Oil Pressure at the Track

[Trawz]

Just a little update here:

My Camaro has been sitting for the past 5 weeks pending a new splitter because the old one got damaged by an unforeseen off-roading adventure due to a deer with a death wish.

I have since moved and had to bring her over to her new home last night.
I noticed the engine is getting to temp MUCH faster then before. About twice as fast as it did before this past track day.
When warming up the car, I wont leave my spot until I see 100 degrees water temp. That took probably 3-5 minutes. Now it takes 1-2 minutes. Never got past 180ish tho.

The oil pressure during this 10 minute drive to my new place got pretty low as well. Was at the "one quarter" mark on the SS gauge (15ish PSI).

I picked up the test kit that Joe linked and have yet to test the actual oil pressure. That is high on the list of things to do.

Fearing the oil pump is on the way out the door.

[acammer]

Originally Posted by Trawz

Just a little update here:

My Camaro has been sitting for the past 5 weeks pending a new splitter because the old one got damaged by an unforeseen off-roading adventure due to a deer with a death wish.

I have since moved and had to bring her over to her new home last night.
I noticed the engine is getting to temp MUCH faster then before. About twice as fast as it did before this past track day.
When warming up the car, I wont leave my spot until I see 100 degrees water temp. That took probably 3-5 minutes. Now it takes 1-2 minutes. Never got past 180ish tho.

The oil pressure during this 10 minute drive to my new place got pretty low as well. Was at the "one quarter" mark on the SS gauge (15ish PSI).

I picked up the test kit that Joe linked and have yet to test the actual oil pressure. That is high on the list of things to do.

Fearing the oil pump is on the way out the door.

I agree, you have a mechanical problem. If it was JUST oil pressure, I might suspect the pump, but the extra volume after the last hot temp/low pressure track day is suspicious - its very odd that Blackstone didn't identify anything there. There there is the rapid heating of the engine - also concerning. And most obviously, you've got decline oil pressure.

Most pump failures I've seen are with the regulator, and they just don't make any pressure at idle. There are a few other potential oil system related issues, but I think you also have to consider that you may have something going away in the engine. Did you cut open your last filter? I know you sent the oil for a sample, but I'd wanna see the filter with my own eyes.

Either way, I'm sorry to hear it. FWIW, the 10296 is our go-to oil pump for LS3s with 8qt oil pans, and would be optimal for your usage. Despite the internet folk-lore it will NOT empty the pan out. I can tell you that from personal experience, I run the 10296 in my personal car. I have the oil pan relief capped with a bolt, so the only pressure regulation occurs at the pump. My oiling system is stock other than the pump and pan relief capped - still runs the stock cooler.

I run the "COPO" spring, which is supposed to be an 85psi relief. On cold fresh oil I can see triple digit oil pressure on start up with Driven LS30, which is a 5W30 weight. In hindsight, I would have been ok with the standard 70PSI spring! Hot idle is around 50psi of pressure, and I see 90+PSI from like 5000-7800rpm with the oil up to temp, with a peak at just about 100psi at around 6800rpm. Again, despite the internet folk-lore, I'm not pushing the seals out of the motor, destroying the pressure sensor, etc - it's all been fine for 5,000 miles like this. It's more pressure than I would like, but it's not getting changed till the next time the motor has to get opened up. It does give me peace of mind when swinging the tach up towards 8,000rpm.

[Trawz]

Originally Posted by acammer

I agree, you have a mechanical problem. If it was JUST oil pressure, I might suspect the pump, but the extra volume after the last hot temp/low pressure track day is suspicious - its very odd that Blackstone didn't identify anything there. There there is the rapid heating of the engine - also concerning. And most obviously, you've got decline oil pressure.

Most pump failures I've seen are with the regulator, and they just don't make any pressure at idle. There are a few other potential oil system related issues, but I think you also have to consider that you may have something going away in the engine. Did you cut open your last filter? I know you sent the oil for a sample, but I'd wanna see the filter with my own eyes.

Either way, I'm sorry to hear it. FWIW, the 10296 is our go-to oil pump for LS3s with 8qt oil pans, and would be optimal for your usage. Despite the internet folk-lore it will NOT empty the pan out. I can tell you that from personal experience, I run the 10296 in my personal car. I have the oil pan relief capped with a bolt, so the only pressure regulation occurs at the pump. My oiling system is stock other than the pump and pan relief capped - still runs the stock cooler.

I run the "COPO" spring, which is supposed to be an 85psi relief. On cold fresh oil I can see triple digit oil pressure on start up with Driven LS30, which is a 5W30 weight. In hindsight, I would have been ok with the standard 70PSI spring! Hot idle is around 50psi of pressure, and I see 90+PSI from like 5000-7800rpm with the oil up to temp, with a peak at just about 100psi at around 6800rpm. Again, despite the internet folk-lore, I'm not pushing the seals out of the motor, destroying the pressure sensor, etc - it's all been fine for 5,000 miles like this. It's more pressure than I would like, but it's not getting changed till the next time the motor has to get opened up. It does give me peace of mind when swinging the tach up towards 8,000rpm.

I very much appreciate your input Andrew!
Something is defiantly off mechanically and I feel it is either the oil pump or a oil pressure sensor. I ordered a new OE sensor for $50 off RockAuto just to see if that fixes it, but I more heavily suspect the oil pump.

This issue has shown earlier on in my ownership I must say.
When I bought her, she would hot idle at 25-30 PSI.
After one hot track day, she was showing around 20-25 PSI hot idle from then on.
I did a bunch of cooling mods thinking heat was my issue and its been fine for years and numerus track days.
Until this last track day where she now hot idles at 10-15 PSI.

I did not cut the filter open, but the BlackStone came back clear and the magnet on my drain plug was clean. Which is encouraging, like Arizona said.

Unfortunately, I do not have the funds to handle an Oil Pump change and it might be a bit over my head to do it myself. I also want to take that sort of project on and learn, but I am sure there is a lot of "while you are in there, do..." things.

Is the 10296 a high volume or high pressure? I don't know what would be best for my application being hooked on road course track days.

Thanks again Andrew!

[acammer]

Originally Posted by Trawz

I very much appreciate your input Andrew!
Something is defiantly off mechanically and I feel it is either the oil pump or a oil pressure sensor. I ordered a new OE sensor for $50 off RockAuto just to see if that fixes it, but I more heavily suspect the oil pump.

This issue has shown earlier on in my ownership I must say.
When I bought her, she would hot idle at 25-30 PSI.
After one hot track day, she was showing around 20-25 PSI hot idle from then on.
I did a bunch of cooling mods thinking heat was my issue and its been fine for years and numerus track days.
Until this last track day where she now hot idles at 10-15 PSI.

I did not cut the filter open, but the BlackStone came back clear and the magnet on my drain plug was clean. Which is encouraging, like Arizona said.

Unfortunately, I do not have the funds to handle an Oil Pump change and it might be a bit over my head to do it myself. I also want to take that sort of project on and learn, but I am sure there is a lot of "while you are in there, do..." things.

Is the 10296 a high volume or high pressure? I don't know what would be best for my application being hooked on road course track days.

Thanks again Andrew!

So, the answer to our question on the 10296 is "yes" - meaning both, it is increased pressure and volume. Both would be meaningful to a track car that has a larger than stock external oil coiler.

If you take on the oil pump job, I would plan on doing the LS2 style tension are a minimum, the OEM LS3 tension is likely already in the oil pan (and not at all likely to be causing any issues). I have an oil pump guide on our site with some additional information you might want to check out.

https://gwatneyperformance.com/melli...-guide-for-ls/

[Badbubba]

Stock oil pump, LS3, slightly under 30 psi hot idle after a few street pulls. Mobile 1 5w30. About 650 rpm. Now GPI SS3 cam, stuff and Melling 10296 with 70 psi red spring. Pan relief is probably keeping around 60ish. Well over 30, about 40 psi hot, Mobile 1 5w40, 750 rpm. OP, what's your idle rpm?

[Trawz]

Originally Posted by Badbubba

Stock oil pump, LS3, slightly under 30 psi hot idle after a few street pulls. Mobile 1 5w30. About 650 rpm. Now GPI SS3 cam, stuff and Melling 10296 with 70 psi red spring. Pan relief is probably keeping around 60ish. Well over 30, about 40 psi hot, Mobile 1 5w40, 750 rpm. OP, what's your idle rpm?

My hot idle is around 550RPM and hot idle oil pressure is around 15-18psi with 10W40 oil.

[Trawz]

Another update on this:

I replaced the oil pressure sensor today with a new ACDelco one.
No change in oil pressure.

She now reads here on cold start on 10W40:


I believe this points to a dying oil pump...

[morepowerjoe]

Yes sir I would agree. I also agree with what Andrew said about the 10296 pump, it's probably the best pump put there for all around performance but, I went with the 10355HV which is a touch more idle pressure. Currently I see about 44 psi at hot idle at 900 rpm with an oil temperature of 217* and at wot I see around 78 psi with the standard spring. Before I had the higher-pressure spring in it and was seeing over 90 psi at wot but thought that was a little bit essive so I put the standard spring back in it. Another thing I would consider doing is CFD's bolt in crossmember method so you can get the oil pan off without pulling the subframe not unless you want to take a chance with a possibly leaking oil pan gasket doing it the other way by lowering the pan and fiddling with the bolt that one bolt that bolts the pick up tube under the pump.