Passenger seat modification ?

[Toasty]

Originally Posted by rayhawk

If you designed this car it would weigh 12,000 lbs at that rate!

Sorry, just giving you a hard time.

Haha... Just these spacers. I'm concerned about the shear strength of the bolts against the tube wall

[TooCool5]

Originally Posted by rawj7

I'm 5'7 and I have road in her a few times and the seat really is way to low, My Wife is 5'1 and she complains also. I really hope they make a fix for this. It WOULD be the first Mod I would do. I just hope it comes soon and with GM's Blessing.

GM has left us holding the bag....They won't come up with a fix, and they will not comment on any of our modifications posted here. This is understandable due to liability, but look at it from a consumers view!
COME ON GM!

[sprtplt]

Just looking at the lifting mechanism on the passenger seat in my Silverado, the attachment points to the seat and to the car are nothing complex. There must be a way to use the assembly from some other car on the Camaro pass seat. Maybe the one from the Corvette?

[Toasty]

Originally Posted by TooCool5

GM has left us holding the bag....They won't come up with a fix, and they will not comment on any of our modifications posted here. This is understandable due to liability, but look at it from a consumers view!
COME ON GM!

fbodfather himself has said, (as best he can) that they are working on this, and it would end up being a retrofit available to prior years, but I have no idea how soon that will be, but it's a complex system.

Originally Posted by sprtplt

Just looking at the lifting mechanism on the passenger seat in my Silverado, the attachment points to the seat and to the car are nothing complex. There must be a way to use the assembly from some other car on the Camaro pass seat. Maybe the one from the Corvette?

the problem that you will run into is that the motors/mechanism are likely part of the seat frame itself. if you go messing with the seat frame/cushion, you could mess up the airbag stuff. The beauty of the mod posted a few posts back with adding spacer between the rails and the seat frame seems to be the 'safest' route at this point.

[Unfair]

Originally Posted by caverman

Everyone hang in there. Don't take a chance as screwing something up or voiding your insurance/warranty.

I specifically talked to FBodFather about it last week when he was in town for the TX State Fair. He said GM is working on it and that they will have a retro fix for those that don't have it. He said there is around 800 sensors in the seat and that they have to go through all new saftey crash testing. He also said there is one for leather seats and one for cloth seats (leather=heated seats; cloth=not). Sounds like it's going to be an electric adjustment not manual...otherwise why would the leather/cloth make a difference. He also mentioned the fact that there will probalby be memory seats in the future and they will be standard in 2SS/2LT models. No mention of when we'll see it but my guess is that this stuff won't be available until they get 2011 ready...just guessing though.

I've even considered putting off my order for a little bit but I'm just getting to ansy....I'l just have to see how I can retro fit those into mine once they are available.

Ahhh.....memory seats I'm going to need those (I'm 6'5"...wife 5'4").

There are 800 sensors in the seat? I find that hard to believe, EIGHT HUNDRED?

[Toasty]

Originally Posted by Unfair

There are 800 sensors in the seat? I find that hard to believe, EIGHT HUNDRED?

fbodfather said 800, so it's 800. that's all I need to know

[dickholloway]

Originally Posted by Unfair

There are 800 sensors in the seat? I find that hard to believe, EIGHT HUNDRED?

There are 800 excuses GM won't ever address this design problem for the 2010.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by TooCool5

GM has left us holding the bag....They won't come up with a fix, and they will not comment on any of our modifications posted here. This is understandable due to liability, but look at it from a consumers view!
COME ON GM!

Ok, here is my comment..............DON'T DO IT!!!!!!!!

What are you hoping for, that someone would come on here and give an official critique of these spacers and bolts you are jury rigging and tell you it is ok or not ok? They won't because you simply shouldn't do it.

This is a complex system, more so than you are thinking. And by making what appears to you to be a very simple change, you are converting your car from one that does meet all FMVSS safety standards in to one that may or may not meet them. And I hope you don't find this out, but if you are in a crash, you will only get one test of your system to find out if your engineering works or not.

Don't get me wrong, it's Mrs. Number 3's number one complaint about the Camaro. She is 5'2" and just doesn't enjoy riding in a Camaro simply because she can't see over the I/P very well.

So let's put it this way, I'm an engineer and I've done a lot of seat, restraint and crash testing in my career and I wouldn't even think of making these changes to a Camaro.

Sorry if I'm coming off like a.............oh, I guess there is no smiley for that.

Originally Posted by Unfair

There are 800 sensors in the seat? I find that hard to believe, EIGHT HUNDRED?

There is a matt in the passenger seat cushion and yes it is an array of many small sensors. So 800 could be about right.

Originally Posted by Toasty

fbodfather said 800, so it's 800. that's all I need to know

Originally Posted by dickholloway

There are 800 excuses GM won't ever address this design problem for the 2010.

won't ever? That's a very long time.

Originally Posted by Chief Blackhawk

I dont even think there are 800 sensors on the car. Maybe he confused something.

As stated, it is a bunch, maybe not exactly 800, but a bunch.

[TooCool5]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Ok, here is my comment..............DON'T DO IT!!!!!!!!

What are you hoping for, that someone would come on here and give an official critique of these spacers and bolts you are jury rigging and tell you it is ok or not ok? They won't because you simply shouldn't do it.

This is a complex system, more so than you are thinking. And by making what appears to you to be a very simple change, you are converting your car from one that does meet all FMVSS safety standards in to one that may or may not meet them. And I hope you don't find this out, but if you are in a crash, you will only get one test of your system to find out if your engineering works or not.

Don't get me wrong, it's Mrs. Number 3's number one complaint about the Camaro. She is 5'2" and just doesn't enjoy riding in a Camaro simply because she can't see over the I/P very well.

So let's put it this way, I'm an engineer and I've done a lot of seat, restraint and crash testing in my career and I wouldn't even think of making these changes to a Camaro.

Sorry if I'm coming off like a.............oh, I guess there is no smiley for that.




There is a matt in the passenger seat cushion and yes it is an array of many small sensors. So 800 could be about right.







won't ever? That's a very long time.



As stated, it is a bunch, maybe not exactly 800, but a bunch.

Here is my problem with your statement and I am a former Automotive Quality Engineer, the drivers seat raises and lowers with all 800 sensors and conforms to FMVSS safety standards, the drivers seat height lever raises only the rear portion and everyone sitting in the seat is of different heights, I do not see why raising 1" in the passenger seat rail height effects anything and I prefer to raise just the rear seat rails using grade 8 (12.9) 10 X 1.5 metric bolts 2 1/8 long.
My real problem is GM probably has a seat test machine and could prove this out in less than a week and submit for an engineering change.
My only concern is that the seat stays anchored in a crash duplicating the OEM setup. But they will not proceed on this as it is probably going to turn into some moneymaking thing, to correct their insufficient design.

[Toasty]

Originally Posted by TooCool5

Here is my problem with your statement and I am a former Automotive Quality Engineer, the drivers seat raises and lowers with all 800 sensors and conforms to FMVSS safety standards, the drivers seat height lever raises only the rear portion and everyone sitting in the seat is of different heights, I do not see why raising 1" in the passenger seat rail height effects anything and I prefer to raise just the rear seat rails using grade 8 (12.9) 10 X 1.5 metric bolts 2 1/8 long.
My real problem is GM probably has a seat test machine and could prove this out in less than a week and submit for an engineering change.
My only concern is that the seat stays anchored in a crash duplicating the OEM setup. But they will not proceed on this as it is probably going to turn into some moneymaking thing, to correct their insufficient design.

nobody ever said that the passenger seat could not move in order to comply. the concern is that any modification to the seat assembly as provided from the factory MAY NOT then comply with those standards. ...the current FMVSS standards that were tested against the current passenger seat were done as the assembly is designed. if you change ANYTHING on the assembly, that certification may be VOID. I see what you're saying, but to say with certainty that your mod doesn't affect anything with regards to the certification, without actual proof isn't fact.

not that I won't do something like you've done, but to each their own, ya know.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by TooCool5

Here is my problem with your statement and I am a former Automotive Quality Engineer, the drivers seat raises and lowers with all 800 sensors and conforms to FMVSS safety standards, the drivers seat height lever raises only the rear portion and everyone sitting in the seat is of different heights, I do not see why raising 1" in the passenger seat rail height effects anything and I prefer to raise just the rear seat rails using grade 8 (12.9) 10 X 1.5 metric bolts 2 1/8 long.
My real problem is GM probably has a seat test machine and could prove this out in less than a week and submit for an engineering change.
My only concern is that the seat stays anchored in a crash duplicating the OEM setup. But they will not proceed on this as it is probably going to turn into some moneymaking thing, to correct their insufficient design.

Sorry but you are way of base here. It rakes a lot more than what you are describing to validate this change. You aren't simply confirming the quality of a part. You are validating a vehicle system under a wide variety of conditions that have to be considered by every OEM,

I know many of you will continue to over simpify this issue so that you can feel ok about making this mod.

My points are as follows

1. Don't

2. It takes time and is more complex than you all are thinking to engineer, test and put this change in to production.

Point 1 is my opinion take it for what it's worth to you. Point two is simply the facts of the situation

[dickholloway]

Instead of all the bitching about one of numerous design/cheap things GM did to the 2010 camaro lets do this:

1. find a lawyer in the camaro5 group who will devote a little time to drafting a letter to GM (and FHSSA sp?)
2. have the letter state to GM that the design of the seat is unacceptable to female passengers and represents sexual discrimination. It's true
3. unless a solution to this discriminatory act is released within 60 days to the dealers, further publicity/legal action on GM's conduct will be taken.
4. letter signed electronically by all the guys on camaro5 (and gals who have short husbands or boyfriends or both )

standup for your rights, you paid good money for this car!!!

ok, any lawyers who will help?

[monstertodd]

Originally Posted by dickholloway

Instead of all the bitching about one of numerous design/cheap things GM did to the 2010 camaro lets do this:

1. find a lawyer in the camaro5 group who will devote a little time to drafting a letter to GM (and FHSSA sp?)
2. have the letter state to GM that the design of the seat is unacceptable to female passengers and represents sexual discrimination. It's true
3. unless a solution to this discriminatory act is released within 60 days to the dealers, further publicity/legal action on GM's conduct will be taken.
4. letter signed electronically by all the guys on camaro5 (and gals who have short husbands or boyfriends or both )

standup for your rights, you paid good money for this car!!!

ok, any lawyers who will help?

Surely you can't be serious?

[67 Convertible]

Originally Posted by dickholloway

Instead of all the bitching about one of numerous design/cheap things GM did to the 2010 camaro lets do this:

1. find a lawyer in the camaro5 group who will devote a little time to drafting a letter to GM (and FHSSA sp?)
2. have the letter state to GM that the design of the seat is unacceptable to female passengers and represents sexual discrimination. It's true
3. unless a solution to this discriminatory act is released within 60 days to the dealers, further publicity/legal action on GM's conduct will be taken.
4. letter signed electronically by all the guys on camaro5 (and gals who have short husbands or boyfriends or both )

standup for your rights, you paid good money for this car!!!

ok, any lawyers who will help?

Ahh, there you go, a frivolous lawsuit......it's the American way!!
You are joking right?