07-24-2011, 06:52 PM | #673 |
Use the Force
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They will but, it will be called Z28.
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Walk softly, carry a light saber and drive a ZL1!
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07-24-2011, 06:58 PM | #674 |
Use the Force
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I found Ligenfelter's S/C LS7 but not a NA LS7 2010/11 Camaro.
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Walk softly, carry a light saber and drive a ZL1!
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07-24-2011, 07:50 PM | #675 | |
Downright Upright
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"Conservative"...does that mean they err on the side of "quality AND safety first and foremost"...or does that mean "we'll do it if/when we get around to it"? An example: The "Heritage Grille" and "21-inch wheels" first seen on the "Dale Earnhardt Jr. Concept" @ SEMA '08. We contracted the same Tier supplier to built an "exact duplicate" of that car. A couple of problems arose. The Heritage Grille finally arrived in FEB/10...and the exact 21s are still MIA, after countless assurances they'd be available in "2nd 1/4"...then "3rd 1/4"...then "4th 1/4" 2010. These assurances came from GM Parts...direct...in Grand Blanc. We're now in 3rd 1/4 '11...good thing we substituted the SLP 20" versions and delivered the car only ONE YEAR after initial order... As I mentioned in my initial post, certification and validation takes time. "Others" have assigned "specs" that MUST BE MET. Wheel specs are NOT new, or news, to Tier suppliers. Neither is "testing". It's not the first time GM would go to an existing Tier supplier, ask for something specific to be built to a very specific set of criteria (be they SAE or otherwise), expecting a timely result with a proper product that passes timely testing...and coordinate that product's availability through their existing Parts system. But 16+ months for an Accessory GRILLE...and the still-missing "promised" WHEELS after almost 3 YEARS? Simply two examples... Is this a case of "priorities", or "changing markets"...or benign neglect? "Someone" ain't "minding the store"...and this is literally costing GM million$... ...and NO, this is NOT intended to put ANYONE on the spot. But it IS, in the very least, puzzling AND frustrating. From a consumer's point of view as well as a supplier's point of view. |
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07-24-2011, 07:54 PM | #676 |
Moderator.ca
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I doubt the LSA will make it to the 6th gen too. But thats only because I expect the entire gen IV family of engines to be dead by that time. When the gen V engines come, I fully expect to see a forced induction variant of their mainstream performance V8 for use in their top tier performance cars, replacing both the LSA and LS9.
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__________________ Originally Posted by FbodFather My sister's dentist's brother's cousin's housekeeper's dog-breeder's nephew sells coffee filters to the company that provides coffee to General Motors...... ........and HE WOULD KNOW!!!!__________________ Camaro Fest sub-forum |
07-24-2011, 08:19 PM | #677 | |
Downright Upright
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The LS7, as found in the crate, is dry-sumped. "Packaging problems" ensue. Forget the weight penalty. Forget the ultimate vehicle dynamics. There WERE discussions, direct with GM PP, to do ONE LS7-powered Camaro, late '09, but the outside development funding di$appeared before the project started. Had that project borne the fruit that was expected, there would already be a "ZEE" in the marketplace...!!! And, although he is personally unaware of this specific project, Pete would have been involved...along with a particular "outsourced" Pedder's-friendly and -inclined GM chassis engineer... Ergo, my particular, and specific, passion for this car... "Close...but no cigar..." |
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07-24-2011, 08:43 PM | #678 |
Too Many Great Choices
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07-25-2011, 04:21 AM | #679 |
juggernaut
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I had found one made by ADM but the more I looked into it. some had just taken a couple LS7 eng covers and slapped them on the ls3. oh well. there are a lot of ls7 2010 camaros, just none are stock. I found one with 561 hp but had full exhaust and cam. . .but they are on there.
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07-25-2011, 09:35 AM | #680 |
Downright Upright
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According to Automotive News, via gminsidenews.com, the Gen-5 Camaro appears essentially untouched through MY 2014.
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f...2014-a-104659/ That would appear to allow something between 18-24 months "available" for a Gen-5 Camaro Z/28, if you give the ZL1 a 6-12 month "head start". Keep in mind Ford stated the BOSS was a 2-MY build, only... |
07-25-2011, 05:45 PM | #681 | |||
Hail to the King baby!
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It's almost like we are listening to one of those tribute albums.................but instead of a bunch of groups covering various songs, this is a bunch of groups doing a cover of the same song.................."Give me #$%^&ing Z28 now!" Quote:
This seems like a lot of trouble for 44 HP. Honestly not sure which is less work............tweaking an LS3 or this all new beast. But now you have to ask where would you build this? The only 427 tooling is in Wixom for hand building. If you build it in Wixom, you save a bunch on exotic parts, but still have the expense of a low volume engine assembly.
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07-25-2011, 06:19 PM | #682 |
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07-25-2011, 09:51 PM | #683 | |
Too Many Great Choices
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Quote:
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07-26-2011, 08:55 AM | #684 |
Downright Upright
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Number 3, without delving deeply into the "whys" and the "wherefores" of Production Engine development, a perusal of GM PP's LS3+ crate engines (which are NOT "Production Engines") reveals one interesting tidbit...fuel requirements. The LS3-480 hp requires 92-octane giz-o-line which, if I'm not mistaken, is NOT available in the Golden State of California. I dare say CA's potential sales would be deemed "important" to any "business case".
Add in the LS3's 6600 rpm limits because of their powdered rods and nodular cranks and you arrive at a conclusion that they are inherently inferior to the metallurgy and engineering present in the LS7, not as rev-able...and NOT as "mystical" as a "427 Camaro". The LS7, at 505 hp, is a starting point for those interested in "more". Clearly, these engines (limited by their hypereutectic pistons) are capable of "more"...much more... Specs follow, as per GM PP (http://www.gmperformanceparts.com/Pa...jsp?engine=2): LS 376/480: Block (P/N 12584727): Cast Aluminum with 6-bolt, cross-bolted main caps Bore x Stroke (in): 4.06 x 3.62 (103.25 x 92mm) Camshaft duration (@.050 in): 219 degree intake / 228 degree exhaust Camshaft type (P/N 88958733): Hydraulic roller Compression ratio: 10.7:1 Connecting rods (P/N 12617570): Powdered metal Crankshaft (P/N 12597569): Nodular Cylinder heads (P/N 12598594): LS3 rectangle port; as cast with 68cc chambers Displacement (cu in): 376 cu in (6.2L) Maximum recommended RPM: 6600 Recommended fuel: 92 octane Valve lift (in): .525" intake / .525" exhaust Valve size (in): 2.16 int / 1.59 exhaust LS7/505: Block Part Number (17802854): Cast aluminum w/6-bolt steel main bearing caps Bore x Stroke (in): 4.125 x 4.00 (104.8 mm x 101.6 mm) Camshaft Duration: 211 degree intake / 230 degree exhaust Camshaft lift (in): .591" (15 mm) Intake and Exhaust Camshaft Part Number: P/N 12571251 Camshaft type: Hydraulic roller Compression ratio: 11.0:1 Connecting rods Type: Forged titanium Crankshaft Part Number 12568819: Forged steel Cylinder head Part Number: 12578450 Cylinder head Type: CNC Ported LS7 specific pattern 70 cc CNC combustion chambers Displacement (cu in): 427 (7.0L) Maximum rpm: 7000 Pistons Type: Hypereutectic aluminum Recommended fuel: 91 octane Valve size (in): 2.20" titanium intake, 1.61" sodium filled exhaust For those potentially offended by the thoughts (and price) of an LS7-engined 427 Z/28, well, we'll just call it a "COPO"... |
07-26-2011, 09:12 AM | #685 |
Too Many Great Choices
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I really really want a 5Gen LS7 Z28...BAD!
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07-26-2011, 09:25 AM | #686 |
Downright Upright
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700 hp z/28 in 2014, the greatest camaro |
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