Mustangs................

[GatorBlue371]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

He's right. The powertrain won't be the cause of any weight increases. I wouldn't expect any cosmetics to be heavier than they currently are. There might be safety equipment changes in the future, but the Mustang has otherwise managed to present itself as the low-weight entry into the pony car wars. There's nothing we can say to dispute this. Hopefully, GM manages to keep the Camaro ahead with better gearing, ratios, performance, or future weight reduction.

Competition is a good thing. Let's not get defensive over it.

[Supermans]

I think its good for the pony wars. I just hope this means we get to see a 28, however I am doubtful...

[GatorBlue371]

The Z28?



GM wants to build it, just having trouble ensuring its a good idea. Not helping that they went under but it COULD happen I guess.


Honestly Id rather they charge 10k more for the same engine and come back -800lbs because they built the whole thing out of lightweight materials.


As for the SS... as nice as its going to be for the 5.0L to have a 300lb weight adv. and basically beat the SS in 0-60 and 1/4, my guess is that 426hp! looks better than 400hp! which will result in more sales. And if that doesnt do it the SS is still infinately better looking. Just have to live with Stock out of the box being a tick slower. Guess this is what the SRT boys feel like. - the good looks.

[Hesh]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

Your not really understanding. They'll likely be moving to a new platform by the time the standards are needed. If they are never needed on this generation, then it is a waste of money to even upgrade it. simple as that. Right now they are already in the positive image in that it meets and exceeds all current standards.

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

And why would that be? The new engine is said to be lighter than the outgoing 4.6. The transmission is only 8 lbs. heavier according to Tremmec. How much more do you honestly think the brakes will weigh, assuming they upgrade those?

I keep reading different opinions on this its just going to be a revised platform or a new platform has yet to be said. Depending on financial situation at the time will see where it goes. One upgrade is needed by 2012 the side curtain air bags. The roof struture is by the 2017. Also the post about the 5.0 lighter than the 4.6 has been brought up here by the same person who started this thread. SYR was stating it will be a little heavier than the 4.6, but not by much. So with the few upgrades for the 5.0 id say it will be closer to 3700 than 3600lbs. So Gator Im with you between those numbers....lol.

[Super83Z]

Originally Posted by THE EVIL TW1N

And why would that be? The new engine is said to be lighter than the outgoing 4.6. The transmission is only 8 lbs. heavier according to Tremmec. How much more do you honestly think the brakes will weigh, assuming they upgrade those?

Is that including clutch assembly? The clutch and pp will have to be upgraded. I bet Ford will offer a revised (bigger) tire and wheel combo to get more on par with the Camaro. Unless they are completely stupid other things will be upgraded to handle the new power(suspension/chasis/brake parts). Those will undoubtedly add some weight. I Say the car will gain about 100lbs.

[Teleplayer]

Sorry, but the interior of the GT is superior to the Camaro. And the visibility is better too. I just drove both cars and that is my opinion.

[hiway61revisted]

Originally Posted by Teleplayer

Sorry, but the interior of the GT is superior to the Camaro.

sorry but your the one who is wrong

[Teleplayer]

Originally Posted by hiway61revisted

sorry but your the one who is wrong

So you're either blind or haven't actually looked at both.

[Andro]

I tear came to my eye

[TheClassicCarKid]

Originally Posted by Teleplayer

So you're either blind or haven't actually looked at both.

hey, it's all about personal preference.
I've ridden in a top of the line Mustang GT and didn't like the interior nearly as much as the Camaro's.

[Jekyll-N-Hyde]

you know its great to have an opinion we all have them.
The best part about an opinion is they are like A$$holes everyone
has one and some stink

[syr74]

Originally Posted by truth411

One thing everbody seems to forget is.... wait for it.... PRICE POINT!!!!! the V6 mustang which is the back bone of mustang sales (not the GT) is only $655 cheaper than the LS camaro. IF the old cheap 4.0 truck V6 is replace by a far more expensive 3.7 V6 and 6 spd transmissions, it will mean that for the first time in history (I could be wrong but I think I am right) The camaro will have a price advantage over the Mustang!! Was that not one of the mustangs key advantage compared to its competitors? A sporty car with a lower price point than its competitors?

We haven't forgotten, it just isn't likely to be the issue many seem to believe right now. The 3.7L is absolutely far more advanced than the old 4.0L unit that Ford is phasing out, but engine design and tech is far from the only issue at work here. The 4.0L V6 was built in a German facility, and for those who know the costs of manufacturing in Germany that says it all. The German union commands wages the UAW only dreams about, and benefits are just as ridiculous. Factor in the cost to ship the 4.0L from Germany by slow boat and the cost of producing the 4.0L V6 was far from a dream scenario. In fact, the 4.0L V6 only stayed in production as long as it did as a placeholder production piece intended to give Ford time to figure out a solution to a very sticky union labor issue in the German market.

Originally Posted by Truth411

2. This goes for camaro fans aswell as mustang loyalist, This is the 21st century, performance does not mean just striaght line acceleration. If you take the V6 camaro and a 3.7 V6 mustang to a track the V6 mustang would get slaughtered, there is not a track pack for the V6 (which would increase the V6 price even further). I highly doubt the 3.7 V6 mustang will Stop or handle even close to the V6 camaro. Even if the V6 mustang is close to a 13 sec. car, on a road course it will loose badly to the V6 camaro. which leads me to..

I think you are being overly optimistic here to say the least. The first generation S197-based V6 Mustang was offered with a handling package long before the Track Pack was even conceived. Even more, while the Mustang GT will apparently gain something like 25-40lb the V6 model will absolutely drop weight, all of it off of the nose, giving us a better balanced, 275+hp car which weighs less than 3400lb. Many beleive the Mustang V6 will be the handling surprise of the 2011 lineup. Anything can happen, but this one could be very interesting.

Originally Posted by Truth411

3. Ford knows it's fan base, and it's fanbase are heavily into drag racing and only care about straight line acceleration and thats it. I am not saying this is true for all mustang owners of course, but it is the truth. One of the main reason the mustang still uses the SRA is because their fan base want to keep it for..... Drum roll..... DRAG RACING!!! I think the Mustang is a drag car first, track car second, while the camaro is a Track car first, drag car second.

I think the Track Pack handily scraps that notion. And since the Track Pack appears very likely to be the basis for the standard GT suspension setup in 2011 I would argue that Ford agrees.

Originally Posted by Truth411

4. I think this is how Chevy should market the Camaro, Kids these days care more about handeling than just straightline speed. The V6 camaro shows that it has the superior chasis, read the V6 reviews.

Again, I disagree. Consistently the Mustang is praised as having phenomenal steering in every respect, phenomenal turn in, excellent grip, a great chassis, and good chassis dynamics. I would argue that the mahority of reviews give the impression that the Mustang is a sort of luxo-muscle cruiser while the Mustang comes across as more of a modern take on the classic American GT.

Originally Posted by Truth411

5. I think the v8 Mustang and the V8 camaro are going to be pretty close stock for stock, But the reason I am going to buy the Camaro SS because the LS3 is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar more mod friendly compared to any DOHC V8 out there for the money mod for mod. Didn't American racing headers acheive a 50 rwhp increase from nothing more than adding long tube headers and a tune!!! I will search for it but I think they retained the stock mufflers, so lets think about that for a moment... 50 rwhp, The LS3 just loves mods. From what I have seen it is very possible for the Camaro SS to be a 420+rwhp car with NOTHING BUT STANDARD BOLT ONS!! (CAI, Headers, Exhaust, Tune) that is just incredibly value for the money. I highly doubt the same will be for a 5.0 Mustang, but we shall see.

Supposedly the 5.0L V8 has proven extremely tunable with nothing more than bolt ons, apparently this stems from the reality that the engine is very detuned even in Mustang GT trim. In stock trim I suspect the Mustang GT is going to be an easy 12 second car, and I likewise suspect that the engine will be able to crak 500hp at the crank with nothing more than a tune and exhaust mods, but that is just my opinion on the issue.

[Grape Ape]

Originally Posted by truth411

5. I think the v8 Mustang and the V8 camaro are going to be pretty close stock for stock, But the reason I am going to buy the Camaro SS because the LS3 is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar more mod friendly compared to any DOHC V8 out there for the money mod for mod. Didn't American racing headers acheive a 50 rwhp increase from nothing more than adding long tube headers and a tune!!! I will search for it but I think they retained the stock mufflers, so lets think about that for a moment... 50 rwhp, The LS3 just loves mods. From what I have seen it is very possible for the Camaro SS to be a 420+rwhp car with NOTHING BUT STANDARD BOLT ONS!! (CAI, Headers, Exhaust, Tune) that is just incredibly value for the money. I highly doubt the same will be for a 5.0 Mustang, but we shall see.

An aftermarket cam will certainly cost a bit more since there would be 4 of them, but the install will be a lot easier (just pull the cam covers, leave the radiator in place).

But as to making power with mods, didn't I see a thread around here about the Cadillac guys get something like an extra 40hp out of the (DOHC) LLT with just an intake manfold (+ an exhaust?) and no tune?

Originally Posted by syr74

Supposedly the 5.0L V8 has proven extremely tunable with nothing more than bolt ons, apparently this stems from the reality that the engine is very detuned even in Mustang GT trim. In stock trim I suspect the Mustang GT is going to be an easy 12 second car, and I likewise suspect that the engine will be able to crak 500hp at the crank with nothing more than a tune and exhaust mods, but that is just my opinion on the issue.

I don't know how anyone could know how the 5.0 would respond to bolt-ons since they haven't shipped? Is Ford already lending pre-production 2011s to the aftermarket?

[syr74]

Originally Posted by Grape Ape

I don't know how anyone could know how the 5.0 would respond to bolt-ons since they haven't shipped? Is Ford already lending pre-production 2011s to the aftermarket?

Strictly the result of internal testing involving 'variations' of the production theme if you will. Response to basic, bolt on mods will not be an issue.