Longevity and reliability with Turbos or superchargers?

[1KillerSS]

I posted this in the V6 forum on accident so this is a double posting. Sorry to those that have come across this again.


I have seen many threads like this one. yet Nobody has every asked which aftermarket FI system is better in terms of reliability.

I am having a really hard time making up my mind between the ECS SC, and AGP's TT kit. I do not want to turn this into a thread full of people are telling me to go roots style SC, or IPS over AGP or whipple over ECS....yadda yadda yadda....Actually let me say that again, the hard part for me is Super charged VS turbo charged. And I am three weeks away from pulling the trigger on one of them.

I know a lot of people have gone from SC to turbo and I would love to hear from them as to why they did i and what they think of it now. I am not so concerned about the money although with my current mods the SC is a lot cheaper for me.

So I love them both, and I am former grease monkey have worked on both SC and Turbo cars, I still cant decide. I think turbos on a big V8 would be awesome, I also really enjoy the boost on demand that a supercharger offers.

I have decided that because I really am not using money as a deciding factor, I am fortunate that I can at the moment afford which ever one I chose, and I love them both.

Maybe I should look at this in terms of long term reliability? Which system could I get the most longevity out of? In the long run will turbos cause me more problems than good? Will one be harder on the engine than the other system? My driving styles are pretty aggressive and I plan on taking it to the track once I get the work all finished up, My target for HP is between 680 and 720 at the wheels. Both systems are capable of that kind of power. so again its a matter of deciding for me. Please help!


Thanks a lot for reading.

[dreksnot]

Will be interesting to see the comments. Subscribed.

[Bo White]

I've put 30k miles on mine in a year and the blower was put on about 10k miles previous to me buying the car.

[Unreal]

I would say they are equal. Both, If installed and maintained properly will have a nice long life. I've had an ECS kit on my car now for 15k miles, and friend has had AGP kit for almost 30k. My car is a vette, but same basic setup. At first it would toss belts, and went through 3-4 belts, but other than that, it has been decent. The only added up keep to the blower system is maintain belt/tensioner, and swap blower oil if you run a self contained. Turbos have really no added maintenance.

(full disclosure, I did have my blower fail, $700 to rebuilt it and back up going again, but that isn't that common). 4-5 belts have also gone through, 1 idler, and 1 tensioner. Then again, I don't believe that is common, and any blower setup can have those issues, especially when pushed.

Main thing I hear from people who go to turbos from a blower are the added low/mid range torque, and the adjustability is great. Having boost on a dial, from 500-800rwhp is a nice advantage. Plus the mid range can be 200+rwhp more from 3-5k on the graphs I've seen.

In the end, they are both great kits. You have it narrowed down to the best Centri kit and the best turbo kit (IMO). At those power levels both should be perfectly reliable. Now if you want to turn it up and make 850+ then I would actually give the nod towards turbos for over reliability. Not only the system, but on the motor. Remember it is taking 50-70rwhp to spin the blower, so 800rwhp on a turbo setup is ~850-870rwhp on a blower setup as far as stress on the motor/pistons/rods. Also as you push the blowers harder and harder, you get more belt issues/etc.

I can't see how blower is a lot cheaper. If you sell your CAI, Headers, scoop you gain a lot of money back. Plus you can keep and use the UD pulley with the turbos, not sure if you can keep that with the blower. May need to swap back to stock for the blower. Plus for the power goals you have, remember to check on injectors/fuel/etc. I know the AGP kit has made 700-800rwhp time and time again on the fuel system it ships with. They do 80lb injectors up front which saves you from upgrading later.

[H-E]

Out of those 2 i would go AGP, great product with great support with a strong company behind it, that means alot down the road.I think i would enjoy never having belt and tension issues lol

[sprayedv]

Depends how on s/c belt size and how much you will be pushing turbos.

On a mild/safe setup with proper maintenance both will last as long as your car lasts.

[AGP Turbo]

Well you have narrowed it down to the best two options for sure. Pretty much what Unreal said. Having the turbos stronger midrange can be very significant improvement in situations where you go from spinning to hooking up and the engine bogs down to an RPM that the blower only has half boost but the turbos are full on. And it is worth noting that our intercooler is a noticable upgrade to the ECS kit. We've sold a few and on higher boost we are dropping IAT's 80f.

As for longevity and reliability I would say down at like 10-12psi they are both really trouble free. The biggest thing that would stick out there is I assume you'd run headers with the centri and that comes with it's own issues. Hard to change plugs, burnt plug wires, leaks. Our system runs stock manifolds and makes more power with them.

But then the more boost you run on both systems, I think the supercharger as a system becomes less reliable. Turbos honestly don't care at all 10psi vs. 25psi. The sport compact guys run turbos at 25psi daily and 35psi at the track, all the time. Diesel trucks run 30+psi all the time and go hundreds of thousands of miles without issue. Find me a supercharger doing that. What OEM uses a supercharger over 15psi? Doesn't happen. The belt and tensioner issues and load on the bearings when you run a tensioner tight enough to get 20psi = problems. It would honestly be interesting to see if anyone has ever got even 50,000 miles without issue on a 20+psi supercharger set-up. From what I've seen that's likely 5 belts, 5 sets of plug wires, two tensioners and supercharger has been rebuilt or needs it.

[dreksnot]

Will one be harder on the engine than the other system? My driving styles are pretty aggressive and I plan on taking it to the track once I get the work all finished up, My target for HP is between 680 and 720 at the wheels.

Like Unreal mentioned, the turbos will be "easier" on the engine and the rest of the driveline. TTs are spun by exhaust, SC by belt. Exhaust doesn't require tensioner, belt or self contained lubricating oil (less maintenance and cost).

You say you drive aggressively. The SC has instant torque at the press of the throttle. That will be harder on your driveline - the instant power hitting the components. The TT will ramp up power and a boost controller can establish max boost. These are different styles of power delivery but you get use to either (whichever one you have).

Your RWHP target is easier to hit with TT. The power adder mods you have now will nicely compliment a SC add though.

I've ran with SC guys. They seem to be constantly breaking stuff (aftermarket HD axles, pulleys). It's the cost of running hard and fast. Pick your poison. After a year of running my TT at my RWHP, I have yet to break something (knock on wood). I've hit the 1/4-mile track lots of times last season (it's snowing here today), mostly with DRs (albeit stock clutch, gears and diff).

[1KillerSS]

Thanks a lot you guys, great feedback!

@ unreal the sc is cheaper for me based on my supporting mods.

I won't go Into pricing here but the ECS setup with alky id850's and BAP is a lot less expensive than the TT option.

However like I said this decision will not be based on startup build costs. Thanks everybody keep posting!

[PlatinumIce]

I will definitely be watching this post as I am interested in what everyone has to say because I have already order everything to SC my car. And I am hoping it will last a while as I won't do much racing but adding lots of HP's.

[Unreal]

If you already ordered everything then it is kind of too late?

Any of the systems (AGP, ECS, Maggie, SLP, Whipple, Eforce, Vortech) should be nice and reliable out of the box. It is when you start turning them up and pushing them that the differences show and issues pop up. Some have much lower limits (as far as belt issues, etc) but when it comes to the motor, it basically doesn't matter. They are all decent.

[PlatinumIce]

Originally Posted by Unreal

If you already ordered everything then it is kind of too late?

Any of the systems (AGP, ECS, Maggie, SLP, Whipple, Eforce, Vortech) should be nice and reliable out of the box. It is when you start turning them up and pushing them that the differences show and issues pop up. Some have much lower limits (as far as belt issues, etc) but when it comes to the motor, it basically doesn't matter. They are all decent.

Might be late, but if I need to change something or do something to help at least I might get some more information out from the thread.

[SSeniorMoment]

This thread comes at the right time for me. The only turbos that I have experience with is the Holstat <sp?> on my Cummins pickup.

I've been debating between building a stroker vs TT and have estimates for both from my builder. The more I research this, the more I'm leaning toward the TTs.

I have LTs, but still have OEM exhaust manifold. Do the AFM lifters and VVT need to be changed out? Stall? Half shafts?

[Unreal]

Nothing does, if you don't want to. Plenty of TT cars making 700rwhp on stock AFM, VVT, stall. Half shafts just depend on sticky tires, racing, and power you want. They don't care if you make 500rwhp on a stroker or 500rwhp on turbos.

Swing by AGP and check out the kits. Since you are in AZ it seems like a no brainer.