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Old 05-21-2013, 03:38 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by Michael2000 View Post
I don't hate change. In fact, I like change...for the better. I just hate things that are poorly engineered, don't work, and are not a help. In addition, if I want my cars to drive for me, I would get automatics. At the minimum, so called "helpers" should be user selectable.

I don't see the Corvette with this.

When I see stuff like this, and gauges you can't even see past the steering wheel or shifter, I have to wonder who is running the Camaro show over there. We're talking driving basics here.

Michael
I will say I was disappointed about the 1SS cars not having the gauge pack until I sat in a car and could not see them, so I get your point. As far as the HSA goes, it seems to effect some folks more than others, so certain driving styles are going to almost never bring conflict. As dropspeed said, his throttle / clutch transition led to no problems with HSA. Others have either stalled the car or done a mini burnout. The same seems to go for the skip shift feature. As I mentioned above, unless it is drastically different than what was on the WS-6, I will hardly even notice it is there. My driving style very, very seldom ever caused it to engage on the old car, and I drove it for over 10 years.

I really look forward to trying these "helpers" and seeing if their benefits (HSA - reduced clutch wear when taking off on a steep hill, and increases fuel economy with skip shift) are outweighed by their annoyance.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:26 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by gajagfan View Post
I will say I was disappointed about the 1SS cars not having the gauge pack until I sat in a car and could not see them, so I get your point. As far as the HSA goes, it seems to effect some folks more than others, so certain driving styles are going to almost never bring conflict. As dropspeed said, his throttle / clutch transition led to no problems with HSA. Others have either stalled the car or done a mini burnout. The same seems to go for the skip shift feature. As I mentioned above, unless it is drastically different than what was on the WS-6, I will hardly even notice it is there. My driving style very, very seldom ever caused it to engage on the old car, and I drove it for over 10 years.

I really look forward to trying these "helpers" and seeing if their benefits (HSA - reduced clutch wear when taking off on a steep hill, and increases fuel economy with skip shift) are outweighed by their annoyance.

Pretty sure he's talking about not being able to see half the speedo & tach as the auxilary cluster is easily visible.

And all these helpers are anything but actual helpers. Anyone that can drive a manual worth a damn doesn't need HSA. And lugging a car in 4th gear at 10mph is far from fuel conserving.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:38 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by Cody6.2 View Post
Pretty sure he's talking about not being able to see half the speedo & tach as the auxilary cluster is easily visible.

And all these helpers are anything but actual helpers. Anyone that can drive a manual worth a damn doesn't need HSA. And lugging a car in 4th gear at 10mph is far from fuel conserving.
Well I can't see the aux cluster when I sit in a car with them, so that is why I thought that was what he meant. I am a bit taller than some, and sit relatively close to the wheel, so it may be more me. I have not noticed not being able to see the spedo / tach, but only have driven these new Camaros a small amount. The skip shift, as I was told with my WS-6, was part of how GM got the cars to have a better rating fuel economy wise, but I guess I never was shifting out of first gear at 10 mph or less. And I am pretty confident in my manual driving, as I am sure many others are also, but it takes more throttle when you are starting from a stop up a steep hill then it does on flat ground because the load on the vehicle is greater, and that increased RPM exposes the clutch to more slipping before it is fully engaged, so if you use this system, it should help reduce clutch wear. Just my thoughts. I agree that making it optional might have been the best solution, and I may hate it a ton once I get our car. I simply thought it was encouraging that someone (dropspeed) has found that it causes him no problems. To each his own!

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Old 05-21-2013, 09:00 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by Cody6.2 View Post
Pretty sure he's talking about not being able to see half the speedo & tach as the auxilary cluster is easily .
I can not see, nor did I like the placement of the aux gauges in the 2013 with the New MYlink radio as the HVAC controls now hang lower on the IP.

I do agree with the wheel blocking the view of the tach and speedo in my seating position. However, on the street I use the center display to display the speed/MPH and listen to the motor when winding her out. At the track the MPH is not important so I will use the center display for coolant temps. ( wish it had oil pressure or oil temps reading out on the center display as well)

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Old 05-21-2013, 11:56 AM   #117
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Funny thing is, It would not be a problem if it worked as it is described in the manual:
"The brakes will automatically release when the accelerator pedal is applied within the two-second window."

This does not work! It will remain engaged for the whole 2 seconds. I've rev'ed mine up almost to 4k RPM on a start and It will not disengage until the 2 seconds are up.

So, if we were able to turn it on or off with a switch OR if it worked like the manual described this would not show up so much in the forum...
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Old 05-21-2013, 12:33 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by Ehmsea View Post
Funny thing is, It would not be a problem if it worked as it is described in the manual:
"The brakes will automatically release when the accelerator pedal is applied within the two-second window."

This does not work! It will remain engaged for the whole 2 seconds. I've rev'ed mine up almost to 4k RPM on a start and It will not disengage until the 2 seconds are up.

So, if we were able to turn it on or off with a switch OR if it worked like the manual described this would not show up so much in the forum...
Same here!! I can give it all the gas I want and the darn thing will not release until the full 2 seconds has transpired!

It seems the 2 second time parameter trumps the accelerator movement parameter.

Perhaps we all have a bunch of mediocre/faulty Throttle Position Sensors?

I could live with it IF it worked as described in the owner's manual.
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Old 05-21-2013, 01:41 PM   #119
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Same here!! I can give it all the gas I want and the darn thing will not release until the full 2 seconds has transpired!

It seems the 2 second time parameter trumps the accelerator movement parameter.

Perhaps we all have a bunch of mediocre/faulty Throttle Position Sensors?

I could live with it IF it worked as described in the owner's manual.
I thought Dropspeed said that it took simultaneous throttle and clutch movement to have the HSA shut off?
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:02 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by gajagfan View Post
I thought Dropspeed said that it took simultaneous throttle and clutch movement to have the HSA shut off?
That is how it worked for me in my car

As an experiment I will go to the same store/inclined parking tonight and try a couple different things to see what happens...I will report my findings later tonight!

I will try 3 things once I see HSA is activated

1) Step on the gas and release the clutch at the same time
2) Step on the gas without releasing the clutch
3) Start to release the clutch without stepping on the gas.

Matt
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:05 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by Dropspeed View Post
That is how it worked for me in my car

As an experiment I will go to the same store/inclined parking tonight and try a couple different things to see what happens...I will report my findings later tonight!

I will try 3 things once I see HSA is activated

1) Step on the gas and release the clutch at the same time
2) Step on the gas without releasing the clutch
3) Start to release the clutch without stepping on the gas.

Matt
Like I said, I have a feeling sequence 3 is why people are having issues with HSA.
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:16 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by Dropspeed View Post
That is how it worked for me in my car

As an experiment I will go to the same store/inclined parking tonight and try a couple different things to see what happens...I will report my findings later tonight!

I will try 3 things once I see HSA is activated

1) Step on the gas and release the clutch at the same time
2) Step on the gas without releasing the clutch
3) Start to release the clutch without stepping on the gas.

Matt
Make sure that when you test this, you apply significant brake-pressure when stopping on the hill. Otherwise the results may be skewed if you are merely overcoming the brake pressure, rather than HSA actually releasing.

My parking lot is on an incline too, and the 2 second timer seems to trump any variation of clutch and gas timing.
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:37 PM   #123
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Do all 2013's with a manual have this feature or is it only standard on 2LT / 2SS?
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Old 05-21-2013, 03:05 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by gajagfan View Post
I thought Dropspeed said that it took simultaneous throttle and clutch movement to have the HSA shut off?
Tried it in my inclined gravel driveway many times. I give it gas while moving the clutch and it will just sit there until the 2 second timer releases the brakes. Then off I go spewing gravel behind me.

I've driven manual shifts cars for many years and have never fought a car on an incline like I fight this one. I am now using the handbrake to turn on the brake light which releases the HSA so I can take off smoothly on an incline.

I can't believe that many of us who have driven manual cars for years are suddenly feeling like newbies....because we're doing it wrong? I don't think so.
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Old 05-21-2013, 04:33 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by SSRS1LE View Post
Make sure that when you test this, you apply significant brake-pressure when stopping on the hill. Otherwise the results may be skewed if you are merely overcoming the brake pressure, rather than HSA actually releasing.

My parking lot is on an incline too, and the 2 second timer seems to trump any variation of clutch and gas timing.
He should be able to tell because HSA is displayed in the DIC or somewhere on the dash, correct?
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Old 05-21-2013, 04:34 PM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dropspeed View Post
That is how it worked for me in my car

As an experiment I will go to the same store/inclined parking tonight and try a couple different things to see what happens...I will report my findings later tonight!

I will try 3 things once I see HSA is activated

1) Step on the gas and release the clutch at the same time
2) Step on the gas without releasing the clutch
3) Start to release the clutch without stepping on the gas.

Matt
Thanks for doing this. I am still without a car, but feel like we may be finding the proper technique that will make this much less of a headache! I look forward to your test results.
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