GM to shutdown Factories

[DarkFangz1100]

Ford did it...so why can't GM?

[oneredry]

maybe I'm the oddball here, but with a family of 6 total, I surly dn't want another equinox look alike. similar to that of the up and coming Blazer. (just not true to the roots) Granted, I have a Yukon Denali XL and love it (along with my Camaro). I want choices. this has been the talk around my work community as we produce the exhaust for just about every MFR, its hurting us to a degree as well. just tired of seeing all these 4 cyl equinox look a likes. what I would love (and I hate to say it) is for GM to bring back a minivan. I would buy it! I've owned a Buick Enclave and the door situation and getting in and out of the back is a PITA. which is what essentially replaced the Trailblazer/uplander (speaking in terms of the Traverse/mid/large segment)
/rant

[90503]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

And part of the reason for that is that cars aren't getting much advertising exposure at all. If you're lucky, you get a quick glimpse of a car during the typical Chevy or Ford TV commercial. Really lucky if you get any more than that (Cruze?).

I do wonder what'll happen should this truck/SUV/crossover binge soften and the suits finally realize that stepping away from being a full-line mfr and supporting it as such does have its downside.


Norm

The way this topic has been treated on this forum is sad. This forum, like GM, is dying a tortured death....After all yesterday's thread closings, I think I'm throwing in the towel on this place....It's not worth the aggravation...


I'll just drive my 5th Gen until the wheels fall off....to hell with everything else.....


Here's the future and GM's destiny....Good luck...

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by DarkFangz1100

Ford did it...so why can't GM?

Ford is already thinking of themselves as a "mobility company" as opposed to a "car company". Be careful what you wish for here.


Norm

[Doc]

Originally Posted by 90503

The way this topic has been treated on this forum is sad. This forum, like GM, is dying a tortured death....After all yesterday's thread closings, I think I'm throwing in the towel on this place....It's not worth the aggravation...


I'll just drive my 5th Gen until the wheels fall off....to hell with everything else.....


Here's the future and GM's destiny....Good luck...


Attachment 965906

Attachment 965907

Don't you find it kind of ironic, that GM's response to their situation is close factories, and this forum's response to talking about it is to close threads? Nothing gets solved; no new ideas get put forth by "protecting" everyone from seeing/talking about it. Protection is a defensive strategy; we need an offensive strategy.

I absolutely hate the idea of autonomous vehicles. Why are all the car companies everywhere working on this? Why did they all do it at the same time? Who asked for that?

What we need is creativity and good old-fashioned Yankee ingenuity. This country became famous for it.

If I was in charge, here's where I'd start. I'd get all 3 members of today's modern single-customer that's a family of 3, and I'd sit down with them and ask what catches their eye when they look at a car. What do they currently drive? Chances are, it isn't a GM product. Why? And I would LISTEN to them; not defend, not make excuses, not blame... LISTEN. What do they like about what they currently drive? What do they not like? What would they like to experience if they could make changes?

Start with a clean sheet of paper, and find out what the customers think and feel about their experience; not only with the vehicles they currently own, but shopping and buying a vehicle in the first place.

Right now, dealers order loaded out models, and push the customers towards those because that's what the dealers want. Manufacturers design 'packages' that have what THEY want in them. What do the CUSTOMERS want? And don't ask them that, then start making excuses as to why what they want can't happen. LISTEN to them and figure out how to make it happen; that's why you're a professional getting paid big bucks. Don't make excuses, figure out how to make it happen. Guess what will happen if you do? You'll be a star.

Changing the way manufacturers and dealers think is the first step in making the kind of changes that will enable them to get up to speed with the changes that have happened in society. Like it or not, the internet and mobile phones have changed the world. People's expectations and perceptions of how, what and where have changed dramatically.

How about a virtual dealership? Instead of a lot full of cars the dealer wanted to order, how about a showroom with beautiful workstations connected to the factory? One car in the show room; spheres sitting on pedestals under the lights with all the colors that are available so you can see what they actually look like. When I ordered my 2009 Camaro in Imperial Blue Metallic, the image on their website wasn't even close to the way the color looked. What if I could sit down at one of those wide-screen stations; screens in 4k, and choose what I wanted on the car, and as I did, that model appeared on the screen exactly how I wanted it. Once the order was done and finalized, that order is sent to the factory which essentially functions like a giant, remote CNC situation, where the choices I made are translated into a produced car. It doesn't take months, it could take less than a week because the factory is set up to do things like this.

This type of system would require thinking differently about manufacturing and how things are done. Upgrade the customer experience and make it fun and exciting to order and buy a car. After they've made their choice, whether they buy at that moment or not, save the file and make it available to them as a viewable file on their phone, computer, Playstation/X-box. Let them take that home and get excited about it to help build anticipation before the car is delivered.

There's a lot of things that can be done, but it requires stepping past the fear and yellow hazard warning tape that's paralyzing the decision makers.

You want to build an exciting car that the customers want? Start with their experience; what they see and experience first, and how that plays out. JD Power studies are not it. Design a great interior first; make one for the SUV/truck that mom drives, the executive sedan that dad drives, and then the car that the teens want to drive. Once you have that designed, then work on building a chassis and powertrain around that. Don't compromise the interior, figure out how to make the chassis work with and around it. Once you have that, THEN design the exterior. Car makers always start with a designer sketch of the exterior. Change that; "think different" to quote an Apple saying. Steve Jobs did things all the industry experts said couldn't be done, and he did it more than once. He didn't just focus on products, he included the customer experience in how they purchased those products, and what they experienced when using them. This gave birth to the iTunes store, the App store, and the retail Apple stores themselves. GM and American car companies need to look at that very carefully, and think different about what their customers are experiencing.

When I go to the mall, the big box stores are mostly empty; the Apple store is always full. And it's not because they have the cheapest products; they don't. Imagine walking into something like an Apple store, except it's for cars. In addition to the scenario I described above, now imagine there's also accessory stations where you can choose accessories; travel cups, car covers, window shades, clothing, travel bags, custom wheels, tires, performance goodies... make it exciting to be there even if you aren't buying a car. Going to a car dealer now is like going to the hospital to see the doctor; it's going to hurt, it's going to be expensive, and it's going to take hours.

THINK DIFFERENT and you'll get different results.

[parish8]

^^^ we are on a car site. Clearly we all enjoy cars beyond their function of basic transportation. All the non car enthusiasts I know can’t wait for a self driving car and to be honest for basic to and from work transportation I would love a self driving car. There is a huge chunk of the population that considers cars and car ownership a burden.

[Joshinator99]

Originally Posted by Doc

Don't you find it kind of ironic, that GM's response to their situation is close factories, and this forum's response to talking about it is to close threads? Nothing gets solved; no new ideas get put forth by "protecting" everyone from seeing/talking about it. Protection is a defensive strategy; we need an offensive strategy.

I absolutely hate the idea of autonomous vehicles. Why are all the car companies everywhere working on this? Why did they all do it at the same time? Who asked for that?

What we need is creativity and good old-fashioned Yankee ingenuity. This country became famous for it.

If I was in charge, here's where I'd start. I'd get all 3 members of today's modern single-customer that's a family of 3, and I'd sit down with them and ask what catches their eye when they look at a car. What do they currently drive? Chances are, it isn't a GM product. Why? And I would LISTEN to them; not defend, not make excuses, not blame... LISTEN. What do they like about what they currently drive? What do they not like? What would they like to experience if they could make changes?

Start with a clean sheet of paper, and find out what the customers think and feel about their experience; not only with the vehicles they currently own, but shopping and buying a vehicle in the first place.

Right now, dealers order loaded out models, and push the customers towards those because that's what the dealers want. Manufacturers design 'packages' that have what THEY want in them. What do the CUSTOMERS want? And don't ask them that, then start making excuses as to why what they want can't happen. LISTEN to them and figure out how to make it happen; that's why you're a professional getting paid big bucks. Don't make excuses, figure out how to make it happen. Guess what will happen if you do? You'll be a star.

Changing the way manufacturers and dealers think is the first step in making the kind of changes that will enable them to get up to speed with the changes that have happened in society. Like it or not, the internet and mobile phones have changed the world. People's expectations and perceptions of how, what and where have changed dramatically.

How about a virtual dealership? Instead of a lot full of cars the dealer wanted to order, how about a showroom with beautiful workstations connected to the factory? One car in the show room; spheres sitting on pedestals under the lights with all the colors that are available so you can see what they actually look like. When I ordered my 2009 Camaro in Imperial Blue Metallic, the image on their website wasn't even close to the way the color looked. What if I could sit down at one of those wide-screen stations; screens in 4k, and choose what I wanted on the car, and as I did, that model appeared on the screen exactly how I wanted it. Once the order was done and finalized, that order is sent to the factory which essentially functions like a giant, remote CNC situation, where the choices I made are translated into a produced car. It doesn't take months, it could take less than a week because the factory is set up to do things like this.

This type of system would require thinking differently about manufacturing and how things are done. Upgrade the customer experience and make it fun and exciting to order and buy a car. After they've made their choice, whether they buy at that moment or not, save the file and make it available to them as a viewable file on their phone, computer, Playstation/X-box. Let them take that home and get excited about it to help build anticipation before the car is delivered.

There's a lot of things that can be done, but it requires stepping past the fear and yellow hazard warning tape that's paralyzing the decision makers.

You want to build an exciting car that the customers want? Start with their experience; what they see and experience first, and how that plays out. JD Power studies are not it. Design a great interior first; make one for the SUV/truck that mom drives, the executive sedan that dad drives, and then the car that the teens want to drive. Once you have that designed, then work on building a chassis and powertrain around that. Don't compromise the interior, figure out how to make the chassis work with and around it. Once you have that, THEN design the exterior. Car makers always start with a designer sketch of the exterior. Change that; "think different" to quote an Apple saying. Steve Jobs did things all the industry experts said couldn't be done, and he did it more than once. He didn't just focus on products, he included the customer experience in how they purchased those products, and what they experienced when using them. This gave birth to the iTunes store, the App store, and the retail Apple stores themselves. GM and American car companies need to look at that very carefully, and think different about what their customers are experiencing.

When I go to the mall, the big box stores are mostly empty; the Apple store is always full. And it's not because they have the cheapest products; they don't. Imagine walking into something like an Apple store, except it's for cars. In addition to the scenario I described above, now imagine there's also accessory stations where you can choose accessories; travel cups, car covers, window shades, clothing, travel bags, custom wheels, tires, performance goodies... make it exciting to be there even if you aren't buying a car. Going to a car dealer now is like going to the hospital to see the doctor; it's going to hurt, it's going to be expensive, and it's going to take hours.

THINK DIFFERENT and you'll get different results.

Very well said! We could easily have a 50 page thread on the GM dealer experience... lot of work needed on that front.

[Doc]

Originally Posted by parish8

^^^ we are on a car site. Clearly we all enjoy cars beyond their function of basic transportation. All the non car enthusiasts I know can’t wait for a self driving car and to be honest for basic to and from work transportation I would love a self driving car. There is a huge chunk of the population that considers cars and car ownership a burden.

I don't know anyone that says they can't wait, or even want a self driving car, but that's where I live. Maybe it's different elsewhere. What you're asking for isn't really a car, it's a transit system but with the individuality of a car. Cars always represented freedom for the individual; freedom to go when and where you wanted. The only 'entertainment' was the radio. As a passenger, the only other thing you could do was talk or look out the window. With today's cell phones and constantly being connected to the world wide web, people now have all the information/communication/entertainment benefits you used to have to be home for, and they're holding it in their hands. That's changed things.

If their perception is that cars and car ownership is a burden, it's not surprising that they don't want that responsibility. That's actually a current issue, and it's because they're exhibiting the signs of addiction; only instead of a physical drug, it's their cell phone and being connected. Addicts don't want anything that distracts from their addiction. They don't want responsibility. They don't want to register their car, pay for insurance, or do anything except focus on their addiction. They don't want a job, they don't want to go to school, they don't want to take care of their home, their kids, or even their life. They want anything they need to be done for them so they can focus on their addiction.

The tech companies have already recognized there's a problem there, and they're starting to talk about addressing it, but it may be that government regulations will start happening first. That always seems to be the case.

Transit systems are a good idea; especially for known repetitive travel such as work or school. Putting in any kind of system is going to be seriously expensive and take a long time, because it will of course have to deal with politics, right-of-way, safety and all that besides the issues of convenience and practicality. It should be possible to design and develop a hybrid system of some kind that enables both; a transit system (possibly including autonomous modules) and free range vehicles. I'd start with shipping; do something for trucks and shipping first to get the majority of those off the regular roads.

There are all kinds of issues facing autonomous vehicles. Who owns it if I'm not in control of it? Who is liable? Who is responsible for maintenance? People who want autonomous don't want any of those things. They just want it to show up, and take them where they want to go. They don't want to have to be responsible for anything. Basically a self-driving taxi. Sounds great, except what about the actual experience of using that? Who was in it before it showed up at my door? Were they smokers? Pipe, cigar, cigarette, weed, vape? Were they sick with an infectious disease? Did they have lice or any kind of medical condition that can be transferred by contact? Were they drunk and threw up? Did they change their baby and left a loaded diaper on the floor? Who's responsible for the experience? What if it breaks down before it gets to where I want to go? Then what? What if I'm late for work or school because of that? Who's responsible?

It's not going to be the panacea that people think it will. In the meantime, in my opinion it would be much easier to fix the individual vehicle experience for the system we have now.

[AZCamaroFan]

Doc the reason the threads get closed is because people injected partisan politics into it, and that isn't allowed.

[Doc]

Originally Posted by AZCamaroFan

Doc the reason the threads get closed is because people injected partisan politics into it, and that isn't allowed.

So block the posters or the comments they posted, but keep the thread open. We have a problem in this country of not wanting to enforce the rules, which is why we have rampant lawlessness.

Since it's clearly stated that partisan politics is NOT allowed, enforce that on the individuals who think the rules don't apply to them. They'll get the message, and that will allow the discussions to stay open for those who are following the rules. Stop penalizing those who follow the rules, by treating them the same way as those who don't.

[fastball]

Originally Posted by Doc

So block the posters or the comments they posted, but keep the thread open. We have a problem in this country of not wanting to enforce the rules, which is why we have rampant lawlessness.

Since it's clearly stated that partisan politics is NOT allowed, enforce that on the individuals who think the rules don't apply to them. They'll get the message, and that will allow the discussions to stay open for those who are following the rules. Stop penalizing those who follow the rules, by treating them the same way as those who don't.

Accountability you say???? How dare you make people responsible to follow the rules!

[DangerZL1]

Originally Posted by 90503

The way this topic has been treated on this forum is sad. This forum, like GM, is dying a tortured death....After all yesterday's thread closings, I think I'm throwing in the towel on this place....It's not worth the aggravation...


I'll just drive my 5th Gen until the wheels fall off....to hell with everything else.....


Here's the future and GM's destiny....Good luck...


Attachment 965906

Attachment 965907

Where's the sign up sheet for this bad boy?

[DenverTaco07]

IMO, the bottom line is that GM is doing what it feels necessary to thrive. Time will tell whether those decisions pan out for the good or bad, but they are being made by those who's job it is to make them. There really isn't much of a reason to worry about what isn't in our control, although I understand the sentiments expressed here on the forum.

[MackSteelPrivateEye]

So much anti Americanism. They think that because another country makes it its supposed to somehow be better. So many Americans bash America and will support Japan, Germany and S Kor. before even thinking about buying AmericaN. They fail to realize the stronger American manufacturing is the stronger the country. Once big manufacturing is diminished to a burned out cinder this country will become incredibly weak and dependent and better pray no war breaks out and we are dependent on imported steel from China and Japan and Germany will be building our Military equipment. Lack of foresight is killing this country.