Upgrading the Radiator

[camaro500]

Hello fellow members,

I was just wondering if it is worth upgrading the radiator on my 2013 SS at the same time of the cam install?

[Synner]

If you track it yes, otherwise not really.

[Camaro Dude]

Originally Posted by Synner

If you track it yes, otherwise not really.

Wouldn't which climate you race in play a role as well?

Same old dilemma on other car forums as well.

Case in point, none of the BMW crowd here ever upgraded their radiators when road racing in MT. Tremblent, but a few hard core BMW club member and racers in North Carolina would.

Race in stock form, 60% distilled water, 40% OEM coolant, add 1 bottle WatterWetter, then record your temps, and take it from there.

In light of where Camaro500 lives, I highly doubt he will have to upgrade, unless his L99, AC equipped car runs a tad hotter than a LS3??(I don't know I'm asking).

[JDP Sales]

I'd say if you're tracking the car it would be beneficial regardless. If you live in a really cool area, then you may be fine, but the factory radiator is quite small and most aftermarket radiators are about double the size.

Best regards,

Tyler
888-308-6007

[GONIF]

Here in Phoenix it is hot as hell in the summer and just hot the rest of the year and on the street the factory rad works . How ever if you are going to run it on a track ,in any climate it would be a benefit to upgrade the rad . And a Chevy is not a BMW. My 1LE runs 220 to 230 oil temp in the summer ,so I would not track it with the stock rad .

[Synner]

Originally Posted by Camaro Dude

Wouldn't which climate you race in play a role as well?

Not really, we have morbidly obese cars and a big V8, if you're going fast things will get hot. These cars are in dire need of larger cooling systems for track use.

[Camaro Dude]

Ok then, fair enough.

I think from a scientific perspective (since we are dealing with temperatures here after all), I must ask this question, to help out the OP here ultimately come to a conclusion on how to proceed with said possible mod.

What would be the target coolant temperature to be looking for, the threshold if you will, where one must then conclude that's it's time to upgrade radiators? Is it 97C? 100C?? 120??

Surely, the OP can't be expected to just blindly upgrade, without jotting down some data collected from an actual track day event first?

[J-vette]

Why not just install a 160* t-stat. Or program the fans to come on sooner.

[bowtienick]

I use 160 state and ran flat out for miles no problem wit temps. 178 water 244 oil.

[tadams72]

Outside influences definitely play a part in your engine temps and subsequent health. I've run Spring Mountain (20 minute sessions) in 50 degree (F) and in 100 degree temps. My car was running intake, cam, LT's, tune, and 160 thermostat. All with a stock radiator. The coolant temps at the end of those sessions were 220's on the cool days and high 240's on the hot days. Engine oil temps were 250's and 290's respectively. Bottom line, anything you can do to cool the engine is going to build power and prolong life. A larger radiator is a great addition to the cooling puzzle but one should not over look the cooling effects of oil as well. Use of an oil cooler will help immensely. Furthermore, oil cooling of the internal components has proven to be MORE effective than traditional water-based "coolant". There is a reason you see oil coolers on high performance engines and there is a reason you see piston oil squirters on turbo charged diesels and now on supercharged engines like the LSA and LS9.

[Camaro Dude]

The oil cooler upgrade is a most excellent point!!

When I stroked and turbo charged my previous BMW ride, I kept the radiator stock(as in original one installed from assembly line, that lasted me 400000km!) but upgrading the oil cooler to a much more efficient unit was an absolute must to include in my "budget minded" build.

The "4 season" coolant thermostat also was ditched in favour for for one used from the parts bin in the Arab countries, since it was, a summer only car .

Now, I'm new in the LS3/L99 arena, so I'll just sit back and listen here to other peoples testimony, as I too, like the OP, are learning about the base line capabilities of these engines in stock guise.

[Camaro Dude]

Well it looks like even track bred Z28 suffers from exceedingly high oil temperatures according to today's forum home page Z28 vs world test. Here is a quote from that article I copy and pasted below.

This is a hot romance in the making—but then it gets too hot. Although ambient temperature is barely in the 80s, three hard laps are enough to send the Camaro's oil temperature around the dial and beyond the 300-degree mark.

"Unacceptable in any high-performance street car," Cammisa gripes, "especially one with this much track capability." The Aston and Nissan have been getting hot, but not like this. It's a reminder that the Z/28 is fundamentally a development beyond what was originally intended for the Camaro platform.

[Camaro Dude]

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=383352

[Synner]

Originally Posted by Camaro Dude

Ok then, fair enough.

I think from a scientific perspective (since we are dealing with temperatures here after all), I must ask this question, to help out the OP here ultimately come to a conclusion on how to proceed with said possible mod.

What would be the target coolant temperature to be looking for, the threshold if you will, where one must then conclude that's it's time to upgrade radiators? Is it 97C? 100C?? 120??

Surely, the OP can't be expected to just blindly upgrade, without jotting down some data collected from an actual track day event first?

I and many others have posted the numbers in many threads in the tracking and 1le subforums, I'm not making the need up. It's been an issue from day 1 with camaros run at the track.

Because you didn't know of the issue doesn't mean I'm telling people to blindly upgrade. And the OP never even came back to the thread to discuss his intended use for the car so I don't see a need to provide clarifications to questions that he never asked. He can look for a number of threads on the topic, he's not the first person to run at a track so other peoples, including mine, real world experience is what I was basing it on.