Why would I want a Z/28 over the ZL1?

[mkorgan]

Originally Posted by MIZL1

GM should have put more separation between the 2 cars especially for the money.

I love both cars but I could not agree more with this statement. No, it is not sour grapes. I have a ZL1 which I do not feel I have to justify one bit. I would love to have a Z/28 but honestly I do not see it being that much better than the ZL1 to justify dumping the one I have to pay a premium for something so similar.

[omegaman]

Honestly, I would love to own a Z/28...with A/C and more than one radio speaker. I've become a softie as I've aged. Pathetic.

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by avcbm

please don't add to my question.... I wasn't interested in longevity..... just if it the tires would make a difference....

Don't be snappy if you don't understand. Yes the tires on the Z/28 are made for the track with a very very low treadwear rating. They are very sticky, but they HATE a cool damp track(hence the reason it loses almost 7 seconds when the rain ramped up). Those same tires on the ZL1 will have a shorter life hence my longevity comment.

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by mkorgan

I love both cars but I could not agree more with this statement. No, it is not sour grapes. I have a ZL1 which I do not feel I have to justify one bit. I would love to have a Z/28 but honestly I do not see it being that much better than the ZL1 to justify dumping the one I have to pay a premium for something so similar.

That's exactly the reason GM offers both. They are two Camaros built for completely different purposes. It's really not that hard to understand. The ZL1 is a great car. It does it all. The Z/28 is a great car with a very focused use. In the end it appears you made the right choice for you, be happy.

[avcbm]

Originally Posted by 2cnd chance

Don't be snappy if you don't understand. Yes the tires on the Z/28 are made for the track with a very very low treadwear rating. They are very sticky, but they HATE a cool damp track(hence the reason it loses almost 7 seconds when the rain ramped up). Those same tires on the ZL1 will have a shorter life hence my longevity comment.

I wasn’t being snappy, unfortunately tone when writing cannot be conveyed sometimes…. Thanks for the reply by the way…. I understand where you coming from… but not to be picky, I wasn’t really asking about tread wear….. Also, I do understand the Z/28 should run a faster time in more favorable conditions…. But and how much time could be gained by the ZL1 with the same tires on the Z/28, hypothetically that is…. I was hoping someone that does a lot of road racing with experience could chime in on life experience and give an upfront honest answer on the importance of better tire and grip…. Could the ZL1 run faster on the track with the amazing tires on the Z/28?

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by avcbm

I wasn’t being snappy, unfortunately tone when writing cannot be conveyed sometimes…. Thanks for the reply by the way…. I understand where you coming from… but not to be picky, I wasn’t really asking about tread wear….. Also, I do understand the Z/28 should run a faster time in more favorable conditions…. But and how much time could be gained by the ZL1 with the same tires on the Z/28, hypothetically that is…. I was hoping someone that does a lot of road racing with experience could chime in on life experience and give an upfront honest answer on the importance of better tire and grip…. Could the ZL1 run faster on the track with the amazing tires on the Z/28?

It's all good!
It will be a very hard guess due to too many variables. Pete from Pedders mentioned something in another thread if I can find it I'll make a link.

[avcbm]

Originally Posted by 2cnd chance

It's all good!
It will be a very hard guess due to too many variables. Pete from Pedders mentioned something in another thread if I can find it I'll make a link.

Thanks...

[islander033]

Originally Posted by Whos_Drivin

...Then again, there's always...
Mustang: 50% hillbilly, 50% vag

I agree with the hillbilly/redneck stuff, but I like 100% vag not <50% like you. lol

[NightmareZL1]

Originally Posted by 2cnd chance

If you own a ZL1 I'd say that is a HUGE case of sour grapes. If you don't I'd say you need to educate yourself.

You can say whatever you wish. I will wait until a reviewer puts the same rubber compound on both cars and runs them.

Until then, all I here from you is "blah blah blah, I wish I had a Z28"

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by NightmareZL1

You can say whatever you wish. I will wait until a reviewer puts the same rubber compound on both cars and runs them.

Until then, all I here from you is "blah blah blah, I wish I had a Z28"

And what happens if no one does? Will you still whine on C5 about what if this and what if that?

[CobraBall]

Originally Posted by DrkPhx

Specific to the wet lap (or partial wet lap); don't you think after 10 hours and 1,000 miles on the track they would have at least 1 hero run on a dry track recorded? That does seem odd they would mention the quicker run; yet not record it. We can speculate all we want; but the lap time stands until they record a better time. Rules of the 'Ring, right?

It's odd, yes, but there's no way that wet lap was the best lap recorded or truly indicative of what the car is capable of. In the last third of the lap, the car was obviously a handful because of the conditions.

You can say whatever you wish. I will wait until a reviewer puts the same rubber compound on both cars and runs them.

Until then, all I here from you is "blah blah blah, I wish I had a Z28"

As opposed to "OMG, blah, blah, blah, the cars have to be absolutely identical otherwise it's not a fair comparison!"? That sounds like hurt pride to me.

So, if we can bump up the ZL1's tires, can we also mod the Z28 to make up for the 70 hp deficit here? Afterall, we're trying to even up the comparison, right? That is what you're trying to accomplish by swapping out the ZL1s tires, correct? Isn't fair to bump up the Z28 to ZL1 power levels then?

Do you see the ridiculous slippery slope you create here when you start modding cars in an attempt to make them equal for comparison sake? They'll never be equal and that's not the point. You can mod anything to be fast. The only true, valid comparison is showroom stock vs showroom stock.

[noah677]

Originally Posted by AirBull

After seeing the new Z/28 Nürburgring time at 7:37.4 compared to the ZL1's 7:41.3, I'm not terribly impressed with 3.9 seconds on a 13 mile track, for all that one gives up and pays more for, compared to that of a ZL1.

First off, nobody has seen the Z/28's straight acceleration times yet, 0-60, 1/4 mile, 0-100, and when they do, my guess is that it will be lucky to even keep pace with the ZL1. Despite the 300lbs weight savings, the Z/28 produces 505hp & 481lbs/ft torque (somehow 11lbs/ft more than the Z06?), for a total of 75hp & 76lbs/ft of torque less than the ZL1.

Sure, it's got a 3.91:1 rear axle compared to that of the 3.73:1 in the same manual transmission ZL1, but that's 75hp and lbs/ft of torque less than the ZL1! And what all do I have to give up in order to drive a Z/28?

First I have to pay more. GM sells the LS7 crate motor minus the dry sump for iabout $17k retail, compared to that of the LSA which retails for just under $14k. Sure, the Z/28 has carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes (not ideal for street use) but come on, the ZL1 still has very stout Brembo brakes, (which per GM's new ZL1 parts counter says the front and rear retail for $9,647 combined!) The Z/28 gets a little larger wheels and tires (which the star pattern looks like they were stolen off a Mustang and are horribly ugly in my humble opinion,) but as far as go-fast components, that's it.

Now I'm one of the LS7's biggest fans and love the hand-built motor in the 3150lbs Corvette Z06, but it's not doing it for me in the Camaro.

On top of that, to own a Z/28 I have to forgo the very useful and functional 3rd generation magnetic ride suspension, HID headlights, a radio, and A/C is optional?! Same goes for the tire-inflator kit, interior sound deadener and carpet in the trunk, smaller LN3 battery, and 2/10's of a mm thinner rear glass (really?)

If I wanted to build a track car, couldn't I do so for a lot less than the $65k to $70k a Z/28 is going to go for? For just a few fractions of a second less in road-course performance figures (not straight line,) I'll take the ZL1 with all the modern, real-world amenities that we have come to almost take for granted such as A/C, premium radio, navigation, etc., and scratch my head every time I see a Z/28 at a car show and say to myself "to each their own!"

Am I wrong here? Am I the only one who sees the new Z/28 and am just not that impressed? For me, the new Z/28 maybe more expensive than the ZL1, but the ZL1 is still King of the Camaro, and I'm fine with that.

IMHO YOU NAILED IT. I absolutely totally agree with you. Lately BM has been making some huge mistakes--at least short term. Add to what u said a c7 with 460HP and u have BM with its pants down. There is no excuse for the Z28. Sure in TWO YEARS u will see some sort of other vette models. I have owned about every vette since 1974 (10++) including the zr1- now that is a VETTE, I love that car and it proves that BM can do it. Therefore there is excuse for the Z28 and current c7. You can flame me BUT YOU DO NOT have much ammo to do so

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by avcbm

Thanks...

I found Pete's comments. Post #13.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=323616

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by NightmareZL1

You can say whatever you wish. I will wait until a reviewer puts the same rubber compound on both cars and runs them.

Until then, all I here from you is "blah blah blah, I wish I had a Z28"

Yeah it was you.