I'm just not sure people will be able to rationalize it that way.

In fainess I'll use myself as an example

When asked, What should happen to the Z28 in the 5th Gen?

Perfect world: Z28 should be the touring car that holds the heritage of the 1st Gen

Compromise: Model the Z28 after the CTS-V, G8-GXP etc. That way we get the name and the GT500 killer.

Last resort: Make it an option to buy z28 badges just so I can add them to my collection.

Personally what Camaro do you want?

Perfect World: I will buy a GT500 Killer, and I don't care what it's called Zl1,Z28, bubba... whatever.

Compromise: Any Z28 Cus I know it will carry with it the heritage just by virtue of the name.

Last resort: Gladly buy the current SS and love every minute of it.

Those are my honest answers. But, they do show a conflict. When I think of the camaro as a product I tend to lean towards tradition. When it comes to that car I want then I move away from tradition. This is why I think you comment is unfair? (not the right word). IMO we need to address the Z28 on two levels Every ones Camaro and Your Camaro.

Yes... No.....

[Shifty 6]

I fully agree that light makes right. However, how much weight are you looking to pull out of the Camaro? Its the safety stuff that is adding a lot of the weight. You may be able to pull some of the air bags, but to delete A/C, radio, seats, sound deadening, carpet, thinner glass, lighter dash, smaller fuel tank, less oil in the engine....sorry I was getting carried away there. This is 2008, we can have all those items because we can get so much more power, look at BMW X6, their new SAV. That thing runs pretty well, and it weighs a metric ton. The reason guys pulled all those things out in the past, it was easier, we weren't coddled, and they didn't have to do a ton of engineering and testing to get 5 more hp. Now we can get all the hp we want and deal with the weight (with in reason) and it can still handle fairly well.

I'm just saying let's not throw the baby out with the bath water. personally, I would rather see the LS7 in a Z. (I'm considering getting one from Katech, but there is an expense issue. Can I really justify peanut butter and jelly for my family till the day we die? The 3 year old says YES!!!) I like the idea of leaving the supercharger to the mustang. It seems too easy to get the hp, with the LS7, it seems like there is more engine building, and less enhancement. A good example is the "tuner" crowd. They add a coffe can muffler, ginormous wing, and a "NOS" sticker on the air box and think they have a hyper-performance machine.

Just my 2 cents I guess.

[Black5thgen]

So here's my idea. With the mustang offering a boosted V6 engine as an alternative to the V8 GT, why not offer a turbo V6 direct injected 3.6 in the camaro and make it a Z28. Add in some weight reduction and I think that would follow the Z28 heritage better than a heavy high horse V8. It would be a lighter, high reving track car. Make the top dog the ZL1.

[Robert91RS]

Ok, looks like we all kept our calm last night! Way to go guys! As far as the LS7 goes, that would be great. Yes It would fit, but it is being discontinued so we should probably move on. We want our Camaro to be affordable so we need an engine already around or being started. That leaves LSA, LS9, LS8 becauce if we are going to get a car it won't be a lesser model than our current SS. Let's not get too caught up in the way we ussed to do things when gas was less than a dollar and CAFE regulations decided what we could buy. I believe, and it sounds like the majority of you do too, that the niche we have for a car in the Camaro line up today is for a GT500 fighter. So lets say that's what we are talking about now. Would it be so bad to call a GT500 KILLER the Z/28? We want the name for it's sentimental value, and a 550hp Camaro would surely strike fear into the hearts of ricers and pony boys alike! Your thoughts?

[Moose]

I didn't vote for a couple of reasons;

1. While I'd love to see the return of the 'Z28' to the Camaro lineup, personally, I'm happy and content with GM's decision to bring the Camaro back. Sure, I'd love an "all conquering" Camaro, but there's "always going to be someone out there faster than you", so I'm content with the HP numbers of the 5th Gen. SS.

2. I'm certain there are going to be dealers, ie; Berger, Tom Henry, as well as aftermarket companies, ie; GMMG, SLP, offering upgrades for the new Camaro, enabling it to perform "on par" with the GT500, etc..

The Z28 moniker is a special designation for a special Camaro. I'd personally prefer to see GM offer a 5th Gen., without all the "bells and whistles", with the emphasis on peformance and less weight, for a 5th Gen. Z28.

[Robert91RS]

Thanks for stopping by and voicing your opinion Moose!
Just for the record, if SLP or someone similar produced the "Monster Maro" I wouldn't complain. Another thing to consider and discuss. It would be good for Camaro sales and we would still get the car we are lookig for.

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by Supermans

It would be nice to see a Z28 and I agree with you, it doesn't necessarily have to have 500 HP however that would be the number I would shoot for in order to compete with the GT500 (even if it is only numbers since the Camaro will have IRS and be more nimble around a track). With all the technology added to it that you are describing, it would be amazing if the price didn't jump $10,000 over the SS's base price. I do believe the price of the Z28 would still have to be less than a base Corvette by enough of a margin to make it appealing to the hardcore. If the Z28 is able to beat the base Corvette at track times, then it seems reasonable to price it the same, however it wouldn't be smart for GM to do that and take away from Corvette sales..

the gt500 starts out at 42,000$ and has IRS. and if we were to lose 200-300 lbs magically in the camaro keep the hp around 450-480 who would need 500 to run circles around the gt500. HP numbers don't mean squat if you can't get it to the ground.

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Skyman 08

Not voting because my choice which is widely known is not on the list.

But to restate it simply...
Heritage wize the Z-28 is a road course warrior, NOT a DRAG CAR... so if a Z were to return it should take over the slot that the SS is now occupying, with a few more suspension upgrades to make it handle even better.
If anything the SS should be bumped up to the Lightweight Drag car with the highest HP engine you are able to stuff between the fenders..

I'm completely with Skyman 08. If we're bringing back a heritage car, we should bring it back using that heritage. The Camaro was designed to compete with the Mustang, but the Z28 wasn't designed to compete with the GT500. I wouldn't object if that's the path GM decided to take, but I think that a drag-ready, lightweight Camaro would better fill the role of Z28 than something designed to compete with a limited-production Ford.