Intake manifold

[acammer]

Originally Posted by 1JEWLDSSRS

Hello guys, yea I have a stock cube engine with a healthy cam, the TSP 231/246@112 LSA, 640/615 with a 3200 stall, no head work is planned so this will be a test for the intake for non ported heads. I am going to pull the trigger and purchase in a week, I had the money but bought a new set of rims I have been looking at for a some time while they were getting the website pricing fixed, so now I gotta wait a week, but will keep you guys posted. I too am very curious as to what it will gain me on the dyno, like I said we put down 460rwhp and 430rwtq on a mustang dyno. I am itching to get it though. Thanks guys. Cheers.

Looking forward to your results. Similar setup here, stock bottom end, stock heads, max effort cam without valve reliefs. I would be interested to see how much I can pick up over a max effort stock intake (I have radius rods and porting). The LOD really does look like it'll run upstairs really, really well. I just wonder what it'll give up on the bottom. I'd like to see back to back pulls from 2500rpm with a manual car to get a realistic feel for what this does to the bottom end.

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by acammer

Looking forward to your results. Similar setup here, stock bottom end, stock heads, max effort cam without valve reliefs. I would be interested to see how much I can pick up over a max effort stock intake (I have radius rods and porting). The LOD really does look like it'll run upstairs really, really well. I just wonder what it'll give up on the bottom. I'd like to see back to back pulls from 2500rpm with a manual car to get a realistic feel for what this does to the bottom end.

Do you have a before/after from going to the ported and rod-mod intake? This is one of the other setups I am considering doing (although I can't use it once I go boosted). But same way as LOD, I am not finding much for independent results of it. Looks like we are probably fairly similar in build, other than my heads are ported. But I feel like my gains would be semi-simlar to what you saw.

I too think this looks like a screamer up top! But if I'm going to have a huge dip down low, then I may need to look at other options for now since I don't frequent the track. Even with gears, once this cam went in, there's nobody home down low already.

[xc_SS/RS]

Originally Posted by lazerlemonta

Well guys I will be testing this intake on 11/6 at MIR. Hoping to get it in my hands quick enough to dyno tune prior. If all goes well I can show a 3 intake comparison. I have my hiossilver rod mod LS3 results already. I will get numbers from the mid runner fast and X1 same day same dyno and same track. We may even rod mod another LS3 and port the snout to 102 just for some hard core data. My car is about as full bolt on as you can get. Thanks to Ryan for throwing my name out there and LOD for having good faith in me for some real world results.

pumped for the rental!

if you need a manifold for that 102mm rod-mod let me know. still got my stock one unmodified

[lazerlemonta]

Originally Posted by xc_SS/RS

pumped for the rental!

if you need a manifold for that 102mm rod-mod let me know. still got my stock one unmodified

I have a couple brother. Thanks! Andrew I plan to give a thorough test on the set up once the cam is installed as well. This is going to get costly lol

[acammer]

Originally Posted by go_go_gadget88

Do you have a before/after from going to the ported and rod-mod intake? This is one of the other setups I am considering doing (although I can't use it once I go boosted). But same way as LOD, I am not finding much for independent results of it. Looks like we are probably fairly similar in build, other than my heads are ported. But I feel like my gains would be semi-simlar to what you saw.

Unfortunately I don't have back to back results, I did the cam, intake and 25% under-drive in one shot. We did baseline the car with all the bolt-on's (headers, xpipe, highflow cats, cutouts, Cold Air Inductions CAI, ported TB, prior dyno tune) and it made 402rwhp. After the SS3 cam, rodmod and under-drive it made 473rrwhp, 71whp gain. Hard to imagine all that just from the cam, I wouldn't doubt the intake was worth 10-13whp and maybe 5-7rwhp for the under-drive.

GPI says that a rod-mod usually picks up around 12rwhp in a cammed car. What's nice is it picks up everywhere, from like 3000-7000 rpm. It's like the streetable fat mid-range the LS3 always had, just even better, and runs out the top much nicer.

It would be really cool to see a comparison of a stock intake/rod mod and ported intake/LOD. I imagine the LOD really picks up where the stock lays over, and that you sacrifice a good bit under 4,000 to get those gains.

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by acammer

Unfortunately I don't have back to back results, I did the cam, intake and 25% under-drive in one shot. We did baseline the car with all the bolt-on's (headers, xpipe, highflow cats, cutouts, Cold Air Inductions CAI, ported TB, prior dyno tune) and it made 402rwhp. After the SS3 cam, rodmod and under-drive it made 473rrwhp, 71whp gain. Hard to imagine all that just from the cam, I wouldn't doubt the intake was worth 10-13whp and maybe 5-7rwhp for the under-drive.

GPI says that a rod-mod usually picks up around 12rwhp in a cammed car. What's nice is it picks up everywhere, from like 3000-7000 rpm. It's like the streetable fat mid-range the LS3 always had, just even better, and runs out the top much nicer.

It would be really cool to see a comparison of a stock intake/rod mod and ported intake/LOD. I imagine the LOD really picks up where the stock lays over, and that you sacrifice a good bit under 4,000 to get those gains.

Right on, I wasn't sure what mods you did at what point, but thought it worth asking. The dyno GPI has for the ported rod mod intake on a cammed engine look good, but like any other company, I want to see customer results. I don't spin mine over 7k right now, so I'm guessing the port/rod mod intake would be better for my car as-is..but since they don't recommend them for boost, I would eventually be needing to look at something like the X1. So, if it doesn't lose too bad down low, it would be in my best interests to just get it now. I would love for someone with a cammed/bolt ons motor (or ported heads) to take a stock intake/ ported rod mod / and an X1 and do same day same dynos back to back to back. Just curious what that looks like.


Side question, do you have any track times yet since you have done the cam swap??

[lazerlemonta]

Originally Posted by go_go_gadget88

Right on, I wasn't sure what mods you did at what point, but thought it worth asking. The dyno GPI has for the ported rod mod intake on a cammed engine look good, but like any other company, I want to see customer results. I don't spin mine over 7k right now, so I'm guessing the port/rod mod intake would be better for my car as-is..but since they don't recommend them for boost, I would eventually be needing to look at something like the X1. So, if it doesn't lose too bad down low, it would be in my best interests to just get it now.


Side question, do you have any track times yet since you have done the cam swap??

Really it is a miss conception of losing torque. It just moves it to the upper rpm where it is needed most in race application. No matter what, a proper set up car will always have more torque then it did stock and they drove just fine stock. Gears are a must anyways and this is a torque multiplier so per say lose 20 multiply it through 4.10s your still way ahead. Just a different perspective on how these intakes all work.

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by lazerlemonta

Really it is a miss conception of losing torque. It just moves it to the upper rpm where it is needed most in race application. No matter what, a proper set up car will always have more torque then it did stock and they drove just fine stock. Gears are a must anyways and this is a torque multiplier so per say lose 20 multiply it through 4.10s your still way ahead. Just a different perspective on how these intakes all work.

That's why I made sure to follow the losing torque comment with "down low". I realize peak numbers probably won't be less, but you definitely "lose it" in the sense it's not where it was. We didn't run the dyno that low, but I'll bet I have considerably less torque at 2500rpm than I did with the stock cam. Which does have an effect on how it feels driving on the street. Go line it up and launch, and you'd never know it was lacking anything though.

And the driving fine stock is personal opinion I remember taking mine out for a test drive (first time in a 5th gen), and after running it though a few gears, I thought "no way is this 426hp, not even close". I loved the car, but performance was greatly lacking.

However, I guess I am just trying to avoid making this lot worse than it already is. Even with gears, it seems pretty gutless below 3k rpm. If I was going to give up another 20 @ 3000 rpm to pick up 5 more on top, I'm probably better off without it for my style of driving.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by go_go_gadget88

Right on, I wasn't sure what mods you did at what point, but thought it worth asking. The dyno GPI has for the ported rod mod intake on a cammed engine look good, but like any other company, I want to see customer results. I don't spin mine over 7k right now, so I'm guessing the port/rod mod intake would be better for my car as-is..but since they don't recommend them for boost, I would eventually be needing to look at something like the X1. So, if it doesn't lose too bad down low, it would be in my best interests to just get it now.


Side question, do you have any track times yet since you have done the cam swap??

Yea - I have been to the track just once this year. Shortly after the cam went in I pulled a few teeth off the Richmond 4.10 ring gear. Spent a while getting that sorted, more time waiting for parts, didn't really have the car track ready again till August. Rained out three attempts to go in a row - did make an untimed drag event at an airfield which was at least a good time - until the crush collar failed and pinion lost all preload. Put in new pinion bearings, shimmed and reshimmed but despite a beautiful pattern and spec backlash the rear is crazy noisy now - the gears took some negative effects from the drive home with the excessive backlash when it backed off.

So, I made it, for the first time 9/22/18. Car previously had been a 12.59@113.46 with a 1.98 60' on a 28" tall street tire, 1330' DA. All that changed was the cam, intake and underdrive, and a set of 305/45/18 NT05Rs. The car went a bunch of 12.0-12.1 passes - best was a 12.07@ 116.76 with a 1.81 60', 835' DA. I was really fighting on the car dead hook and bogging all day, I kept trying to add launch rpm but I found I couldn't get the car to rev beyond 5000rpm. Worse, that limiter was also causing some delay in the throttle opening once I would start my clutch release. I played with my release speed and the rpm range I had, but couldn't make too much happen. Posi is giving up too, I gotta keep the rear really loaded in the burnout - if it unloads at all the drives side will usually bite and one tire fire. Really, even though it picked up a half a second I was pretty disappointed. I was hoping for a few less tenths and a few more MPH - high 11s at closer to 120. Was shifting at about 7100 with the limiter at 7200.

I've got the wheelspeed vs. rpm table all sorted out now, bumped the limiter to 7300, so I'm hoping to really cut into that 60' - I'd like to at least get deep into the 1.7x range if not 1.6x times. It should pick up a few MPH with a better leave, and it'll definitely give me those mid-high 11s I know it can do. It's a full weight car, I've done zero weight reduction. I don't have a drag pack, so I've got big heavy 285s up front. It has a pretty lazy 1-2 upshift syncro so I have to baby that shift a little. So, I'm trying to be realistic about what a 4200# raceweight stick shift car can do with sub 500whp. As long as the weather holds up the next few days the track and grounds should be dry enough Friday night for another T&T.

Really, I'd like to drop from this 29" tire down to a 26" and get the RPMs up for the back half. I pull it into 4th not far past the 1/8th and only trap at like 5600rpm, which is far from ideal. 26" tire would be more like 6200 at 117 - and I'm sure it would trap over 120 with more RPM out the back.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by lazerlemonta

Really it is a miss conception of losing torque. It just moves it to the upper rpm where it is needed most in race application. No matter what, a proper set up car will always have more torque then it did stock and they drove just fine stock. Gears are a must anyways and this is a torque multiplier so per say lose 20 multiply it through 4.10s your still way ahead. Just a different perspective on how these intakes all work.

Completely agree that you're not losing torque - the peak number is going to be higher, just at a higher rpm. You are giving up torque down in that daily driver range though. Gears definitely help make that up. I would also be interested to see what the sacrifice is there - it's just interesting.

[lazerlemonta]

Who runs at wide open throttle at 2500RPM where all this magical my car wont move torque is lost? I mean really people get so hung up this. You want real comparisons........ I guess I will talk to my friend and see if i can take a stroll at 1500RPM and log it in 4th through 6th accelerating to highway speeds and set the cruise control.

[ZEN357]

Is this the manifold you are talking about?

[Clarkstar]

Yes... that's it

[go_go_gadget88]

Originally Posted by lazerlemonta

Who runs at wide open throttle at 2500RPM where all this magical my car wont move torque is lost? I mean really people get so hung up this. You want real comparisons........ I guess I will talk to my friend and see if i can take a stroll at 1500RPM and log it in 4th through 6th accelerating to highway speeds and set the cruise control.

You're right. I guess I just pulled that scenario out of my ass, there's definitely no way other people drive differently than you. I certainly never really put the hammer down at that rpm. I just come to a dead stop in the street and get RPMs up to do a clutch dump..


Some of us don't live at the track like you do man. By 2500rpm in 1st, I'm already basically exceeding most of my local speed limits. And I try and keep RPMs down because you can hear me all the way across town when I stand on it. But long and short - if something only benefits me at 6800rpm+, then it's f*cking useless to me, end of story.

This all seems contradictory since I know I have seen you tout how much power your 1LE had with boltons and rockers, and how people are stupid for putting such big cams in a heavy car, only to be slower because the power is up where you don't need it.

So by this new logic you are producing..we should all do race cams, big heads, and a massive intake. Since we wouldn't really be losing anything at all.