Gas Guzzler tax? - Page 5 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

carman · 03-10-2009, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobby35ny

ok TOUCHE for everyone....

Back the the question, The G8 GXP and the Camaro have very similar drivetrains. I'm wondering what put the G8 GXP over the hump for the guzzle tax?

=bobby

I just don't get it. 150# and slightly more agressive gearing and the G8 GXP gets not a gas guzzler tax that exceeds the Shelby GT500 and SRT-8 Challenger??????

Tal · 03-10-2009, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmyers

Thats not necessarilty true. It used to be the case but not any more. The 08 Z06 (pictured below

) has skip shift and there was no gas guzzler tax. The 09 Z06 is the same car, but it gets the Gas Guzzler tax. Go figure!

From Chevrolet.com:
2009 Corvette Z06 gets an EPA estimated MPG 15 city, 24 highway. Even with its impressive performance, the engine does not incur a federal government gas-guzzler penalty.

There are numerous other sources that say the same thing, in my searching on this I found a few forum posts claiming otherwise but those same forums had people that said they purchased a 2009 Z06 with no GG tax. Looked up the window sticker to a local dealer's Z06 and no GG either.

camaro5 · 03-10-2009, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tal

The Camaro is just barely going to avoid the GG Tax, so the weight probably put the G8 GXP over the hump, and since it was already over

GM went with more aggressive gearing to gain a little acceleration and losing a little more mpg

, AFM for the Camaro SS A6 that isn't availible with the GXP, and there were quite possibly some other small tweaks were done to squeak past the GG Tax.

The reason the G8 GXP gets a gg tax is in bold above.

rmyers · 03-11-2009, 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tal

From Chevrolet.com:
2009 Corvette Z06 gets an EPA estimated MPG 15 city, 24 highway. Even with its impressive performance, the engine does not incur a federal government gas-guzzler penalty.

There are numerous other sources that say the same thing, in my searching on this I found a few forum posts claiming otherwise but those same forums had people that said they purchased a 2009 Z06 with no GG tax. Looked up the window sticker to a local dealer's Z06 and no GG either.

I stand corrected. I was certain that when i compared the 08 and 09 pricing...there was a GG tax. Thanks for the clarification.

cmanatam · 03-13-2009, 08:54 AM

I know that there are other threads involving this but I wanted to pose the question again in light of data provided at the end of the Powertrain training vid posted on here recently. According to the video, manual SS (LS3) gets 15/22 mpg (city/hwy). Several formulas posted on the site suggest that this comination does not meet the minimum weighted average mpg to avoid the tax. I'll repost the formula below for verificaiton but should I take Chevy's word that the GGT will still be avoided and that the provided numbers from the vid are conservative or should I start to worry about having to pay the tax...

Formula: [1/(.495/Citympg+.351/Hwympg)]+.15 >= 22.5 to avoid tax...

According to the vid, the formula yields 20.577..17/23 is the closest combination that satisfies the formula but I don' think the vid would be that conservative...

trm0002 · 03-13-2009, 08:58 AM

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

Forget the formula. Honestly, I don't care how they worked around it (or actually made it). Scott Settlemire said NO GUZZLER TAX. IMO, God may as well have said it. It will NOT be on the sticker

Silver Streak · 03-13-2009, 09:02 AM

not again!

cmanatam · 03-13-2009, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trm0002

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

Forget the formula. Honestly, I don't care how they worked around it (or actually made it). Scott Settlemire said NO GUZZLER TAX. IMO, God may as well have said it. It will NOT be on the sticker

LOL, ok you win...unless its on the sticker then I have to change faith in light of Scott being wrong...which will be a sad day

Regardless, I've driven sticks all my life and have consistently sucked about 2-3 mpg more out of the car than posted on the sticker so it shouldn't matter (just don't wanna give the gov. any more of my dollars when i could put it towards some sweet 'maro accessories

)

Tal · 03-13-2009, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmanatam

I know that there are other threads involving this but I wanted to pose the question again in light of data provided at the end of the Powertrain training vid posted on here recently. According to the video, manual SS (LS3) gets 15/22 mpg (city/hwy). Several formulas posted on the site suggest that this comination does not meet the minimum weighted average mpg to avoid the tax. I'll repost the formula below for verificaiton but should I take Chevy's word that the GGT will still be avoided and that the provided numbers from the vid are conservative or should I start to worry about having to pay the tax...

Formula: [1/(.495/Citympg+.351/Hwympg)]+.15 >= 22.5 to avoid tax...

According to the vid, the formula yields 20.577..17/23 is the closest combination that satisfies the formula but I don' think the vid would be that conservative...

I've posted that formula before, but after looking in more detail at how the mpg's are calculated I believe that formula is rather flawed. I believe CityMPG*.61 + HighwayMPG*.59 >= 22.5 is much closer to what is needed, even this is a bit rough but it should be close.

*GTAHVIT* · 03-13-2009, 01:50 PM

Don't flame the guy... help him out.

Find the thread he's looking for or should have looked for and a mod will go all mergy and all is well.

*GTAHVIT* · 03-13-2009, 02:01 PM

merged btw....

UCF w00t · 03-16-2009, 12:47 PM

Just to kill this thread once and for all...

LS3... (16/.9)*.55 + (24/.78)*.45 = 23.6MPG > 22.5

Bell040 · 03-16-2009, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UCF w00t

Just to kill this thread once and for all...

LS3... (16/.9)*.55 + (24/.78)*.45 = 23.6MPG > 22.5

to further kill the issue...

03-13-2009, 08:54 AM	#61
cmanatam Drives: 2010 Camaro 2ss #1758 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Fort Worth Posts: 50 View My Garage	Gas Guzzler Tax??? I know that there are other threads involving this but I wanted to pose the question again in light of data provided at the end of the Powertrain training vid posted on here recently. According to the video, manual SS (LS3) gets 15/22 mpg (city/hwy). Several formulas posted on the site suggest that this comination does not meet the minimum weighted average mpg to avoid the tax. I'll repost the formula below for verificaiton but should I take Chevy's word that the GGT will still be avoided and that the provided numbers from the vid are conservative or should I start to worry about having to pay the tax... Formula: [1/(.495/Citympg+.351/Hwympg)]+.15 >= 22.5 to avoid tax... According to the vid, the formula yields 20.577..17/23 is the closest combination that satisfies the formula but I don' think the vid would be that conservative... __________________ Ordered:2010 2SS LS3 Black/Black Interior 20"Painted Aluminum Wheels Order Date: 10/13/2008 Moved to 3000: 2/19/2009 Moved to 3300: 3/9/2009 TPW 3/23/2009 VIN: 2G1FT1EW8A9101758!

03-13-2009, 08:58 AM	#62
trm0002 VIN #2G1FT1EW6A9100074 Drives: 2010 CAMARO 2SS/RS RJT VIN 00074 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Buffalo,NY 'burbs Posts: 4,193	NO NO NO NO NO NO NO Forget the formula. Honestly, I don't care how they worked around it (or actually made it). Scott Settlemire said NO GUZZLER TAX. IMO, God may as well have said it. It will NOT be on the sticker __________________

03-13-2009, 09:02 AM	#63
Silver Streak Drives: 2008 Cobalt SS/TC Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: New Smyrna Bch. Florida Posts: 1,449 View My Garage	not again! __________________ *"What? You wanna lay the fate of the world on that kids Camaro? That's cool!"* *"The future is in the windshield, not the rear-view mirror!"* *"If you haven't gone a 175 mph on land, you haven't lived! That's just a fact!" - Ricky Bobby*

03-13-2009, 01:50 PM	#66
GTAHVIT Blessed Drives: 2013 Sonic RS MT Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saint Augustine FL Posts: 28,441 View My Garage	Don't flame the guy... help him out. Find the thread he's looking for or should have looked for and a mod will go all mergy and all is well. __________________ Click image to see build thread. PQ - "the love of cars. It's a boys first step toward manhood and a mans last hold on boyhood." Fbodfather - "We do not want to use the Z28 moniker on a car that does not deserve this hallowed name." The_Blur - "Let's not confuse competitors with equals."

03-13-2009, 02:01 PM	#67
GTAHVIT Blessed Drives: 2013 Sonic RS MT Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Saint Augustine FL Posts: 28,441 View My Garage	merged btw.... __________________ Click image to see build thread. PQ - "the love of cars. It's a boys first step toward manhood and a mans last hold on boyhood." Fbodfather - "We do not want to use the Z28 moniker on a car that does not deserve this hallowed name." The_Blur - "Let's not confuse competitors with equals."

03-16-2009, 12:47 PM	#68
UCF w00t Geek Drives: IOM 2010 Camaro 2SS Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Orlando Posts: 4,451	Just to kill this thread once and for all... LS3... (16/.9).55 + (24/.78).45 = 23.6MPG > 22.5

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