Painful topic, could use some advice....

[DkknightX]

Originally Posted by 1320junkie

Ok just my take, I think the guy is already regretting not having insurance and he has accepted responsibility for his actions of letting his father drive it. So what he is wanting advice on is what he should do with the car now. I think he is focusing on the future and not the past.

I agree, junkie. That information is really irrelevent at this point. Idea 3 would be the way to go. It would be quite a reclamation project, especially if you could mod it out and then do some side by side before and afters. If you are a gearhead, which is sounds like you might be, idea 3 all the way man. Sorry you have to go through this but I (and probably most of C5) would be extremely interested to see it repaired. Good luck!

[67 Convertible]

Originally Posted by bolteon593

as long as you have insurance on a car (any car) your covered by it when you drive someone elses car.

But this isn't someone else's car. Don't the father and son own this car together? Therefore Dad was driving his own car at the time of the accident.....please correct me if I'm wrong.

In Massachusetts, I am covered when I drive someone else's car because I have other vehicles insured, but if I'm driving my own car with no insurance, tough luck, I would not be covered.

And if the police responded to my accident, I would have be ticketed or possibly arrested for driving an uninsured vehicle.

[bolteon593]

Originally Posted by 67 Convertible

But this isn't someone else's car. Don't the father and son own this car together? Therefore Dad was driving his own car at the time of the accident.....please correct me if I'm wrong.

In Massachusetts, I am covered when I drive someone else's car because I have other vehicles insured, but if I'm driving my own car with no insurance, tough luck, I would not be covered.

And if the police responded to my accident, I would have be ticketed or possibly arrested for driving an uninsured vehicle.

it was never stated that theyre both on the title... again, were going off of what we know here.


being that he didn't mention his dad getting a ticket when the cops showed up; i would imagine that he isn't the owner.

[Hopkinator]

Originally Posted by Diabel1969

for 1, and for 2, with no insurance on it, it has a clean title, no salvage cert, and no carfax damage to it. Paper wise, it's still a brand new, never been smashed car, and if fixed properly, will retain that status. Which is what the body shop guy is thinking I believe.

I bought something like that once . I wasnt happy when I found out the true history, in the form of "slight frame damage" which you said this one has.
The damage you have described obviously is in excess of the amount required by law to disclose. You yourself have stated it is "obviously totaled".
You are treading on tricky ground here . Say the new owner somehow through the VIN or a friend one day reads these posts and takes it to law enforcement after you have had it repaired and passed it off with a clean bill of health. Be a shame for Johnny Law to come calling because some guy that just dropped most of his 401K on his dream car finds out he bought a salvage car with a clean title.. . If the new owner took it to the cops, Youve already established enough for the state to rest on , with this thread alone.
I see 2 viable options here. Sell As-Is. The other and best option is to document every repair with photographs and reciepts , then sell. You dont have to worry about the law , or Karma , both of which can be a bitch...

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by bolteon593

good sir, i beg to differ.


maybe this is different in other states, but as far as the ones i've lived in (michigcan for a bit and california mostly) as long as you have insurance on a car (any car) your covered by it when you drive someone elses car.


otherwise, when renting a car; you'd be forced to buy seperate insurance to cover yourself as the car's title certainly doesn't get signed over to you when you rent it.


unless i'm mistaken for the state concerned, most all types of insurance policies cover you regardless of what car your driving.

ie... if your driving a friend to the hospital in their car; and you get in an accident, your covered.


for the most part, insurance isn't really to insure the car; it's to insure the driver of the car. (otherwise, you wouldn't get severe discounts with multiple cars on a single policy... mainly due to the fact that you can't drive more then one car at a single time).

Originally Posted by ssump29

what you said is not true. If his father had an insurance policy of his own on any car that he owns, it will be his fathers insurance company that will cover the damages. This situation is no different then one renting a car and not getting the rental car companies insurance because they have their own. The father would need to turn this in to his insurance company. He would pay a little more because the car is not on the policy but they would cover the car that he damaged. His policy thereafter will surley go up but none the less his fathers insurance company will cover it.

This happened to me while driving my brothers car, my insurance company covered all the cost of the damages. I took the hit on my policy going up though.

Originally Posted by bolteon593

agreed!


better knowledge for the win! i figured that a price hike in the dads premium will happen but in the end it'll go away in 2 years and in the mean time the car will be replaced as new.

win win win. (as long as dad had some insurance on something with 4 wheels that is...)


//edit


and @ rouge leader; you might want to be a bit more careful about stating things the way you do. reading your post sounded like you def know what your talking about and the poor guy could have taken it as axiom (and been screwed out of a lot of money thanks to it too).

just a suggestion.

You might wanna be a bit more careful about making accusations that I don't know what I am talking about.

I was up until 2 years ago a licensed insurance agent in 40 states. so I DO know what I am talking about.

While the coverage is designed to cover you, insurance follows the vehicle. You are covered for your car, or if you rent a car, as well you are covered for excess if you borrow someones insured vehicle beyond what their policy covers.

You however are NOT covered for collision if you borrow and do not own a car. Insurance is for the protection of YOU and your insurable interests. When you buy an auto insurance policy you are paying to insure property that you own or have an insurable interest in (such as if you lease a car you still have insurable interest even thought he bank owns it). The difference if you're buying a car is you do have insurable interest there, if the title is in your posession (say you are buying a car from a guy one town over and you drive it home from his place without registering it or calling your company, that IS covered because you have insurable interest).

A car you borrowed form someone with no insurance on it will not be covered.

Now I will admit to being slightly wrong here, as ssump you are in Michigan which has some whacked out insurance laws. But the only reason your policy covered the car is because it was insured in the first place. Also were you on the same policy or a subset of the same policy as your brother at the time?

The OP is from NY. This does not apply. He has no coverage for it except for the situations I mentioned as per NYS insurance guidelines.

Before you make suggestions get your facts straight, or call your insurance company for clarification.

[TJ91]

Rogue leader, whats your suggestion for him?
I hope he can get his car fixed asap
If the op says no to the insurance scam out of morality, then the op should say no to the scam of fixing it and selling it with a clear title.
Id rather rob from the insurance company who robs you then from another innocent person trying to get a great car.
Say no to both those options, try to get your fathers insurance company tocover it or call your insurance company and tell them the situation. You never know what theylll say. They might just cover it, i presume its insured, just for fire and theft?

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by TJ91

Rogue leader, whats your suggestion for him?
I hope he can get his car fixed asap
If the op says no to the insurance scam out of morality, then the op should say no to the scam of fixing it and selling it with a clear title.
Id rather rob from the insurance company who robs you then from another innocent person trying to get a great car.
Say no to both those options, try to get your fathers insurance company tocover it or call your insurance company and tell them the situation. You never know what theylll say. They might just cover it, i presume its insured, just for fire and theft?

IMO I would just eat it and get dad to pay for at least part of it.

And I wouldn't call my insurance company at all. Once you call them they keep records, even if they pay nothing (and in this case they won't pay anything). You don't even want them to know about it.

[Diabel1969]

Originally Posted by Rogue Leader

You might wanna be a bit more careful about making accusations that I don't know what I am talking about.

I was up until 2 years ago a licensed insurance agent in 40 states. so I DO know what I am talking about.

While the coverage is designed to cover you, insurance follows the vehicle. You are covered for your car, or if you rent a car, as well you are covered for excess if you borrow someones insured vehicle beyond what their policy covers.

You however are NOT covered for collision if you borrow and do not own a car. Insurance is for the protection of YOU and your insurable interests. When you buy an auto insurance policy you are paying to insure property that you own or have an insurable interest in (such as if you lease a car you still have insurable interest even thought he bank owns it). The difference if you're buying a car is you do have insurable interest there, if the title is in your posession (say you are buying a car from a guy one town over and you drive it home from his place without registering it or calling your company, that IS covered because you have insurable interest).

A car you borrowed form someone with no insurance on it will not be covered.

Now I will admit to being slightly wrong here, as ssump you are in Michigan which has some whacked out insurance laws. But the only reason your policy covered the car is because it was insured in the first place. Also were you on the same policy or a subset of the same policy as your brother at the time?

The OP is from NY. This does not apply. He has no coverage for it except for the situations I mentioned as per NYS insurance guidelines.

Before you make suggestions get your facts straight, or call your insurance company for clarification.

I just talked with the insurance company, they took about an hour to research all the fine print, and came back saying SOL.. so.. hey, didn't hurt to ask!!! Thanks for the idea though!

[Diabel1969]

Originally Posted by TJ91

Rogue leader, whats your suggestion for him?
I hope he can get his car fixed asap
If the op says no to the insurance scam out of morality, then the op should say no to the scam of fixing it and selling it with a clear title.
Id rather rob from the insurance company who robs you then from another innocent person trying to get a great car.
Say no to both those options, try to get your fathers insurance company tocover it or call your insurance company and tell them the situation. You never know what theylll say. They might just cover it, i presume its insured, just for fire and theft?

Just to set the record straight, my intention wasn't to fix and sell as a "clean" car.. My intentions are.

1: sell as is, meaning drivetrain condition unknown, not able to roll.

2: pull subframe, replace subframe, pull cradle straight, re-weld LF strut tower, spot in new rad support, replace broken wheel and tire/broken suspension parts, make run and roll, then sell NOT COMPLETED, but all HARD work complete. I'm a bug and would document all steps for potential buyer to see how it was repaired. I've NEVER sold a vehicle that wasn't 100% what I say it is, and won't start now

3: do step 2, and complete, but while drivetrain is down, mod it..

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by Diabel1969

I just talked with the insurance company, they took about an hour to research all the fine print, and came back saying SOL.. so.. hey, didn't hurt to ask!!! Thanks for the idea though!

And thank you for proving I know what I'm talking about.

That said I'm sorry for your loss, just a shitty situation, I hope you can get her fixed up and back on the road.

[extremepcs]

I'm wondering if his father had full coverage insurance, wouldn't it cover any car he was driving? It'd be worth looking in to anyway. I seem to recall that applying to rental cars... your insurance would cover any damage.

EDIT - Sorry, didn't see the posts above about insurance. That bites. They'll do anything possible to not pay out, while happily taking your cash each month.

[djinva]

Originally Posted by Diabel1969

I just talked with the insurance company, they took about an hour to research all the fine print, and came back saying SOL.. so.. hey, didn't hurt to ask!!! Thanks for the idea though!

Did you talk with your Dad's company and explain he was the driver and there is no collision coverage in force? Here in VA he could use his collision coverage for a non-owned vehicle. His collision deductible would apply. This may not apply in your state. Every state is a different.

[Rogue Leader]

Originally Posted by djinva

Did you talk with your Dad's company and explain he was the driver and there is no collision coverage in force? Here in VA he could use his collision coverage for a non-owned vehicle. His collision deductible would apply. This may not apply in your state. Every state is a different.

It extends to rental cars... thats it

[bolteon593]

Originally Posted by Rogue Leader

It extends to rental cars... thats it

i mentioned in my post i might be wrong due to other states having different rules when it comes to insurance coverage...


you on the other hand throw information out there as fact and dont bother to mention that yes in fact you have the professional qualifications to state the facts...

it would help if you at least identified yourself, or as i suggested just suggest the ideas.

being less of a reactionary would help also.