Forza Dual Mode Exhaust Controller

[mbowen89]

Originally Posted by sd1611

This is exactly what I am looking for as well.

This can easily be done with a three way switch, and just inserting one side of the switch in line with a single wire.

See this post:

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...44&postcount=9

[forzasteve]

On the Forza controller for Ferrari and other exotics, the device will function in the way you mention. That is, Always Open, ECU Control and Always Closed. Click here for some details.

When I was developing the controller for Camaro / Corvette, I thought about doing that but in the end decided against it for the first version as it increases the cost and I thought there would not be that much interest in having it.

Technically, it requires a two-channel RF transmitter / receiver not just a single channel. And you would need another relay on the circuit board for the circuitry. That would take the total number of relays from two to four and increase the size of the printed circuit board, which would mean a larger enclosure. All of that would add cost.

As one person said, you can do this with a mechanical three way switch. Sounds easy, but for a commercial product, that would be high risk as the wire would be carrying +12V and if you frayed the wire and it shorted out, you could be looking at big repair bills. Also, on the diagram that you linked to, requires modifying the electrical system with cut and splice. A no-no for me as any product that I put out has to be plug and play and completely reversible. Cutting and splicing, etc, is not something I would recommend some one undertake unless they really know what they are doing. The person who put out that diagram did not follow good practice at all. He should have employed relays to handle the electrical load and then the wires could have been merely ground wires for the relay coils. Much safer method. His method has too much risk and should be avoided.

On the Forza controller, the wire for the manual switch option is only a grounding wire. All that wire is doing is providing a ground to a relay coil. If you short that wire out, no sparks and no damages. Any commercial design for a three way would have to be a pair of grounding wires that would merely close the coil side of remote relays back at the controller ... like is done on the Forza unit.

Another thing with Always Closed ... with the Ferrari and Lambos, when the valves are open, the cars are much louder than Camaro's with open valves. So there was bigger demand for an Always Closed option.

On the next version ... I might go ahead and incorporate that option if there seems to be enough demand to warrant it.

Steve

[forzasteve]

Originally Posted by mbowen89

This can easily be done with a three way switch, and just inserting one side of the switch in line with a single wire.

See this post:

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showpo...44&postcount=9

This is better ...

No wire cutting or splicing. The wires to the 3-way switch are ground wires only. No danger of sparks and blitzkrieg. Yellow wire tap into any hot fuse ... RDO is good one. The Purple / White wire tap into Exhaust Flapper fuse position. Purple is hot side. Two relays. R1 is the always open relay. R2 is the always closed relay. When both relays are at default position (3 way switch in center position), the exhaust bypass valve is under ECU control.

Important ... completely reversible. Take all this stuff off and car is completely stock again.

Edited March 6th by Steve ... I reviewed the factory circuit diagram again and my thought about an Always Closed Option is not likely going to work. The original 3-way is not going to work. It will not hurt anything ... just will not work. I removed the 3-way diagram. The diagram now shown does not include the Always Closed. It is only a diagram showing how you can insert a manual switch for Always Open and ECU control. I apologize for any confusion if some one has attempted to use my original diagram. ... Steve


Steve

[unstable vic]

Smart guy.

[forzasteve]

By the way, the circuit diagram I posted is in essence the same manual switch circuit in the Forza controller. Except the Forza Controller does not have the Always Closed option. Maybe later.

If all you want to do is add a manual switch and you are not concerned about the Always Closed part ... just remove relay R2. Relay R1 will perform the task of ECU Control and Always Open. The parts you would want to get for this is the automotive relay with a flyback diode to protect against reverse RMF, two fuse taps, some 16 or 18 gauge wire and some terminal connectors. Cost of supplies should be on the order of $10 to $20. Add in the miscellaneous wires that you may not have lying around for another $5 to $10. Then add in your time.

By the way, most cheap automotive relays do not have a flyback diode protection across the coil side. It is good practice to avoid those. On car with DC current, flyback diode protection across the coils side of relays (or at least a bleed down resistor) are almost always used to protect sensitive circuits from voltage spikes caused by switching relays. Your common auto parts stores like Auto Zone probably do not sell those. Those are OK for horns and lights. Avoid those types of relays when you are getting in close proximity to the any of the vehicle's computer bits and pieces. You need to get the better relays an electronic parts supply store.

You do not need to, but it would tidy things up if you got a small electronic enclosure and terminal block to put the relay(s) inside and your various connectors. That would add another $10 to $20 or so.

Or ... you could get the Forza Controller for a small amount more, have the manual switch option if you wanted it ... PLUS have the wireless remote control option ... and you would be done.

Steve

Originally Posted by forzasteve

This is better ...

No wire cutting or splicing. The wires to the 3-way switch are ground wires only. No danger of sparks and blitzkrieg. Yellow wire tap into any hot fuse ... RDO is good one. The Purple / White wire tap into Exhaust Flapper fuse position. Purple is hot side. Two relays. R1 is the always open relay. R2 is the always closed relay. When both relays are at default position (3 way switch in center position), the exhaust bypass valve is under ECU control.

Important ... completely reversible. Take all this stuff off and car is completely stock again.



Steve

[markgws6]

I'd be willing to pony up a bit more to get the full-open/car controlled/full-closed version if you came out with it and it required no splicing of any wires so I can set the car back to stock if needed. That is the way chevy should have done it in my opinion.

[mbowen89]

Steve, I'd rather not have to splice wires, but I think I will unless you or someone makes a three way "device". Any ETA? I know it would sell, because that's what most people actually really want!

[sd1611]

Thank you Forzasteve for the information.

[yotaman96]

When I added an NPP catback to my 2010, I just ran a vacuum line to a Mild to Wild controller and had complete control of the baffles. I could open or close them at any time. Does this work the same way?

[KaBoom1701]

Originally Posted by markgws6

I'd be willing to pony up a bit more to get the full-open/car controlled/full-closed version if you came out with it and it required no splicing of any wires so I can set the car back to stock if needed. That is the way chevy should have done it in my opinion.

+1

I'm in this camp as well.

[forzasteve]

If you use the diagram, above, you won't have to splice wires. But you will have to get the bits and pieces.

As far as ETA for 3-way controller goes ... well, I have made an investment to have a bunch of printed circuit boards custom manufactured for me. I have about 200 of those bad boys sitting on a shelf.

Let me work on this.

Regards,

Steve

Originally Posted by mbowen89

Steve, I'd rather not have to splice wires, but I think I will unless you or someone makes a three way "device". Any ETA? I know it would sell, because that's what most people actually really want!

[forzasteve]

Yes.

Steve

Originally Posted by yotaman96

When I added an NPP catback to my 2010, I just ran a vacuum like to a Mild to Wild controller and had complete control of the baffles. I could open or close them at any time. Does this work the same way?

[forzasteve]

Hi All,

This is bit embarrassing ... I was reviewing the factory electrical schematics and discovered that my first thought on a simple solution to get a 3-way controller was not correct. I was thinking that all I had to do was to push +12V to the vacuum solenoid valve by using the fuse tap. That assumption was not correct as the vehicle switches the exhaust flow control valve after the fuse, not before.

This somewhat complicates things. But, there is a solution ... and it will not require any wire splicing and it will be reversible.

Warning though ... my initial thought was that it would add maybe $10 or so to the cost. Now I am thinking it will add more like $60 to the cost, based on my experience developing similar solutions for Ferrari and Lamborghini.

So, now I have to ask. If you were OK with a cost of say $80 to $90 for a 2-way controller. Would you be willing to pony up $150 to $170 for a 3-way. The only extra function would be to get an Always Closed option.

Thanks ...

Steve

[mbowen89]

Honestly, I think I'll just spend $5 and splice a single wire and get three way control.